Ark Pak - Questions and Queries

[AndrewP]

Both the inverter was off and the isolator switch in the off position. The battery was brand new and fully charged when I unplugged the ArPak for a trip. I'll have the battery tested but does not explain why the battery drained while connected to the ArkPak.

Sounds like a parasitic drain. Can you measure the current draw with your meter?

 

[Brett From Ark]

Do you mind explaining this reversed polarity comment?

Cheers

Hi Andrew P

to follow up on your question about reverse polarity in relation to a deeply discharged battery please read the below


when a battery is discharged below 10.5 volts there is a very high chance is will be suffer from sulfation, what is sulfation it refers to the process whereby a lead-acid battery loses its ability to hold a charge after it is kept in a discharged state too long due to the crystallization of lead sulfate.

when you put the battery back on charge to attempt to see if the battery can be recovered from this deeply discharged state this is when the reverse polarity can occur.

if you have any more questions please ask.

Regards

Brett from Ark

 

[Brett From Ark]

Both the inverter was off and the isolator switch in the off position. The battery was brand new and fully charged when I unplugged the ArPak for a trip. I'll have the battery tested but does not explain why the battery drained while connected to the ArkPak.

Hi Mike

thanks for replying with additional information, if you are correct with your information then it is not possible for the inverter to back drain power from the battery if the isolator is in the off position.

even taking it to the extreme and say the isolator is not working the inverter only draws approx 5 watts of power which equals approx 0.42 amps you would have to have the battery left off charge for more then 12 days for it to have any negative affect on the battery.

you can do a check and test to see if the isolator is working correctly you simply turn the isolator on plug an item into one of the cig sockets at the front and make sure its turned on you then turn the isolator to the off position and the item should power down if the isolator is working correctly.

as mentioned please keep me posted on the out come of the load test you get done and dont forget to ask for a copy of the load test report you may need this if you need to for a warranty on the battery.

Regards

Brett from Ark

 

[Brett From Ark]

Not answering for Brett from Ark mind you,,, & being sort of oldschool when it comes to electro dohickys of the past 20 years or so.

I had cell of a battery become reverse polarity, But never an entire battery.
But its possible an entire battery could be reversed if its part of a series of batteries or gets charged in a reversed condition.

It occurs when a cell of a series depleats before its companions.

Partly the reason its always suggested to replace batteries of the same type, age & etc.

Hi Verkstad

Thank you for the very informative answer on reverse polarity.

if any one feels they can help out or provide sound advice to people who follow this thread then i encourage them to pass on this information.

thank you for your answer and also personal experience when it comes to reverse polarity of a 12 volt battery.

Regards

Brett from Ark

 

[Brett From Ark]

Sounds like a parasitic drain. Can you measure the current draw with your meter?

Hi AndrewP

this is a great suggestion about parasitic drain or other wise known as a back drain, i have given mike (Mep1811) some additional information to check if his isolator is working correctly.

a parasitic back drain can occur if you leave the isolator in the on position and also leave the inverter on as well, i can confirm the back drain is approx 5 watts which converts to approx 0.42 amps.

If the inverter was the cause of the parasitic back drain it would need to be left un checked for approx 12 days straight to have any negative affect on the battery voltage.

thank you for your input and helpful trouble shooting support.

this is another reason why i encourage people to give each other helpful hints and tips.

Regards

Brett from Ark

 

[mep1811]

I tested the isolator and it works as it should. As for the battery test I've been experimenting with charging up the Arkpak with my solar panel. Once the battery is charged I'll have it tested.

 

[AndrewP]

I'd like to know what the drain is with the whole system hooked up. You can disconnect all the negative wires, and then check the current between the negative post of the battery and the wire bundle. It should be basically zero and if not you need to isolate the wires and check where the load actually is.

Now a flooded lead acid battery has a small internal drain and will slowly discharge on it's own, though your experience seems too fast for that.

You need a Battery Minder or something similar to keep it at float charge. I'm surprised that isn't included in this kit.

edit: I looked up the Ark Pak - It says it has a 7 stage (that sounds like marketing gibberish) charger-maybe it wasn't plugged in? It still should not discharge fully in a month.

 

[mep1811]

I'd like to know what the drain is with the whole system hooked up. You can disconnect all the negative wires, and then check the current between the negative post of the battery and the wire bundle. It should be basically zero and if not you need to isolate the wires and check where the load actually is.

Now a flooded lead acid battery has a small internal drain and will slowly discharge on it's own, though your experience seems too fast for that.

You need a Battery Minder or something similar to keep it at float charge. I'm surprised that isn't included in this kit.

Is it normal for the battery in the ArkPak to discharge when not being used or plugged in? The switch was in the off position.

After a month, the battery voltage was down to 9.7 volts. If this is the case this is not a good backup battery solution

 

[AndrewP]

Is it normal for the battery in the ArkPak to discharge when not being used or plugged in? The switch was in the off position.

