JonValentine
New member
Hi, my first post... hello everyone, I've been lurking for years.
I have a 1981 Unimog 1300L OM366 with 4m box, and am currently in central Turkey heading west to Morocco for the worst of the European winter, on my own as my (Chinese-born) wife is in China visiting parents.
Continental MPT 80 info:
While in Georgia (the country, not the state... as you seem to be mostly Americans), I needed new front tyres on the mog. The old Michelin XMLs were thrapped. Then one of the Michelins (probably due to a lack of any tread rubber and the Georgian roads) got a deep gash in the centre of the tread area. Enough! I was near Gori (Joe Stalin's birthplace), and the only premium branded new tyre I could get that matched my Unimog's 335/80 R20 tyre spec (apart from Russian rubbish fitted to Zil 131s and Kamaz etc) was the old Conti MPT model, the "80". But it was only available as a 12.5 R 20.
There is almost no info online, about the MPT 80 from Conti, as they want to sell MPT 81s (far more expensive), so I thought I'd make this post so anyone Googling these Continental MPT80 tires will find this information.
So, in Georgia, I asked Conti in Germany by email. Happily they replied (replies in bold), so if anyone is interested in what Continental tyres said about the MPT 80 vs MPT 81, here it is:
"Jon, as I´m from Conti central in Hanover, I can reply to most of your questions regarding technical details."
Q: Thanks! I have a Unimog camper and just bought a new pair of MPT80 tyres 12 R 20 (139J) in Georgia, for the front wheels. I'm happy with the tyres, but have a couple of questions. There is very little info online about this tyre model.
"Yes, it´s old model and we normally prefer to sell it´s successor, MPT81. MPT80 is still in portfolio as there are many customers used this tire in the past and want to replace it 1:1 with same size (old imperial size designation) and pattern."
Q: I can't find a date stamp (ww/yy) on the tyres. Is this perhaps because MPT tyres are out of scope of the date legislation, similar to the M+S/3PMSF symbol issue, as they don't have a 3PMSF symbol either? Will a UK MOT tester want the date code visible? And how do I know the age of the "new" tyres?
"Normally, also MPT80 tires have a DOT and production date stamp, as this is mandatory for the certification of the tires and also required for the legal technical checkups in different Countries. It´s only on right hand side of the tire, seen from rotation direction of the tire (Week Week/Year Year), so hope you find it also on your tire.
M+S Symbol they have, but not 3PMSF, as all “MPT” homologated tires belong to the group of “POR” Tires (Professsional Off-Road). Unfortunately, EU regulations don´t allow homologation in parallel for “POR” and “3PMSF” at the moment, so most Countries have a special allowance that tires can be operated in Winter without 3PMSF if they have “POR” Marking."
Q: Also, can you briefly describe the difference between the MPT80 and the MPT81, as there is no real info on the MPT80 on Conti's website. I would have preferred the MPT81, for the higher load/speed rating, even though the 139J will do for my Unimog as I never exceed 90kph and the front axle is quite light, compared to the rear. All online info seems to refer to the MPT81. But in Georgia, I could only get MPT80s in the 335/80R20 (12.5 R 20) size.
"The MPT81 is the successor of MPT81, but also already since 1990´s in the market
, so quite a long time. The pattern is designed for better traction and optimized self -cleaning, little lower noise level at high speed transport and better wear behavior. On top, the size designation is shifted to the todays requirements with metric designation, as the old imperial sizes are not anymore listed in the tire nomenclature of ETRTO. Nevertheless, MPT80 with imperial size designation is 100% legal and not a bad tire at all. Main reason to have it still in the portfolio is the good traction on ice and snow, some customers still ask for tires in the old pattern and size designation, as they have only the old size designation in their documentation papers."
Q: Are the 12.5R20 MPT80s in fact 80% aspect ratio? Or are they 100% ratio? The tread width is significantly narrower than the 335/80R20 Michelin XZLs they replaced (not a problem, just wondering...).
