C4500 Ambulance Camper

[Korey H]

Hey Mog
Are there any pictures of yours where I can see how much they stick out?

Yes Jim, I remember hearing that the duals touched the air bags.

In the meantime.
I’m still putting the cab back together and thinking through an bed elevator/lift system. Also, waiting for a leveling valve to arrive so I can solve my air ride leak.

The bottom tube inlet leaks, I pulled tube made sure cut was square cleaned it up, but still leaking. Once I install new one I’ll see if I can repair this and keep it as a spare.

But the way I think read that you can glue the dot panel parts together to quiet them down. Any advice on what type of glue to use on that plastic??

Can you tell me more about your elevator bed design? I just can’t stomach hapijac $.

I just ordered super singles from 1st Attack and continental MPT81s from Colony Tire. For our c5500.


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[Brewdiak]

...Also, waiting for a leveling valve to arrive so I can solve my air ride leak.
....

I replaced both of mine, but that was very early in my build when I was still trying to figure everything out and what it did. I’m not sure I would do it again or just have manual fill valves in the cab and go that way with a gauge or gauge for each side

 

[cjken]

Can you tell me more about your elevator bed design? I just can’t stomach hapijac $.

I just ordered super singles from 1st Attack and continental MPT81s from Colony Tire. For our c5500.


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That’s awesome!!
You give to report how those 1stattacks work out. Someone said they were not doing the rims for the c4500/5500 any more. I guess that they are!!

I’m still in the planning stages of the elevator bed. Right now I am thinking of building the bed frame out of 80/20 extrusion and using Harken track/ball Bering cars to guide it. Then a winch system with motors built into the bed frame and 4 cables/lines fixed to the ceiling at the four corners. Should be robust and fairly simple.

 

[cjken]

I replaced both of mine, but that was very early in my build when I was still trying to figure everything out and what it did. I’m not sure I would do it again or just have manual fill valves in the cab and go that way with a gauge or gauge for each side

Yea. I figure just replacing the valve is a good move at this point. Once I figure out what I am going to do with the front suspension I can revisit the air system. Either a Kelderman or Deavers. I would go Deavers in a heartbeat if height was not a concern.
I’m trying to stay below a certain height for a bridge that I pass under and the air ride may help me achieve that!!

 

[Korey H]

That’s awesome!!
You give to report how those 1stattacks work out. Someone said they were not doing the rims for the c4500/5500 any more. I guess that they are!!

I’m still in the planning stages of the elevator bed. Right now I am thinking of building the bed frame out of 80/20 extrusion and using Harken track/ball Bering cars to guide it. Then a winch system with motors built into the bed frame and 4 cables/lines fixed to the ceiling at the four corners. Should be robust and fairly simple.

Cool! Jeff at 1st Attack was easy to work with. Will report back. I was thinking similar on bed. Saw where someone just used barn door track for the verts. Need to find some low profile surface mount pulleys for thin cables.


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[mog]

Hey Mog
Are there any pictures of yours where I can see how much they stick out?

The winch bumper (a work in progress) still needs to come out about 1 inch so it will line up (protect) the YJ flares.

 

[cjken]

Nice!
That does not look unreasonably wide.
Good to know there are options for this truck.
Where did you get the rims? custom built for you??

 

[mog]

Where did you get the rims? custom built for you??

If you are good at finding leprechaun pots of gold, or wrangling unicorns, 8-lug Alcoa super singles are easy to find, otherwise, 'quite the adventure'
I was lucky in that the prior owner had 'acquired' and installed the wheels (4) on my truck, but I wanted spares, so I had to go on the leprechaun/unicorn hunt.
According to the Alcoa tech rep I spoke with they "never made 8x275mm pattern super singles". That being said...
My spares

I found the part number for these on an obscure Japanese website that caters to 'collectible US trucks'. The website was all in Japanese, and not formated so google could not translate, hence the part number was all I could get. The Alcoa tech rep confirmed the part number and all of their specs but said they "never made them". When I sent him the photos, he thinks that they might have come from a 'government contract' as their normal runs have a 200 piece minimum. I'm 'guessing' they were used on the Black (color and ops) C5500s that transported the 'plasma start units' for the <redacted> at Area 51. So there are probably more stored in Hangar <redacted>, Section <redacted>. The part number is <redacted> .... just kidding Alcoa PN 823400 (obsolete).

So to the best of my knowledge the options to get 8x275mm pattern Alcoa super singles are:
Order 200 units and they will make whatever you want (they will not sell rims with undrilled centers/lug holes)

Buy 10-lug Alcoa rims, and have them redrilled to the 8x275mm pattern.
This is possible and certain not a problem for the C4500/5500 as our wheels are hub-centric, and weight <19,500 lbs, while 4 of these wheels would be rated at 50,000 lbs.
I had contacted a couple of on-line wheel vendors that specialized in redrilling wheels. Both said they could handle this size rim but I did not have a warm fuzzy feeling as neither had ever done this size. The prior owner of my truck went the redrilled route but had them done by a local (to him) machine shop, and IMO they came out perfect. Over 40k of miles with zero issues and run smooth and true. The deal would be to find a machine shop capable and willing to do this, as even the machine shop he used, would not do this for anyone but him (they had a very long-standing relationship).

I do not think the #823400 rims would be a good choice for 'full-time' rims, as the off-set could/would(?) create interference on the front. OK for spares, but not full time. I have not tried them on the front yet, but when I do, I'll report on the clearances.

