choosing is tough - analysis paralysis

[rehammer81]

I think the big thing about the Aussie built or inspired designs are exactly what ROA regularly highlights in that they are not designed for the full gamut of climates in North America. For some that will be no issue. If I'm spending this much on a trailer I would like the option to use it year around and in just about anywhere I might want to go. Living in the southwest gives a ton of year around options that span the climate gamut.

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[DFNDER]

I actually have a ‘23 year model EOS-12 that is ready for pick-up. Should be heading out to Pueblo soon to pick it up. I am an avid mountain and gravel biker too, and mainly want a trailer that can get us away from commercial and park campgrounds. We had a Boreas XT first because the EOS wasn’t in production two years ago, and we loved it, but wanted something with indoor bath and sitting space so upgraded to the EOS once they got through the initial build kinks. For us, it’s mostly about size and quality. We find pretty much all the dwellers, OBi’s, xplore’s, Roamerx etc too big and to RV like with all their internal luxuries. Too much stuff for us, too big, too heavy, and look too muc like typical rv park RV’s. We wanted something that would still feel like camping, simple utilitarian interior, outside kitchen mandatory, but somewhere to sit and work on a rainy, cold day. The design ethic and utilitarian approach of a Taxa but a lot tougher and better insulated. Good bike carrying capability up front not off the back a requirement. Also something that would not feel like I’m pulling a house up a trail. There aren’t that many trailers that fit the bill. Arkto is nice but no internal bath. Same with the TetonX hybrid. The Approach looks nice, but has been delayed forever and has a lot more canvass. Kimberly’s too much $$ and look like space ships. Recon way too much canvass and you sleep in the tent so forget sleeping warm on a cold night. Boreas pop up is very minimal, just enough to cut down on wind resistance, and interior is very usable when down for a cold night or in bear country. Top notch power system with Victron and Battleborn, Zamp, heated tanks and lines, AC, heat, indoor bath. Having had the XT, we also knew the quality of a Boreas build is really first rate. These things might even survive a direct missile attack. Pricing is stiff, but less than the big monsters, and not unreasonable for this level of quality with no need for any diy upgrades. For our needs, there really wasn’t anything else on the market, and we were more than happy to stick with a company we know now and trust to deliver and back a top quality product.

 

[avidtest]

^^ great considerations. I may have to re-think the pop-up.

In regards to the Kingdom Campers, they do tick a lot of boxes. But I would need to see one in the wild to feel comfortable plunking $15K down on a $100K build (dual-axle). There are no detailed specs available yet.

 

[rehammer81]

DFNDR, definitely keep us posted on the EOS once you pick it up and get it out in the wild. I wish there was a bit more in depth detail about it available. I'm really liking it the more I think about it. I originally had written it off because I was avoiding pop-tops. You are right though that the EOS has about as minimal canvas for a pop-top that I have seen. I like that you could still use the interior well enough when closed. Would be cool to see Boreas look into a "winter" canvas option like the Arktos is going to have.

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[EPO]

Great thoughts here. Also have a Boreas XT and it's a great camper for what it is. Would purchase an EOS in a millisecond if we had a storage solution for it. Boreas' quality and customer service is top notch. Nothing but my highest regard for this company and staff.

MO Approach-they refuse to update the specs of the new camper and do not respond to emails. Customer service is significantly lacking here. Also, local dealer did not call back. I really like the ethos of their campers but they really need to get some of this sorted out.

Arkto-very nicely thought out and wonderful kitchen and storage. Near 4 season is a plus. Very nice people at Arkto.

TetonX-would like to see one in person. Not a lot of presence on social but I suspect it's because of a recent move and busy. Very nice people to speak with as well.

Aussie campers worry me a bit though I suspect quality is great in most. I do wonder about obtaining parts should certain things need repairing and currently, there is a sizeable USD hit.

 

[DFNDER]

DFNDR, definitely keep us posted on the EOS once you pick it up and get it out in the wild. I wish there was a bit more in depth detail about it available. I'm really liking it the more I think about it. I originally had written it off because I was avoiding pop-tops. You are right though that the EOS has about as minimal canvas for a pop-top that I have seen. I like that you could still use the interior well enough when closed. Would be cool to see Boreas look into a "winter" canvas option like the Arktos is going to have.

