Do you feel the need to have a weapon when camping
- Thread starter Expedition Key
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Target shooting? Collecting?
I don't think you're making your point well.
"Being prepared" means bringing gear you think could be useful... and I don't believe it's some fear-driven impulse.
K2ZJ
Explorer
I can handpick photos too.
- - But with bears in the photos? I'm not "hand picking," just trying to make a point. Not every wildlife encounter needs a gun. In fact, not every wildlife encounter presents a problem that requires any kind or type of resolution.
Don't get me wrong, I like guns, own several, used them as a Marine in Viet Nam, teach the law of self defense in an NRA CCW class, hunt, fish, camp, rode my motorcycle for over 10,000 miles through Europe, Asia Minor, and Central Asia last summer, and have prosecuted more state and federal firearm violations than I care to remember. But I don't carry ever in the city, and only occasionally, like when I am hunting, in the outdoors.
But as the OP asked, the thread is about taking a firearm camping. C. Noel points out repeatedly, that it is really a personal choice and is based on risk assessment. So here is a link to an Alaska Dispatch News article on the subject of "bear protection."
http://www.adn.com/article/are-guns-more-effective-pepper-spray-alaska-bear-attack
[TL;DR - It doesn't do any good to carry unless it is in your hand, and then the best bet is a shotgun with slugs]
It is still a personal choice, and, like Mr. Noel, I believe that the choice is so important that is should be based upon calm reflection and assessment of the real and imagined risks you might confront in each particular situation. And then, if you decide to arm yourself while camping in the woods, you don't want to be the guy that discharges your firearm and kills a person innocently camping with his family in another campsite. http://www.denverpost.com/ci_28440001
Having written all that, I do want to state that your last photo is, in fact, particularly disarming . . .
- - But with bears in the photos? I'm not "hand picking," just trying to make a point. Not every wildlife encounter needs a gun. In fact, not every wildlife encounter presents a problem that requires any kind or type of resolution.
Don't get me wrong, I like guns, own several, used them as a Marine in Viet Nam, teach the law of self defense in an NRA CCW class, hunt, fish, camp, rode my motorcycle for over 10,000 miles through Europe, Asia Minor, and Central Asia last summer, and have prosecuted more state and federal firearm violations than I care to remember. But I don't carry ever in the city, and only occasionally, like when I am hunting, in the outdoors.
But as the OP asked, the thread is about taking a firearm camping. C. Noel points out repeatedly, that it is really a personal choice and is based on risk assessment. So here is a link to an Alaska Dispatch News article on the subject of "bear protection."
http://www.adn.com/article/are-guns-more-effective-pepper-spray-alaska-bear-attack
[TL;DR - It doesn't do any good to carry unless it is in your hand, and then the best bet is a shotgun with slugs]
It is still a personal choice, and, like Mr. Noel, I believe that the choice is so important that is should be based upon calm reflection and assessment of the real and imagined risks you might confront in each particular situation. And then, if you decide to arm yourself while camping in the woods, you don't want to be the guy that discharges your firearm and kills a person innocently camping with his family in another campsite. http://www.denverpost.com/ci_28440001
Having written all that, I do want to state that your last photo is, in fact, particularly disarming . . .
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K2ZJ
Explorer
Pics with no guns, there are bears. Pics with Guns, no bears. You draw your own conclusion. :gunt:
Blind_Io
Adventurer
I have my CFP and I do carry a sidearm most the time. I recently went camping in an area known for both bears and moose, as a precaution I did bring by .44 mag Henry and a pistol. We were hammock camping and there was recently a camper who was attacked by a bear despite doing everything right (keeping food outside of camp, disposing of all garbage appropriately, using bear bags, etc). With my wife and small dogs with me, I did feel better about having the rifle.
If I'm headed to the desert, where the biggest threat is coyotes (not much of a threat, but I have had them circle very close to camp in the past), I would probably bring the AR-15 instead of something the size of the .44. At some point I would also like to get a .410 revolver, loaded with shot one of these makes a great snake gun. I would much rather not have to shoot an animal if I can help it, but having a firearm as a safety measure is certainly nice.
Some studies have shown that bear spray is more effective at stopping a charging bear, but these sprays can blow back in your face. I have not seen how well they do against a pissed-off momma moose that thinks you are a threat - and honestly, that is the critter that scares me the most. So, nothing really against sprays, but even with bear spray I would still want a firearm.
Of course, this is all personal choice. If someone would rather not have to deal with a firearm or just is not comfortable with one, then I certainly respect the decision to not have one around.
If I'm headed to the desert, where the biggest threat is coyotes (not much of a threat, but I have had them circle very close to camp in the past), I would probably bring the AR-15 instead of something the size of the .44. At some point I would also like to get a .410 revolver, loaded with shot one of these makes a great snake gun. I would much rather not have to shoot an animal if I can help it, but having a firearm as a safety measure is certainly nice.
Some studies have shown that bear spray is more effective at stopping a charging bear, but these sprays can blow back in your face. I have not seen how well they do against a pissed-off momma moose that thinks you are a threat - and honestly, that is the critter that scares me the most. So, nothing really against sprays, but even with bear spray I would still want a firearm.
Of course, this is all personal choice. If someone would rather not have to deal with a firearm or just is not comfortable with one, then I certainly respect the decision to not have one around.
It's a funny picture, but I'm betting 99% of the people know not every wildlife encounter requires a gun. It's simply an option... and there may come a time when it might be useful.
Christophe Noel
Expedition Leader
I want to thank DanCooper for taking the time to write his post, and not just because it acknowledges my personal opinion. It is simply a well worded and experienced opinion worth hearing. I also want to thank all of those on either side of this topic for their respectful candor.
It's with trepidation I entered into this discussion, but I did so because I feel it is important for all sides to be heard, and for those voices to be given validation. Where this becomes most relevant is within those settings were those who do, and those who do not carry, mix company. How those differing opinions intermingle physically is tricky business.
My takeaway after 86 pages is: At the root of it, few people truly want to assert their leanings on the subject on anyone. Everyone has their reasons for or against, and as gentlemen, I think most of us genuinely respect the other faction's views, even if we don't identify with them.
How rare is that?
It's with trepidation I entered into this discussion, but I did so because I feel it is important for all sides to be heard, and for those voices to be given validation. Where this becomes most relevant is within those settings were those who do, and those who do not carry, mix company. How those differing opinions intermingle physically is tricky business.
My takeaway after 86 pages is: At the root of it, few people truly want to assert their leanings on the subject on anyone. Everyone has their reasons for or against, and as gentlemen, I think most of us genuinely respect the other faction's views, even if we don't identify with them.
How rare is that?
GregSplett
Adventurer
How rare is that?
VERY!
VERY!
MOguy
Explorer
If one in ever 100 people did have issues with wildlife requiring a gun than I think that would easily justify carrying one. I would bet there are far more than 100 people that venture into the woods everyday. I live at the edge of federal forestry. If I had a 1 in 100 chance of having an issue it would have come around a few times for me already. Chancer are far less than 1 in 100 but I still carry.
P2W
Observer
New Yorkers don't carry guns,..
Ray_G
Explorer
Relatedly I always follow the adage that you never need a firearm, till you need one badly.
I don't find frequent use for my fire extinguisher(s), but I still haul them around too!
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