I have 'heard tell' of changing the hubs on the C4500/5500s to the 10-lug pattern, and then easy-breezy for super singles, but I don't have any other information on that, other than rumors.

 

[Brewdiak]

a few months ago i was in contact with several 'custom' wheel mfg's to get aluminum rims built, some weren't interested, some were interested but didn't seem to have a clue, and the ones who did were $$$texas$$$

there are also steel wheels in our bolt pattern over in europe - someone on this forum pointed me that way. I contacted some place in (germany?) but finally just went with a new staz design. I'd also looked at 1st attack, they're probably fine but I read something about 'agricultural' wheels and then welding in plates may not be the best way to go for long distance highway trips (though if the centers are pressed/concave they are stronger). Basically i'm exhausted with wheels and tires ... currently replacing the rear brakes on my rig so i've got the axle shafts out and the hubs off (and already replaced the hubs on the front) so if you can find 10 lug that bolt up it's not a 'huge' deal to swap them over. I'd vaguely considered researching that option, but then quickly retreated and decided if the new wheels don't work i'm likely headed back to dually 22.5 smaller tires and done with it all.

anyone on singles do anything to protect the rear rotor? I left the stock shield off the parking brake backing plate, and i'm probably going to try and fab up some sort of guard to help protect the rotor. I was thinking of using the bottom threads of the axle u-bolts to mount and then using the holes in the backing plate to brace with ... probably a future project rather than doing it right now but I really don't like the way the rotor is just out there waiting for a rock or road damage... just curious if anyone has bothered or if i'm doing what i usually do and inventing a solution to a problem that never existed

 

[Brewdiak]

The winch bumper (a work in progress) still needs to come out about 1 inch so it will line up (protect) the YJ flares.
View attachment 612608

For comparison this is mine on aluminum beadlocks with steel center plate (stazworks)

 

[mog]

there are also steel wheels in our bolt pattern over in europe - someone on this forum pointed me that way.

Here is a 'sample' of 'European wheels' (I'm not saying these will fit C4500/5500s, just idea as to cost, etc).
I did check with this company and they will ship to the USA.
http://www.expeditions-lkw.de/satz-mit-5-felgen-11-75x22-5-8-loch-et110-kronprinz.html

Verschuren in the Netherlands will also make 'custom wheels'.

Wheels Now in Wisconsin will build steel super singles (DOT-certified). I got a quote for $435 per wheel, (1 week build time) plus shipping

The problem with these steel wheels is the weight. They weigh 130-150 pounds each! That is more than double an Alcoa. For reference, my Hutchinson 10 x 20 rims weighed 85 lbs (two-piece construction and all of those dang bolts)

anyone on singles do anything to protect the rear rotor?

I've 'heard stories' of people cutting down a factory steel wheel and mounting like the inner dually to protect the rear brakes. But I have never seen this in real life, or photos. The trucks I am familiar with, (Fusos and Mercedes) no one does that, BUT they have drum brakes which are much more protected by that design.
I certainly think it would be a good great option for our disk brakes. Put me down for a pair of the Panzer Cowpig Brake Plates®.

 

[cjken]

Thanks for all the info guys!!
Many things that I never even thought of.
Maybe ignorance truly is bliss.

Haha
Interesting. Not sure I’ll be hunting unicorns and my CIA contact list is limited to non existent.

I will probably stay the course and stay duals for the time being with an eye toward eventually acquiring the things needed for singles.
I’ll test out conservatively on the local beaches and try to see how limiting it is for me.

Other things I’m working on are reinstalling the cab interior and trying to glue my door panels to reduce the squeaks. Keeping the old seats so that I can drive it. Hope to eventually replace with better seats.

 

[mog]

For comparison this is mine on aluminum beadlocks with steel center plate (stazworks)

How have the Stazworks wheels been working out? Are they a 'later' version that has large bolts than the ones that 'Mattersnots' had issues with?
I ask because I am thinking of making up a C4500/5500 wheel applicate cheatsheet with all of our options

 

[charlieaarons]

Fundamentally the problem in converting a DWR to SRW is that on the front the wheel mounts with an offset of ~+180-200mm. The duals on the rear of course have a net offset of 0mm. A “proper” rear SRW wheel will have an offset of 0mm, but front still quite positive.
A choice: 2 sets of wheels, with a ??? spare, or unequal tracks, or excessive stress on front or rear wheel bearings. The only really good solution is a (rear?) axle swap with proper width so that equal offset wheels will give nearly equal tracks and optimize rear wheel bearing stress, in most cases. And brake protection.
AFAIK, none of the USA medium to HD mfgs offer SRW as a factory option.
Apologies if I am repeating the obvious.

 

[Brewdiak]

How have the Stazworks wheels been working out? Are they a 'later' version that has large bolts than the ones that 'Mattersnots' had issues with?
I ask because I am thinking of making up a C4500/5500 wheel applicate cheatsheet with all of our options

Definitely different than what Tom bought! Staz now uses mrap aluminum beadlocks cuts out the center and marries a steel plate. Because the plate is on one side of the remaining center they’re slightly staggered front to back but only about an inch+

as to how they ride, well that’s a question I hope to answer very soon. I’ve replaced the front hubs rotors and calipers, and one rotor and caliper on the back - butwaiting for the correct gasket to put the half shaft back in then do the other side and bleed the brakes. Hopefully by late next week I can bed the brakes and see where I’m at on these wheels

cjken good plan to move slowly... I didn’t and have literally $paid$ for it!