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Will do. I was able to spend some time in an EOS at expo East which confirmed a lot of my assessments of its functionality and design. Also confirmed that we really like a permanent bed as a basic requirement. After dealing with the foldable bed in a rental sprinter we swore we’d never do that again. Being able to seat five people for a meal and sleep four adults was also a big factor for us. It would be cool to have a winter canvass option at some point, but I suspect we’ll just lower the roof when it gets biting outside.

 

[Obsessed2findARuggedHybid]

^^ great considerations. I may have to re-think the pop-up.

In regards to the Kingdom Campers, they do tick a lot of boxes. But I would need to see one in the wild to feel comfortable plunking $15K down on a $100K build (dual-axle). There are no detailed specs available yet.

Totally understand. Sounds like you are prepared for a 6 month leed time. My guess is you could be well under 100K. If they offer the cruismaster spring model or other types like timbren suspension and you don't go with total mack daddy with 1,000 ah or batteries and solar. Then went with a single axel. Which is basically thier AtS caravan it would be 68k.

If you do go for pop up with wet bath but outdoor only kitchen my vote is Boreas eos12

 

[Treefarmer]

^^ great considerations. I may have to re-think the pop-up.

In regards to the Kingdom Campers, they do tick a lot of boxes. But I would need to see one in the wild to feel comfortable plunking $15K down on a $100K build (dual-axle). There are no detailed specs available yet.

We've been fulltiming for 11 years and started looking for our next trailer three years ago. We've gone through almost the identical path in our research as you described. At one point, we were also looking hard at the Oliver. Although it's very well made, based on what you've written, I don't think that's what you're looking for. If you don't need four season capability, that will reduce your price. If a single axle trailer would be large enough for you, you'll save even more. Our Kingdom build will have a huge solar system and a Truma Combi Plus system their largest). It will be 100% custom, mainly because it is the first one they're building and we wrote the specs. For that reason we will be pushing the $100k mark all in. I suspect the "base" models that roll out after ours will be $95k or less, but at least you would be getting everything you're looking for. Our goal was to have all the capabilities of the Roamer1 but with some additional upgrades and a little more size, so I think we did pretty well on price. In addition, we are designing from the ground up to perform in extreme cold. We will be having it tested at the Truma cold chamber, so that will be documented performance rather than marketing. Once the build gets going, we'll be posting the progress here. It will either be a very public success or very public embarrassment! ?

 

[Obsessed2findARuggedHybid]

I bet it will be a success. I just have a feeling that kid is a prodigy. What I am seeing on his builds look very clean.

 

[avidtest]

Well, I am now awaiting anxiously for updates and results.

 

[Obsessed2findARuggedHybid]

When will you be ready to pull the trigger and how long will you be prepared to wait for a build completion?

 

[Ozarker]

Any time someone talks about being "operational in cold weather" I go back to my 10th Mtn. Div. hoopla Army days in -57 degree weather, diesel stove/furnace with an insulated Army tent, skiing, going with snowshoes or driving anything from a Jeep to a 5 ton expandable van. Same kinda holds true for hot weather in August at Ft. Sam or Ft. Hood TX. Then, had two vacations in the Alps, one in the winter the other in the winter, neither time did I have a trailer. I fall back on these experiences to evaluate what I think a camper should provide,

So, I'd be interested in seeing those specs driving a trailer to a hundred grand. I understand the ladies like an Expresso machine, a wine chiller, a bread maker, a flusher and a hair dryer when they are out in the wild. Guess I'm lucky my lady can "rough it" more than many men would dare. Not saying we wouldn't go glamping, but the comfort that is necessary is really for our 7 year old Boxer.

So, after reading most of this, I'm convinced the route we are taking is the right one for us. That being a cargo trailer build to haul the touring trike or just having space inside in bad weather. I know, a cargo trailer has no bling factor for overlanders, might even have a negative bling factor.