"Yes, 12.5 R 20 is 80% ratio and if you ignore differences in size of “tolerances”, the dimensions of the 12.5 R 20 MPT80 and 335/80 R 20 MPT81 are quite identical. For US/American Market, we also produce the MPT81 with imperial size designation, as US market prefers the old designations, but tire dimensions are 100% the same to the metric pendant of tire.
Pattern width may vary marginally to competitor products, but even old and new competitor products may vary marginally, as for newer ETRTO and EU regulations, the maximum width tolerance is more strong since some years, so for some tires there need to be made some adaptations to get it homologated with actual regulations. But luckily MPT80 and MPT, 81 fulfilled all requirements, so design and dimensions are the same since many years."
Harm-Hendrik Lange
Customer Solutions Engineer EMEA
Commercial Specialty Tires (CST)
Some notes... Herr Lange gave me his mobile number in case I had difficulties: superb service from Conti in Germany.
I'll add that, to drive, these "old" model tyres are great. They are quieter than the Michelins, smooth and just feel "nice".
I paid 1200 Georgian Lari (fitted and balanced) each for the new tubeless MPT 80s, which is approx 420 Euros each, but I'll add that the Georgian customs refunded the VAT element of that when I re-entered Turkey, without quibble. So significantly cheaper than 420 Euros, each.
I asked my usual tyre supplier in the UK for prices, and he said:
Good morning Jon
I can get all 3 brands with an estimated delivery of 2-3 weeks
Michelin XZL. £685
Continental MPT81. £635
Pirelli PS22. £600
All plus 20% vat
Regards
Paul
So, I would have paid 880 Euros equivalent (in the UK), for a new MPT81 including UK VAT (which I wouldn't get refunded at all). That means the new MPT 80s from Georgia were LESS THAN HALF THE PRICE of the UK MPT 81s! My tyre supplier struggled to find any MPT 80s in the UK.
I subsequently found the date stamp on the tyres, on the tyre I was looking at, it was on the inner face. They were made in mid 2019 so had been on the shelf for 3-years, and also discovered that my truck is out of scope for the tyre/date technical test (MOT) rules in the UK. Sweet.
Hope this info may help someone. Simply drive to the Caucuses, buy old model new tyres, reclaim the VAT on exit... happiness.
Jon
I have a 1981 Unimog 1300L OM366 with 4m box, and am currently in central Turkey heading west to Morocco for the worst of the European winter, on my own as my (Chinese-born) wife is in China visiting parents.
Continental MPT 80 info:
While in Georgia (the country, not the state... as you seem to be mostly Americans), I needed new front tyres on the mog. The old Michelin XMLs were thrapped. Then one of the Michelins (probably due to a lack of any tread rubber and the Georgian roads) got a deep gash in the centre of the tread area. Enough! I was near Gori (Joe Stalin's birthplace), and the only premium branded new tyre I could get that matched my Unimog's 335/80 R20 tyre spec (apart from Russian rubbish fitted to Zil 131s and Kamaz etc) was the old Conti MPT model, the "80". But it was only available as a 12.5 R 20.
There is almost no info online, about the MPT 80 from Conti, as they want to sell MPT 81s (far more expensive), so I thought I'd make this post so anyone Googling these Continental MPT80 tires will find this information.
So, in Georgia, I asked Conti in Germany by email. Happily they replied (replies in bold), so if anyone is interested in what Continental tyres said about the MPT 80 vs MPT 81, here it is:
"Jon, as I´m from Conti central in Hanover, I can reply to most of your questions regarding technical details."
Q: Thanks! I have a Unimog camper and just bought a new pair of MPT80 tyres 12 R 20 (139J) in Georgia, for the front wheels. I'm happy with the tyres, but have a couple of questions. There is very little info online about this tyre model.
"Yes, it´s old model and we normally prefer to sell it´s successor, MPT81. MPT80 is still in portfolio as there are many customers used this tire in the past and want to replace it 1:1 with same size (old imperial size designation) and pattern."
