Clutch’s deep thoughts thread...

[Clutch]

Comical awards made me think of JD Power, and JD Power made me think of this gem of a youtube channel.

Ha ha! Dude...I am so "that guy".

 

[Dalko43]

That is the trailer he had, replaced the Taco with a Tundra. On paper it looks like the Taco should do it just fine, but in reality not so sure. Tundra would pull it like it wasn't even back there.

I think it really depends on the frequency of type of towing. For occasional towing of 5k-6klbs on mostly flat terrain, the Tacoma should be sufficient but certainly not great. That new 3.5l v6 just doesn't have a whole lot of low-end torque. It will definitely pull hard in the upper RPM's, but it's going to be a noisy and somewhat inefficient affair. The advantage with the Tacoma lies with all the times that you won't be towing; it will return far better mpg's than you'll ever see with something like the Tundra.

Tacoma vs Tundra is often discussed on the Toyota forums, and each side of that argument has valid points:
Tacoma is much more capable (in factory form) offroad, more efficient, more nimble and easier to handle for commuting/daily driving duties. Main downsides are lack of payload and subpar low-end grunt.
Tundra has much better low-end grunt, more prepared for bigger tires and heavier loads (gearing + engine grunt), better towing characteristics, and more storage space. Downsides are very low mpg's and its big footprint.

Focus on your goals and be ready to pick your poison.

 

[Todd n Natalie]

Yeah, I just don't know if there is that big enough difference to make the jump. I kick around the idea of getting small AWD Wagon and a super light aluminum 3 rail trailer for the bikes. It might get 10-12 better mpgs, but daaaaang-it, it won't save me any money!

Not just mileage but, just won't require a truck this big in a few years I think.

That looks sketchy at best.

Oh yeah, to me that a 22' trailer is def 1/2 ton territory.

That is the trailer he had, replaced the Taco with a Tundra. On paper it looks like the Taco should do it just fine, but in reality not so sure. Tundra would pull it like it wasn't even back there.

I know. Might end up having to stick with a 1/2 ton. Or even up to a 3/4 gas pot ton depending on the trailer. Gotta decide on a trailer first. Then go from there. No timeline as to when that could happen either. Years I'm thinking. So better start researching every truck that's on the market now! haha!

 

[Todd n Natalie]

I think it really depends on the frequency of type of towing. For occasional towing of 5k-6klbs on mostly flat terrain, the Tacoma should be sufficient but certainly not great. That new 3.5l v6 just doesn't have a whole lot of low-end torque. It will definitely pull hard in the upper RPM's, but it's going to be a noisy and somewhat inefficient affair. The advantage with the Tacoma lies with all the times that you won't be towing; it will return far better mpg's than you'll ever see with something like the Tundra.

This is my conundrum. I am the only one in the vehicle on a daily basis during the work week. For 4 months during the warmer months it would tow a (approx 4,500 lbs) trailer what... 6-8 times per year? Tow to a camp site park for a weekend / week etc... Then by downsizing I end up with an easier to park truck that is hopefully more fuel efficient for the rest of the year.

 

[Dalko43]

This is my conundrum. I am the only one in the vehicle on a daily basis during the work week. For 4 months during the warmer months it would tow a (approx 4,500 lbs) trailer what... 6-8 times per year? Tow to a camp site park for a weekend / week etc... Then by downsizing I end up with an easier to park truck that is hopefully more fuel efficient for the rest of the year.

If I were dealing with your driving scenario's, I'd choose the Tacoma over the Tundra. There might be other midsized pickups that you want to consider, but in terms of midsized vs 1/2 ton, I think the former makes a lot more sense from a cost and usage perspective.

FWIW, the 6-speed manual Tacoma, besides allowing you total control over shifting, comes with 4.30 gearing (auto's only get 3.90's) which should somewhat mitigate the Tacoma's mediocre grunt.

 

[Todd n Natalie]

If I were dealing with your driving scenario's, I'd choose the Tacoma over the Tundra. There might be other midsized pickups that you want to consider, but in terms of midsized vs 1/2 ton, I think the former makes a lot more sense from a cost and usage perspective.

This is my train of thought as well and why I would like to downsize if possible.

FWIW, the 6-speed manual Tacoma, besides allowing you total control over shifting, comes with 4.30 gearing (auto's only get 3.90's) which should somewhat mitigate the Tacoma's mediocre grunt.

I would have agreed with you years ago as I love manuals. But today, my knee disagrees with manuals. So auto it is, lol.

