Buying a Fuso canter 4x4

[wrightjd95]

Hello,

I'm currently designing an expedition vehicle build. I'm looking at buying a Fuso Canter as the base vehicle. I'm going to be based near Brisbane, there is a good amount of companies that use the FUSO canter and provide various upgrades such as parabolic suspension. Pre-built torsion-free subframes etc. That's why I'm leaning towards the FUSO.

Trouble is I have a limited budget so I'm going to have to get something older. Can anybody help out with a kind of buying guide for Fusos?

I managed to find a couple of old, '90s, and '00s models with very low mileage, as they were used as stand by vehicles, firetrucks, etc. Any word on these? I'm interested in information about transmissions as well as the engines?

Also, I'm considering an engine swap with Cummins 6bt? Has anybody tried this?

 

[gait]

welcome.

in general, the older the vehicle the less available are upgrades.

trivial example, the older vehicles have 5-stud wheels, newer 6-stud, which reduces the options for single rear wheels. Check the availability of parabolics for the specific model before buying it.

I have no idea but the cost of older vehicle plus engine swap may exceed the cost of a newer vehicle. Every bit of work takes time and money. I accepted that the Canter is a Japanese delivery truck, not designed for speed.

For whole project allow 1/3 of time for design, 1/3 for procurement, 1/3 for build. Anything from 18 months to 10 years. Complete engineering drawings generally not available for things that go inside, which may mean buying to measure. Standard water tanks are available but unlikely to fit.

 

[SkiFreak]

Anything from 18 months to 10 years.

?

 

[wrightjd95]

welcome.

in general, the older the vehicle the less available are upgrades.

I have no idea but the cost of older vehicle plus engine swap may exceed the cost of a newer vehicle. Every bit of work takes time and money. I accepted that the Canter is a Japanese delivery truck, not designed for speed.

For whole project allow 1/3 of time for design, 1/3 for procurement, 1/3 for build. Anything from 18 months to 10 years. Complete engineering drawings generally not available for things that go inside, which may mean buying to measure. Standard water tanks are available but unlikely to fit.

Thanks, good to know! What kind of year truck would you say is reasonable?

Ha, I smiled when you said 18 months to 10 years! Reminds me of a friend who's been working on the boat in his garage indefinitely!

I have welding skills, secondary machining, mechanical, electrical, fabrication, plumbing, etc. Budget is the biggest constraint and that's where I see the biggest hurdle! :/

 

[Karl of Oz]

I have to ask...what is your budget? you might be surprised at what you can get that's already been "done" properly.

I have found in life that often, modifications always lead to some other problem and you spend all your time and hard work solving things with good money going after bad. Sometimes its just better to pay up front for what you need/want (a proven design) and re-coup the money by working more in your own specific field. There are so many half built projects around.......

 

[Xtsix]

when buying an older fuso, be very careful about checking the frame for corrosion, unless you’re prepared to replace the frame like I

 

[dlh62c]

When doing an inspection look for snow plow mounts on the front.

 

[gait]

in Aus its more likely to have been used for fertiliser or other spraying than snow plough. But same clues about corrosion.

sometimes last bit of chassis cut off behind spring hangers to allow for spray tank fitting.

Including the big junction box near front towards left under the cab, all chassis to cab cables go through it with lots of connectors inside.

 

[wrightjd95]

Hello,

Sorry I've had a busy week! Thanks, everybody for the information, it's very helpful!

I've heard from a lot of people that the Isuzu NPS is a good platform too. Both the Canter and NPS seem very similar so I will buy whichever I manage to find in a better condition for the price.

Budget wise I'm looking to spend not more than 30K AUD on the base truck. 20k-30K is my target. The more money I spend on the truck the less I have for the build - so as usual, it's a compromise.

What are your thoughts on ex firetrucks? I have seen a lot of them for sale recently. They all seem to have very low mileage, like 30-50k. I imagine most of their life they are stand by vehicles. However, I noticed that the engine hours are quite high (I imagine that they sit with their engine running at the scene of the fire, powering the pumps etc?).

