Do you really need an AC inverter?

[NevetsG]

Most commercial battery power supplies have inverters, and many people install inverters. Why? Do we really need them?

We are not running power lines huge distances (the reason why we have AC power).
They waste a lot of power during the inversion.
Almost every appliance and device out there has a DC version available.

So it seems pointless to have 110/220V inversion from 12V versus going from 110/220V to 12V and only get 12V devices/appliances.

What is your take?

Let the microwave and AC unit replies flow.

 

[DiploStrat]

We use a microwave, a lot. So we do need an inverter for that. Also for Apple computers, Bluetooth speaker and camera battery charger. Moved to a 12v air conditioner, so our inverter is a lot smaller than the 2800w unit on our previous camper. We use 12v whenever possible. (Ironically, the Norcold refrigerator is a bizarre 24v AC model which runs its own, internal inverter.)

But it is largely a BOGO/241 issue as our inverter is also our shore power battery charger.

 

[DaveInDenver]

Valid point. You should run things capable of using 12 VDC directly when possible. But putting aside the obvious 120 VAC things there are reasons why using inverters makes sense.

Most of laptops adapters (or other lithium chargers) are actually 19 to 24 VDC so would need a switching boost supply from 12 V either way. You can eliminate one conversion (12 V-> 120 V) potentially but at the expense of carrying yet another adapter (12 V -> 19 V, for example) when you could just use the same one you'd use on shore power or in a hotel anyway.

A good inverter can be acceptably efficient and so compromising a few watts for the convenience of carrying standardized stuff is likely worthwhile. Then factor in being able to replace a failed computer charger at any Best Buy or tool charger at Home Depot rather than trying to order or repair a special one.

 

[icedragonmx]

I was unable to get a direct 12v charging system for my laptop so the inverter is needed. Runs at 92% efficiency for my pure sine Go Power inverter so no big loss even for the smaller items like camera batteries etc..

 

[Hillbilly Heaven]

If you happen to carry any battery powered tools not all manufacturers offer a DC powered battery charger.

 

[john61ct]

Only if you "need" appliances not available / reasonably priced in native DC.

And I prefer getting a small/cheap one per device, so it gets turned on/off with the device.

Charging battery-powered gadgets from an inverter is just silly.

I've even seen people run big mains chargers through an inverter! LOL

 

[john61ct]

If you happen to carry any battery powered tools not all manufacturers offer a DC powered battery charger.

Name one.

All you need is the voltage requirement, max amps and rig the connector with correct polarity. Not rocket science.

 

[john61ct]

I was unable to get a direct 12v charging system for my laptop so the inverter is needed. Runs at 92% efficiency for my pure sine Go Power inverter so no big loss even for the smaller items like camera batteries etc..

See above.

If you actually meter the watt-hours consumed you will see much lower efficiencies IRL than what the maker's marketing department touts.

Usually 25-40% losses compared to sticking to DC native all the way, even with voltage conversion.

NBD if you're on the grid or burning dino juice, but extended solar-only living off grid, makes a huge difference.

 

[Hillbilly Heaven]

DeWalt has 18, 20, 40, and 60 volt batteries plus some smaller size batteries and they offer no mobile charger. They do offer a 180 watt inverter that you plug their AC charger in to. Milwaukee is the only one I know of that has a mobile battery charger.

 

[NevetsG]

[U]john61ct[/U] hit most of my rebuttals.

EVERY portable device on the planet is DC, period. Then the majority of them are in the world market, and for the sake of economy the 110V power supplies are external in order to support multiple input voltages.

Its just that pesky voltage requirement. Its not rocket science but not plug’n play getting 24V out of my Hilux. Nevermind some batteries need to communicate with its charger what has diagnostics & auto shutoff.

This isn't as difficult as you might think. Switchable DC-DC up converters do exist, if you have the amps, you can make the volts. FYI, batteries are not that smart, it is the chargers that are smart, and I will get to that in a moment.

 

[NevetsG]

DeWalt has 18, 20, 40, and 60 volt batteries plus some smaller size batteries and they offer no mobile charger. They do offer a 180 watt inverter that you plug their AC charger in to. Milwaukee is the only one I know of that has a mobile battery charger.

You might want to search a bit harder, I found this in 5 seconds:

https://www.batterymart.com/p-chg-d...a6yFKntHM4rSs6EOL6HTMCsLWIkvEsmUaAt5lEALw_wcB

The input voltage is DC.

 

[NevetsG]

See above.

If you actually meter the watt-hours consumed you will see much lower efficiencies IRL than what the maker's marketing department touts.

Usually 25-40% losses compared to sticking to DC native all the way, even with voltage conversion.

NBD if you're on the grid or burning dino juice, but extended solar-only living off grid, makes a huge difference.

This is exactly why I started this thread. If you can avoid using an inverter, your battery life is going to increase.

 

[john61ct]

Good reason to avoid Dewalt, changing batt styles so often. I hate planned obsolescence

Ryobi One+ is a great platform, hundreds of tools and gadgets, instructions out there DIY a USB or laptop powerpack.

https://www.google.com/search?q=vehicle+charger+Dewalt

Looks like Ridgid might not, but again, not hard to rig one.

Some laptops require own-brand charger, but both branded and generic ones are available for 99.99% of models out there.

Anyway your rig do what you like, just passing on more complete information.

 

[john61ct]

EVERY portable device on the planet is DC, period.

Ahem.

https://us.lewiswinch.com/

 

[NevetsG]

A good AC/DC hobby charger with customized pig tails can charge almost any battery out there, and do it safely. Some can even charge your car battery.

I have this one, and I can charge 10 different battery types across 4 different chemical make ups:

https://www.horizonhobby.com/passport-ultra-100w-acdc-touch-battery-charger-dync3000


Simply put, there is a HUGE selection of solutions to each problem without resorting to an inverter. Just 7 years ago, this was not the case, and the market is growing fast.