D1 Rescue / What have I gotten myself into?

Bigplum

Observer
Discovery 1's are loveable old things , I've got a 96 and a 99 Japanese import both tdi auto's
my older one is suffering from rust worm but has been too faithful to sell on , never failed to get me home in ten years even after two accidents ,so she is a long term rebuild project ,
The ex jap one is very tidy , no salt used in Japan but has a few heat related issues , perished rubbers and droopy headling etc
Disco 1's are just showing signs of being collectible , tidy 200tdi are getting rare

Anyway your boost problem , check the rubber inter cooler pipes, they can delaminate internally and block under pressure, also has it got any of the EGR valve rubbish on the exhaust manifold ? Most people bin it over here and fit blanking plates, the egr valves get very sooty and sticky and fill the inlet with a oily mess
 

slomatt

Adventurer
Bigplum,

Thank you for the information. The truck does not have an EGR, and I will definitely check out the intercooler hoses to see if they have delaminated internally.

- Matt
 

proper4wd

Expedition Leader
It does sound like a clutch drag issue, start with process of elimination starting with the simplest.

Rob Dassler at SWR (formerly Southwest Rovers) is a great resource for all Rover transmissions (Tdi included) in the US

http://swrautomotive.net/
 

slomatt

Adventurer
Adam, thank you for the pointers on the clutch drag. Once we purchase a house I'm looking forward to digging into the clutch issue further, the problem is that the local housing market is insane at the moment. The last house we wrote on had 32 offers and the winner was all cash with no contingencies. Crazy.

- Matt
 

LtFuzz

Explorer
A beater Disco shows up on Craigslist...


...with a 300tdi installed by one of the more well-known Rover wrenches in the country? and it has clear paperwork?

the stars aligned for you my friend
 

slomatt

Adventurer
Quick update... the D1 has been sitting mostly idle while some "small" life changes such as purchasing a house and getting married happened. Now the house remodeling is settling down, so I should have time to work on the Disco again. The intercooler hoses are in good shape so delaminiation is not the cause of the power loss. Interestingly the lift pump has started dripping a bit, which could mean it is not supplying full fuel pressure to the injection pump and might cause a loss of "high rpm" (aka 2000) power. Oh, and amazingly now that the power steering leak is fixed the truck only leaves a single dime size drip on the ground even after sitting for several weeks!

- Matt
 

overlander

Expedition Leader
Great project truck find! A D1 with a TDI is a fantastic pallet for an overland truck build. The 300 TDI is a terrific engine. Might I recommend you join up with Defendersource.com as well. While it's all Defenders, there are alot of TDI truck owners (including me) on that forum and a LOT of knowledge. The D1 powertrain is almost identical to the Defender and Range Rover classic.

Anyway, the R380 doesn't care if the engine is running or not; that is an autobox factor. My next move would be to drain all the oil out of the R380 to rule out the possibility that the PO filled the gearbox with the wrong oil. R380 does not take gear oil. Your issues could be associated with that. Redline MTL is the oil you want in there.

Since it's a used vehicle, I would HIGHLY recommend you replace all rubber hoses on the engine. And that includes EVERY piece of rubber fuel hose if the PO has been running biodiesel. The 300 TDI is very happy running biodiesel, but biodiesel will destroy rubber, which means anything the fuel runs through must be VITON, not rubber. The symptom and consequence of keeping rubber lines with bio is that all your lines start weeping/sweating fuel like a garden drip hose. Also, old rubber will decay and crack, and if any of the hoses for crankcase evap capture (coming off the passenger side breathers) has a crack or hole, you will start having oil disappear mysteriously. And give it all new coolant lines so you are starting from a known point on life. All engines with aluminum heads are very vulnerable to overheating, and the 300TDI is no exceptions. Overheat that engine and you'll be dealing with a cracked head or head gasket replacement. And lastly, that timing belt must be changed religiously around 60-70k, or roll the dice with that timing belt snapping at some point.

BTW, Pendy did my conversion. I would reach out to him and introduce yourself. He is a frequent member of defendersource.

congrats, that is a great ride, and the 300 TDI is an easy breezy engine to work on.
 

slomatt

Adventurer
Mark,

Thank you very much for the pointers. I will definitely check out all of the rubber hoses in the engine compartment and the coolant hoses.

On the R380 front, my thought was that I cannot shift the transmission into reverse while the engine is running due to clutch drag. If the engine is off, or the transfer case is in neutral, then I can shift into reverse with no issue, so it does not seem to be a problem inside the transmission. I plan to replace the transmission fluid while baselining the car, and thank you for the Redline MTL recommendation.

I've registered at Defendersource and send Pendy a PM.

- Matt
 

Ray_G

Explorer
Matt-
Def check in over on Defendersource (I still keep thinking of it as D90). As Mark said there are quite a few TDI owners over there-including some D1 300 TDI owners worth touching base with. Frank R just sold his, but Danny F still has his. Nice looking truck!
r-
Ray
 

NMC_EXP

Explorer
Since it's a used vehicle, I would HIGHLY recommend you replace all rubber hoses on the engine. And that includes EVERY piece of rubber fuel hose if the PO has been running biodiesel. The 300 TDI is very happy running biodiesel, but biodiesel will destroy rubber, which means anything the fuel runs through must be VITON, not rubber.

At the risk of putting too fine a point on the issue, Viton® is rubber. Specifically, Viton® is a DuPont tradename for its product line of fluoroelastomer rubber.

There are two main classes of rubber: (1) natural, and (2) synthetic. Common synthetics include; nitrile, Neoprene®, EPDM, silicone and many others.