Okay, I'll pay a lot of attention to signs of corrosion!

Also, I have a question about the emissions laws on Australian trucks.... what are they? I noticed a lot of the older trucks do not have diesel particulate filters?

I have to ask...what is your budget? you might be surprised at what you can get that's already been "done" properly.

I have found in life that often, modifications always lead to some other problem and you spend all your time and hard work solving things with good money going after bad. Sometimes its just better to pay up front for what you need/want (a proven design) and re-coup the money by working more in your own specific field. There are so many half built projects around.......

What kind of things do you mean? I'd like to know more!

Cheers,

James

 

[SkiFreak]

The SOP at a fire is that the truck's engine is never switched off, allowing for a speedy get away if required.
So engine hours will always be higher on ex RFS trucks because of this.
On a Fuso, only the current model (FGB71) has a DPF. On the previous model (FG84) there is an EGR. Models older than those have no EGR or DPF.
Not 100% on the Isuzu, but i do know that the current model does not have a DPF, but some earlier models do.

 

[Karl of Oz]

Hello,

Sorry I've had a busy week! Thanks, everybody for the information, it's very helpful!

I've heard from a lot of people that the Isuzu NPS is a good platform too. Both the Canter and NPS seem very similar so I will buy whichever I manage to find in a better condition for the price.

Budget wise I'm looking to spend not more than 30K AUD on the base truck. 20k-30K is my target. The more money I spend on the truck the less I have for the build - so as usual, it's a compromise.

What are your thoughts on ex firetrucks? I have seen a lot of them for sale recently. They all seem to have very low mileage, like 30-50k. I imagine most of their life they are stand by vehicles. However, I noticed that the engine hours are quite high (I imagine that they sit with their engine running at the scene of the fire, powering the pumps etc?).

Okay, I'll pay a lot of attention to signs of corrosion!

Also, I have a question about the emissions laws on Australian trucks.... what are they? I noticed a lot of the older trucks do not have diesel particulate filters?




What kind of things do you mean? I'd like to know more!

Cheers,

James

Hi James...."what do I mean"?....where do I start....I heavily modified a Ducati 900 many years ago, but with every increase in power came another problem to solve, the clutch couldn't take it, the cush drive that holds the sprocket sheared bolts so I strengthened them but that transferred the load elsewhere, bigger coils gave lots of spark but then I blew up the transducer boxes.....get the drift?
Later I bought an International Scout Traveller...different carby, different ignition many mods, always spending my spare time on it finally got it all going and crashed it! Next a Landcruiser trayback with a slide on camper, it did pretty well but with the added weight things were either wearing out or breaking.

When it came time to buy the current Fuso truck I just paid big dollars to get it done by people who do this sort of thing all the time and know what works and what fails. I was tempted to do all my own electrics to save money but there's no way I'd have had the time or done it as good and everything works. I don't have to spend time on it, I just go wherever in it.

In your position you just have to do the best with what you can afford. When you buy stuff for it, buy good quality as cheaper stuff ends up costing more in the long run. "Buy good, buy once"!
Keep an eye on council vehicles, auction sites and ex-military sites (sometimes they have Fusos and Isuzus). There is nothing wrong with good older models that don't have all that electronic stuff on board to go wrong.

When designing your camper set up, think not only what suits you now, but what you might need to cater for in the future as you get older and life changes. Perhaps when you have a "layout" make up a cardboard mock up of the floor plan and walk it through. One idea I had the other day was when in a Harvey Norman shop looking at beds. They had one on display that hinged up at the front on gas struts and underneath was a huge storage space. I immediately thought "that would go straight in a truck van"...so always be on the lookout for what is around you everywhere you go and think if it can help. Some things may be available off the shelf and you wouldn't even know it until after you spent a fortune trying to build it.

And one tip....you will never have enough fridge/freezer space. I now have three, and it does not correspond to more beer space as the Mrs takes control and you end up with more salad stuff.