Up until a year ago you couldn't even get a CCSB Tacoma with an auto in Canada. Had to go long box. And long box crews were not available with manuals.... weird.

 

[Clutch]

I think it really depends on the frequency of type of towing. For occasional towing of 5k-6klbs on mostly flat terrain, the Tacoma should be sufficient but certainly not great. That new 3.5l v6 just doesn't have a whole lot of low-end torque. It will definitely pull hard in the upper RPM's, but it's going to be a noisy and somewhat inefficient affair. The advantage with the Tacoma lies with all the times that you won't be towing; it will return far better mpg's than you'll ever see with something like the Tundra.

Tacoma vs Tundra is often discussed on the Toyota forums, and each side of that argument has valid points:
Tacoma is much more capable (in factory form) offroad, more efficient, more nimble and easier to handle for commuting/daily driving duties. Main downsides are lack of payload and subpar low-end grunt.
Tundra has much better low-end grunt, more prepared for bigger tires and heavier loads (gearing + engine grunt), better towing characteristics, and more storage space. Downsides are very low mpg's and its big footprint.

Focus on your goals and be ready to pick your poison.

He went from F-150 (5.4) to the Tacoma, believe wanted to downsize and tried to make the Tacoma work, which it looked like it did when he had a popup trailer, that however went out the window with the 19' Jayco. Then the Tundra showed up, year later the 19' Jayco also disappeared and now has a 26' by the looks of it. Works only few miles from his house, so don't think mpg's is a huge concern.

Not just mileage but, just won't require a truck this big in a few years I think.

Shoot, I think the opposite, might need a bigger truck in a few years, start looking at trailers, well if I am going to do that might as well go little bigger...next thing I am looking at F550's ...doh!

Then my wife sees what I am doing, and says...you do know you'll be bitching that you can't get it in all of those out of way places you like to go, just stick with a Tacoma ya silly goose!.

Oh yeah, to me that a 22' trailer is def 1/2 ton territory.

That is an accident waiting to happen for sure.

I know. Might end up having to stick with a 1/2 ton. Or even up to a 3/4 gas pot ton depending on the trailer. Gotta decide on a trailer first. Then go from there. No timeline as to when that could happen either. Years I'm thinking. So better start researching every truck that's on the market now! haha!

Ha ha...yeah who knows what I'll end up with in few years. Don't know what it is...love looking at classifieds and comparing specs of new trucks...always have been like that, while what I have already works perfectly fine.

Thinking in a few years, I'll still be driving my old crap.

 

[Wallygator]

The new (an I use that term loosely since it's a 14 year old chassis) Tacomas suck, just saying, but it's the truth.

 

[Clutch]

The new (an I use that term loosely since it's a 14 year old chassis) Tacomas suck, just saying, but it's the truth.

Don't they all?

Has gotten awfully complicated to buy a little truck to bounce around in and hopefully go camping every now and then, hasn't it?

 

[Dalko43]

The new (an I use that term loosely since it's a 14 year old chassis) Tacomas suck, just saying, but it's the truth.

I certainly understand the frustration of some longterm Toyota fans. The Tacoma, despite looking new, carries over the same basic chassis design, with some mild improvements here and there. The engine just isn't that torquey, plain and simple. The earlier 4.0l v6 certainly wasn't vastly better in that regard, but it was still better.

I'd still take the Tacoma over the Colorado in a heartbeat, perhaps excepting the ZR2. I just don't have a lot of faith that other OEM's put the same effort into durability that Toyota does...maybe time will prove that Toyota's competitors have caught up, but I'm certainly going to wait a few years to see if that is actually the case.

Don't know enough about the Ranger to make a direct comparison in terms of reliability. I do know that Fords vehicles getting heavily hyped up during initial release; that initial excitement tends to cover up some of the issues that plague Ford's vehicles. Everyone talked talked up the new F-150's aluminum body, efficient turbo gasoline engines and all the tech features that supposedly made it superior to the competition. Years after release, you hear plenty of accounts of timing chains going, Direct Injection gunking up the early engines, and intercoolers getting condensation and causing the engine to go into limp mode. Of course, most of the car media outlets (which generate a large portion of this hype) never cover these longterm issues; they're too busy hyping up the latest and greatest vehicles that are coming out to replace the ones they discussed previously.