Historically, nitrile rubber has commonly been used for hoses and seals in contact with conventional hydrocarbon fuels and oils because it worked pretty well and was cheap. Biodiesel and gasoline with ethanol have been found to degrade nitrile and some other rubber types forcing a change to the more expensive fluoroelastomers like Viton®.

Fluoroelastomers/Viton® are excellent materials and will function long term in environments that would cause other types of rubber to fail in hours but they have definite limitations:

(1) Fluoroelastomers/Viton® are NOT compatible with hot water or coolant. It will chemically degrade and fail.

(2) Fluoroelastomers/Viton® function poorly at low temperature - they become hard as a rock at relatively high temp and will not seal. The failure of Viton® o-rings to seal solid rocket booster joints at low temp was the root cause of the space shuttle Challenger explosion.

I used to do this rubber stuff for a living. Guess it shows I miss the work.

Jim
 

NMC_EXP

Explorer
What a fantastic value added commentary! Thanks Jim.

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SGH-I537 using Tapatalk

Generally speaking, if you want long service life from a rubber part in a high temp environment and/or when in contact with petroleum based products (including biodiesel) fluoroelastomers/Viton® are a good way to go (assuming you have a choice from your supplier).

Using it probably does not make sense on something like an oil filter seal which is replaced on a regular basis. The chemical degradation of rubber is a time/temperature related process. If you have handled an used o-ring or seal that is rock hard and cracked that is a sign of long term thermal degradation. Rubber being incompatible with the fluid being sealed may show up as either hardening/cracking or swelling and softening depending on the rubber and fluid type.

In my first post I mentioned "nitrile" rubber. Nitrile is commonly referred to as "Buna-N" rubber. Buna-N is actually a trade name for I believe the Bayer Corp. Buna-N was the first commercially successful synthetic rubber for use with petroleum based fluids.

If you have any questions regarding rubber, let me know. It is about the only thing I know really well.

Jim
 

slomatt

Adventurer
Unfortunately Pendy replied (politely) that he is not interested in discussing my truck, so no luck learning any more about its history from him.

Jim, thank you for the details on the various varieties of rubber, quite interesting.

- Matt
 

slomatt

Adventurer
It has been 4 months since my last update and in that time I've made some progress with the D1.

I pulled out all the dirty carpets and used a pressure washer to clean them, it made a huge difference and they now look almost like new. I also completely removed the alpine windows, fixed the rust, and then re-installed them and sealed the window gaskets so they won't leak again. While the carpets were out I found some rust forming on the passenger side floorboards above the mudflap mount, so I used rust converter on that and then put on a coat of paint. The leak is coming from the cable gland going to the passenger door, so that should be easy to seal up. Luckily there was no other rust on the truck, the trunk floor is fine and the rust I did find on the alpine windows and front floorboards was not structural. What else... I installed the genuine Land Rover rear ladder, painted the hood flat black with Plastidip, and did a bunch of other mainly cosmetic cleanup on the inside and outside.

Mechanically the D1 is doing really well, except for the clutch drag issue. I used an inspection camera to look inside the bellhousing and it looks like the clutch fork has punched through at the pivot point, that would definitely explain the hard shifting issues.


The big question is what to do with the D1 moving forward. A new HD clutch fork is only $24, but it will take a full day to drop the transmission and re-install it. We are still in the middle of remodeling our house and I just don't have time to work on the D1 as much as I'd like to. I'm seriously thinking of selling it to someone else who has the time to work on it and who will enjoy the truck. At this point the only major issue is the shift fork, once that is done it is ready to drive (though it could use new tires).

So, I'd appreciate input on what a fair asking price for this truck might be if I were to sell it. Here are the relevant specs:

The good:
- 1996 Discovery SD (no sunroofs to leak, no power seats to break) w/ 175k on the chassis and ~70k since the engine was installed
- 300tdi installed by Pendy. Phillipe at Roverland in San Francisco checked it out last year and said it was a clean install.
- R380 manual transmission
- All four power windows and both mirrors work fine.
- Comes with the stock jack and the roof rack rails.
- 3 core radiator.
- Brand new power steering pump.
- Brand new clutch master and slave cylinders.
- The truck basically runs on a single wire (no computers), should get 25-30mpg, has two solid axles, and can run biodiesel. It might just be the ultimate zombie apocalypse vehicle. :)
- Titled as a diesel in California, this is extremely rare and means no smog checks and no hassles with registering it.

The no so good: (I'm aiming to be completely honest here since the guy I bought it from didn't fully disclose everything when I bought it)
- Needs the shift fork replaced.
- Could use new tires.
- Paint fading on hood and roof (standard for Discos).
- Windshield cracked, but not in driver's line of view.
- Headliner is sagging.
- A few plastic pieces on the inside are cracked or missing fasteners, these are cheap and easy to replace.
- Lift pump leaks sometimes, it is ~$50 to replace.
- Salvage title. There is no indication of any frame damage and Phillie didn't see anything off when he worked on the truck, I suspect it was salvaged due to theft or a break in.

Nicely modified 300tdi swapped D1s often are often listed for $12-18k, but my truck is definitely a project and worth nowhere near that amount. The engine and transmission alone are worth about $5000 (not including installation), and the CA diesel title is really the very rare thing about this truck. I'm thinking $8k would be a fair asking price, what do you guys think? I hate to sell it, but in the big picture I would rather work on the house and I hate the idea of this cool truck just sitting around and not being driven. I'd rather let someone else enjoy it.

- Matt
 

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