After a month, the battery voltage was down to 9.7 volts. If this is the case this is not a good backup battery solution

I don't know anything about the ArkPak other than what i looked up just now on their site. I'm just thinking through how I would trouble shoot a battery in a box with electronics on board. Something drained the battery, and it's likely the on board electronics (just a guess, but the most likely scenario). I wonder if they all do this.

I'm thinking these should be left plugged in to float all the time, then if the power failed or you needed to toss it in a vehicle, it would be ready to go.

Now I'm curious, and I hope you will post up your findings.

Just as an aside, a modern car will drain the starting battery pretty quickly if not started. The clock, the computer electronics and the alarm are all constantly using battery power even when the car is off. This can easily be measured at the battery with a meter. I would assume the ArkPak is similar.

 

[Brett From Ark]

I tested the isolator and it works as it should. As for the battery test I've been experimenting with charging up the Arkpak with my solar panel. Once the battery is charged I'll have it tested.

Hi Mike

its great that you checked, please keep me updated on the results of your load test.

also i just wanted to confirm and mention that when the unit is not in use you should leave it plugged into a power point with the LCD screen left on this way the smart charging system will maintain your battery for you.

If you turn the LCD screen off then the smart charging system does not maintain your battery for you.

Regards

Brett from Ark

 

[Brett From Ark]

I'd like to know what the drain is with the whole system hooked up. You can disconnect all the negative wires, and then check the current between the negative post of the battery and the wire bundle. It should be basically zero and if not you need to isolate the wires and check where the load actually is.

Now a flooded lead acid battery has a small internal drain and will slowly discharge on it's own, though your experience seems too fast for that.

You need a Battery Minder or something similar to keep it at float charge. I'm surprised that isn't included in this kit.

edit: I looked up the Ark Pak - It says it has a 7 stage (that sounds like marketing gibberish) charger-maybe it wasn't plugged in? It still should not discharge fully in a month.

Hi Andrew

the Ark Pak is in fact a 7 stage smart charging system that maintains your battery for you, i can assure you that it will maintain your battery for you when not in use and it is not gibberish at all.

on average a standard lead acid battery can loose 0.1 volts for every week it is not on charge. as for the Ark pak smart charging system the LCD screen needs to be on and plugged into a power point for the smart charging system to maintain your battery when it is not in use.

if you have the power point plugged in and turned on but the LCD screen is off then the smart charging system will not maintain the battery.

i hope this additional information has helped you.

Regards

Brett from Ark

 

[Brett From Ark]

Is it normal for the battery in the ArkPak to discharge when not being used or plugged in? The switch was in the off position.

After a month, the battery voltage was down to 9.7 volts. If this is the case this is not a good backup battery solution

HI Mike

as i explained in an earlier post a normal lead acid battery that is not on charge will loose approx 0.1 volt for every week it is not on charge.

Also i strongly recommend all Ark pak users to maintain there battery when it is not in use this is done by plugging the home charger into the wall with power turn on then also ensuring your LCD screen is on this way the smart charger will maintain your battery for you and ensure it is kept in peak condition.

by not doing this you reduce your batteries life dramatically.

some additional information which i have already given is 12.6 volts or more a battery is 100%, 10.8 volts a battery is 0% and if you go below 10.5 volts then this is a kill zone for a battery and it can become sulfated a brief explaination is listed below explaining sulfation.

Causes of battery sulfation:
Batteries sit too long between charges. As little as 24 hours in hot weather and several days in cooler weather.
Battery is stored without some type of energy input.
Undercharging of a battery to only 90% of capacity will allow sulfation of the battery using the 10% of battery chemistry not reactivated by not completing the charging cycle.
Low electrolyte level - battery plates exposed to air will immediately sulfate.
Incorrect charging levels and settings.
The longer a battery sits and is not re-charged the more damaging sulfation build up there may be on the plates.


as a side note follow up i can't understand why anyone would not want to maintain there battery, to get the most out of it. By ensuring the battery is maintained you are protecting and prolonging your investment in that battery, this is why i always stress to people who have an Ark Pak, the battery needs to be maintained and kept in peak condition, the Ark Pak is only as good as the battery you decide to put into it.


Regards

Brett from Ark

 

[mep1811]

The battery tested out good. There is no parasitic draw. The battery was in my truck as a backup power supply so it lt was not be plugged in. I know I did shut off LCD screen thinking it would be a draw on the battery.

 

[Brett From Ark]

The battery tested out good. There is no parasitic draw. The battery was in my truck as a backup power supply so it lt was not be plugged in. I know I did shut off LCD screen thinking it would be a draw on the battery.

Hi Mike

its good to hear the battery has accepted a charge and come back above 10.8 volts the best thing you can do moving forward is ensure you maintain the battery when its not in use for extended periods.

also please be aware that due to the deep discharge, the battery may not be in a position to run as long as it has before.

Regards

Brett from Ark

 

[Brett From Ark]

HI All

just a reminder about the Fathers Day sale there are some big savings on offer you can take advantage of



take care

Regards

Brett from Ark