Depending on what you want to build, a simple good idea I have seen is a "Weekend Warrior" sort of a slide on box that All Terrain Warriors make. I recon you could make something similar fairly cheaply and add to it as you go along... do a Google "weekend Warrior Truck", you should find a pic of one somewhere. https://www.facebook.com/AllTerrain...5117805343551/915116895343642/?type=3&theater

I'd better stop drinking now.....
ps I dont know much about our emission laws here but I do know that if you are caught modifying it (the DPF/EGR stuff) there are big fines to be had, insurance implications, and so on.

 

[wrightjd95]

Hi James...."what do I mean"?....where do I start....I heavily modified a Ducati 900 many years ago, but with every increase in power came another problem to solve, the clutch couldn't take it, the cush drive that holds the sprocket sheared bolts so I strengthened them but that transferred the load elsewhere, bigger coils gave lots of spark but then I blew up the transducer boxes.....get the drift?
Later I bought an International Scout Traveller...different carby, different ignition many mods, always spending my spare time on it finally got it all going and crashed it! Next a Landcruiser trayback with a slide on camper, it did pretty well but with the added weight things were either wearing out or breaking.

When it came time to buy the current Fuso truck I just paid big dollars to get it done by people who do this sort of thing all the time and know what works and what fails. I was tempted to do all my own electrics to save money but there's no way I'd have had the time or done it as good and everything works. I don't have to spend time on it, I just go wherever in it.

In your position you just have to do the best with what you can afford. When you buy stuff for it, buy good quality as cheaper stuff ends up costing more in the long run. "Buy good, buy once"!
Keep an eye on council vehicles, auction sites and ex-military sites (sometimes they have Fusos and Isuzus). There is nothing wrong with good older models that don't have all that electronic stuff on board to go wrong.

When designing your camper set up, think not only what suits you now, but what you might need to cater for in the future as you get older and life changes. Perhaps when you have a "layout" make up a cardboard mock up of the floor plan and walk it through. One idea I had the other day was when in a Harvey Norman shop looking at beds. They had one on display that hinged up at the front on gas struts and underneath was a huge storage space. I immediately thought "that would go straight in a truck van"...so always be on the lookout for what is around you everywhere you go and think if it can help. Some things may be available off the shelf and you wouldn't even know it until after you spent a fortune trying to build it.

And one tip....you will never have enough fridge/freezer space. I now have three, and it does not correspond to more beer space as the Mrs takes control and you end up with more salad stuff.

Depending on what you want to build, a simple good idea I have seen is a "Weekend Warrior" sort of a slide on box that All Terrain Warriors make. I recon you could make something similar fairly cheaply and add to it as you go along... do a Google "weekend Warrior Truck", you should find a pic of one somewhere. https://www.facebook.com/AllTerrain...5117805343551/915116895343642/?type=3&theater

I'd better stop drinking now.....
ps I dont know much about our emission laws here but I do know that if you are caught modifying it (the DPF/EGR stuff) there are big fines to be had, insurance implications, and so on.

Yeah, I think I'm going to have to settle with the reality that the canter is a Japanese workhouse and it wasn't designed to be fast! Later down the line, I may retrospectively convert the truck to electric (with range extender) as this is more my area of expertise.

As for the layout - yep I'm still playing with it! I'm building various designs on CAD. Then once I have a few I'm going to export the models to a virtual reality viewer and I'll have a walk around the interior of the truck in VR.


What year of manufacture would you say is practical?

The SOP at a fire is that the truck's engine is never switched off, allowing for a speedy get away if required.
So engine hours will always be higher on ex RFS trucks because of this.
On a Fuso, only the current model (FGB71) has a DPF. On the previous model (FG84) there is an EGR. Models older than those have no EGR or DPF.
Not 100% on the Isuzu, but i do know that the current model does not have a DPF, but some earlier models do.

As for the firetruck, okay, and what is your opinion on that in regards to the quality of the engine after that?

Thanks for the help all!

 

[PKDreamers]

Have a look at Pickles.
A good looking crew cab with only 23ks on it.

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