Bottom line is that the Tacoma's design is boringly stale and the engine, though reliable, is a bit of letdown. But, I'll take a stale vehicle that works reliably over a new and "updated" vehicle that requires constant servicing and dealer visits. And that's why Toyota Tacomas and Tundras sell, despite lacking some of the design updates that can be found in other brands.

 

[Todd n Natalie]

He went from F-150 (5.4) to the Tacoma, believe wanted to downsize and tried to make the Tacoma work, which it looked like it did when he had a popup trailer, that however went out the window with the 19' Jayco. Then the Tundra showed up, year later the 19' Jayco also disappeared and now has a 26' by the looks of it. Works only few miles from his house, so don't think mpg's is a huge concern.

That's why I want to figure out the trailer situation first, then the truck later.

Ha ha...yeah who knows what I'll end up with in few years. Don't know what it is...love looking at classifieds and comparing specs of new trucks...always have been like that, while what I have already works perfectly fine.

Thinking in a few years, I'll still be driving my old crap.

Totally agree. I'm constantly window shopping. Lots of time for stuff I'll never buy. I think I've configured 32 Porsche Boxters and 911's on Porsches website, a couple new 200 Series Land Cruisers... which aren't even sold in Canada... etc, etc....

 

[Wallygator]

At this point and I hate to say it but if I needed a new midsize it would be the Colorado over the Tacoma. IMO it is just as reliable, V6, and just a better truck. More power, better frame, more towing capacity, can haul more, prob can get it at a cheaper price than the Tacoma, etc..

 

[Clutch]

That's why I want to figure out the trailer situation first, then the truck later.

I like to have twice the truck than what I need. (Which doesn't mean the biggest and the bestest tho')

Totally agree. I'm constantly window shopping. Lots of time for stuff I'll never buy. I think I've configured 32 Porsche Boxters and 911's on Porsches website, a couple new 200 Series Land Cruisers... which aren't even sold in Canada... etc, etc....

Before the internet, used to grab Auto-traders at the local gas and sip. Leaf through those, and say to myself..."ohhh, I need that"...."errr, no I don't"

Have this love hate relationship with vehicles. A total motorhead, but I hate spending money...

At this point and I hate to say it but if I needed a new midsize it would be the Colorado over the Tacoma. IMO it is just as reliable, V6, and just a better truck. More power, better frame, more towing capacity, can haul more, prob can get it at a cheaper price than the Tacoma, etc..

Think at this point, we are better off buying a fullsize truck. Midsizes have no real advantages over a fullsize.

Keep on looking at RCLB and DCSB Ram Classics with the V6, darn near the same capacities as a Midsize and for $10K or so less. Doesn't have the cool factor as a Gladiator, but has the same running gear, and will haul a beat-up Coleman stove and sleeping bag just the same.

FYI: Ram 1500 V6 RCLB 4WD, Payload 1690 lbs, towing 7180 lbs., Gas mpg 25 hwy (epa)

https://www.cars.com/for-sale/searchresults.action/?drvTrnId=27105&mdId=36488471&mkId=44763&page=1&perPage=50&prMx=25000&rd=99999&searchSource=GN_REFINEMENT&showMore=false&sort=relevance&stkTypId=28880&zc=83605

 

[Todd n Natalie]

Personally, I think I'd have to drive the trucks before I could make a decision. Last time I drove a Taco was 6 or 7 years ago? I've never stepped into a Colorado, new Ranger, 3rd gen Tacoma or a Gladiator.

 

[Dalko43]

At this point and I hate to say it but if I needed a new midsize it would be the Colorado over the Tacoma. IMO it is just as reliable, V6, and just a better truck. More power, better frame, more towing capacity, can haul more, prob can get it at a cheaper price than the Tacoma, etc..

The Colorado's boxed frame, and inherently higher payload and towing, certainly has its appeal.

I'm just not so sure about some of the chassis and driveline components attached to the frame. The Tacoma's components do look a bit beefier by comparison, but maybe I'm being too biased. The Colorado's v6 gasoline isn't anything special IMHO, and I've heard more than few owners complain that it runs rough depending on the type of gasoline that is used.

A lot of people comment on how the Colorado rides more like a car compared to the Tacoma which rides more like a truck...that's a recurring theme with GM products, which seem more focused on ride comfort, sometimes at the expense of durability and utility.

But the Colorado has certainly made a favorable enough impression that its sales have done well. I do want to see how its faring 10 years from now. I fear that some OEM's are still making their vehicles, even their trucks, as disposable products.