Q: I can't find a date stamp (ww/yy) on the tyres. Is this perhaps because MPT tyres are out of scope of the date legislation, similar to the M+S/3PMSF symbol issue, as they don't have a 3PMSF symbol either? Will a UK MOT tester want the date code visible? And how do I know the age of the "new" tyres?
"Normally, also MPT80 tires have a DOT and production date stamp, as this is mandatory for the certification of the tires and also required for the legal technical checkups in different Countries. It´s only on right hand side of the tire, seen from rotation direction of the tire (Week Week/Year Year), so hope you find it also on your tire.
M+S Symbol they have, but not 3PMSF, as all “MPT” homologated tires belong to the group of “POR” Tires (Professsional Off-Road). Unfortunately, EU regulations don´t allow homologation in parallel for “POR” and “3PMSF” at the moment, so most Countries have a special allowance that tires can be operated in Winter without 3PMSF if they have “POR” Marking."
Q: Also, can you briefly describe the difference between the MPT80 and the MPT81, as there is no real info on the MPT80 on Conti's website. I would have preferred the MPT81, for the higher load/speed rating, even though the 139J will do for my Unimog as I never exceed 90kph and the front axle is quite light, compared to the rear. All online info seems to refer to the MPT81. But in Georgia, I could only get MPT80s in the 335/80R20 (12.5 R 20) size.
"The MPT81 is the successor of MPT81, but also already since 1990´s in the market
Q: Are the 12.5R20 MPT80s in fact 80% aspect ratio? Or are they 100% ratio? The tread width is significantly narrower than the 335/80R20 Michelin XZLs they replaced (not a problem, just wondering...).
"Yes, 12.5 R 20 is 80% ratio and if you ignore differences in size of “tolerances”, the dimensions of the 12.5 R 20 MPT80 and 335/80 R 20 MPT81 are quite identical. For US/American Market, we also produce the MPT81 with imperial size designation, as US market prefers the old designations, but tire dimensions are 100% the same to the metric pendant of tire.
Pattern width may vary marginally to competitor products, but even old and new competitor products may vary marginally, as for newer ETRTO and EU regulations, the maximum width tolerance is more strong since some years, so for some tires there need to be made some adaptations to get it homologated with actual regulations. But luckily MPT80 and MPT, 81 fulfilled all requirements, so design and dimensions are the same since many years."
Harm-Hendrik Lange
Customer Solutions Engineer EMEA
Commercial Specialty Tires (CST)
Some notes... Herr Lange gave me his mobile number in case I had difficulties: superb service from Conti in Germany.
I'll add that, to drive, these "old" model tyres are great. They are quieter than the Michelins, smooth and just feel "nice".
I paid 1200 Georgian Lari (fitted and balanced) each for the new tubeless MPT 80s, which is approx 420 Euros each, but I'll add that the Georgian customs refunded the VAT element of that when I re-entered Turkey, without quibble. So significantly cheaper than 420 Euros, each.
I asked my usual tyre supplier in the UK for prices, and he said:
Good morning Jon
I can get all 3 brands with an estimated delivery of 2-3 weeks
Michelin XZL. £685
Continental MPT81. £635
Pirelli PS22. £600
All plus 20% vat
Regards
Paul
So, I would have paid 880 Euros equivalent (in the UK), for a new MPT81 including UK VAT (which I wouldn't get refunded at all). That means the new MPT 80s from Georgia were LESS THAN HALF THE PRICE of the UK MPT 81s! My tyre supplier struggled to find any MPT 80s in the UK.
I subsequently found the date stamp on the tyres, on the tyre I was looking at, it was on the inner face. They were made in mid 2019 so had been on the shelf for 3-years, and also discovered that my truck is out of scope for the tyre/date technical test (MOT) rules in the UK. Sweet.
Hope this info may help someone. Simply drive to the Caucuses, buy old model new tyres, reclaim the VAT on exit... happiness.
Jon