I saw the Boreas trailers at Moore Expo here in town, nice, not very versatile from a utility point, and they are very proud of them $$$$$$.

They seem to be about 16 feet long from the coupler to the license plate, 6-7' wide and sit at about 7' high with good ground clearance.

Can't really imagine a hundred grand for a camping/travel trailer, I'd sure like to see the specs on that!

 

[Obsessed2findARuggedHybid]

These days there are just as many if not more men who need the creature comforts. I have came to the conclusion I will camp dry if and when I go out in the winter. I see all the madness the Utah dealer goes through to modify thier already near and over 100k trailers to make them have water while winter camping.

I do see how trailers like the Boreas eos12 add up and they are more like 80k. Hopefully they could offer a model with spring CM and no Garmin to reduce that a bit.

The Xplores (110-155k) High Altitude XT 105 ( 93-110k) and Pauses by Palomino 139k) are pushing the gouging level I will agree.

 

[Treefarmer]

Any time someone talks about being "operational in cold weather" I go back to my 10th Mtn. Div. hoopla Army days in -57 degree weather, diesel stove/furnace with an insulated Army tent, skiing, going with snowshoes or driving anything from a Jeep to a 5 ton expandable van. Same kinda holds true for hot weather in August at Ft. Sam or Ft. Hood TX. Then, had two vacations in the Alps, one in the winter the other in the winter, neither time did I have a trailer. I fall back on these experiences to evaluate what I think a camper should provide,

So, I'd be interested in seeing those specs driving a trailer to a hundred grand. I understand the ladies like an Expresso machine, a wine chiller, a bread maker, a flusher and a hair dryer when they are out in the wild. Guess I'm lucky my lady can "rough it" more than many men would dare. Not saying we wouldn't go glamping, but the comfort that is necessary is really for our 7 year old Boxer.

So, after reading most of this, I'm convinced the route we are taking is the right one for us. That being a cargo trailer build to haul the touring trike or just having space inside in bad weather. I know, a cargo trailer has no bling factor for overlanders, might even have a negative bling factor.

I saw the Boreas trailers at Moore Expo here in town, nice, not very versatile from a utility point, and they are very proud of them $$$$$$.

They seem to be about 16 feet long from the coupler to the license plate, 6-7' wide and sit at about 7' high with good ground clearance.

Can't really imagine a hundred grand for a camping/travel trailer, I'd sure like to see the specs on that!

Yeah, a nice trailer is really more for the comfort of our two dogs as well!? Same here on camping in the "good old days". 30-40 years ago my trailer was a tent and a backpack, even in the winter. After we retired and went fulltime, we added a lot more comfort by going with a 5th wheel. The trailer is our house, so spending some extra money for quality is worth it to us, but not everyone. For most people, if they have a major problem with their trailer, they drop it off to be fixed, go on with life, and don't think about it again until it's done. For us, it means we lose our house for a while. It's not the coffee maker, fancy cabinets, entertainment center, etc. that cost us any money. We're paying for the best frame, suspension, insulation, electrical and mechanical systems we can identify. We want something that should not only be durable, but that is also designed to be easily repaired. Unfortunately, that means something more custom than mass produced these days. If we were just using a trailer for vacation/weekends in spring/summer/fall, we'd be buying something much less expensive (and smaller).

 

[EPO]

Random thoughts...

"Operational in cold weather"....I have to admit that I'm pretty tough and hike and camp many hundreds of miles yearly but the thought of camping in pretty darn cold weather in anything but accidental is completely distasteful. If it's that bad, it's time for me to stay home or hit the hotel. Little interest in being out in the cold for long but nice to not have to deal with frozen water that can easily happen at altitude.

Boreas is nice but I'm disappointed with the lack of easily accessible storage in the EOS. And of course, hitting the price point of being close to "no go".

Our requirements are similar to Treefarmer's. I don't like to tinker, don't want constant breaking things, am willing to pay for good suspension and components (to a point). Thankfully my wife doesn't care about a wet bath and is perfectly fine having an outside shower and enough room inside to clean up inside if the weather sours.