Dodge Ram 50 Diesels Transplant

[DR1665]

Capitalism would not prevent choice, but enhance it.

In a vacuum, yes. But we live in a world of closet facism, where the Big Money influences Big Government to ensure competitive advantage, often by reducing the need to truly compete at home.

Why do the Big Three all offer small diesel versions of models available in the USDM overseas? I say it's because they have to legitimately compete without their political sway. Jeep sells a diesel version of the Wrangler Rubicon in the UK, where it has to compete against the Land Rover Defender, Toyota Landcruiser, Nissan Patrol, and such. Ford sells a diesel version of the Fiesta over there because it has to compete against the small diesels from Toyota, Nissan, Mitsubishi, and more.

And, speaking of Mitsubishi, they sell the ASX4 diesel, which is a variant of the USDM Outlander Sport - right down to the wheels - in the UK. I drove one week before last over there (courtesy Mitsubishi UK), and got 64mpg with a relatively heavy foot. It's the same platform, the same unitized structure, the same exterior sheetmetal, the same safety equipment as it's USDM cousin, so it's clearly not a case of not meeting US crash and safety standards.

I suspect the Euro 5-6 tiers of emissions standards where these small diesels are far stricter than anything we've got in the States. So clearly it's not a case of these vehicles being too dirty to meet our air quality standards. So why wouldn't Mitsubishi sell a 64mpg ASX4 alongside their 25mpg gas version in the States? Why wouldn't Ford offer the 67mpg Fiesta Diesel on their lots? I wouldn't say it's capitalism, but I'd say it's definitely crony capitalism.

How would the sub-$40k full-sized truck market change if just the Hilux diesel hit the US market at even $30k? It would dry right up. Big Three will never let that happen. Is that capitalism?

 

[off-roader]

Are diesel powered variants of vehicles taxed more when imported & sold in the states? That could be one reason they're not sold here in addition to the lack of demand for diesel from American buyers.

 

[DR1665]

Are diesel powered variants of vehicles taxed more when imported & sold in the states?

You mean like a Chicken Tax?

The more I think about this, the more it bugs me. I should probably stop thinking about it, but there's already too many of my fellow countrymen not thinking about it - and that's why we're in the situation we're in to begin with. If the owner of one team going to the Super Bowl made "generous donations" to the NFL Referees Association and it resulted in the other team incurring ridiculous penalties which all but guaranteed them to lose, we wouldn't allow it. If someone makes "generous donations" to local officials and coincidentally gets all the construction bids for municipal work, what do we call that? But in Washington DC, it's called "lobbying" and our elected "representatives" are happy to let Big Business dictate what is best for the American people.

"What's good for GM is good for America."

We had a salesman drive us from the dealership to the airport after we handed in our ASX presser and I mentioned how surprised I was to see so many L200s on the roads in the UK. He said the L200 was likely the best-selling truck in the country, with something like 27% market share. Only Land Rover Defenders seemed to outnumber it. In ten full days abroad, I saw less than 10 American trucks - and with the exception of ONE, all were 80s-90s models left behind by US servicemen/women (who probably went home with BMWs or something).

Call me bitter. Call me a pinko commie. I'm sick of blind, ignorant patriotism. "Buy American (because America)" is stupid. Buy American (because it's actually the best).

 

[off-roader]

Totally agree Brian... but that's all I'll say. Don't need to encourage anyone to get on their soap box any more than they want to be there.:sombrero:

 

[Monterorider]

I suspect the Euro 5-6 tiers of emissions standards where these small diesels are far stricter than anything we've got in the States. So clearly it's not a case of these vehicles being too dirty to meet our air quality standards. So why wouldn't Mitsubishi sell a 64mpg ASX4 alongside their 25mpg gas version in the States? Why wouldn't Ford offer the 67mpg Fiesta Diesel on their lots? I wouldn't say it's capitalism, but I'd say it's definitely crony capitalism.

You suspect big time wrong and emissions i one big reason preventing diesels from being imported.
NOX is to blame.
In EU they make special exclusion for diesels
current Euro 5 standard for diesels are 180 mg per km and for petrol is 68 mg per km.
compare that to CA (with rest of US not far behind, while some states adopt same standard as CA) current LEV - is 50 mg per mile or 31 mg per km!!! Diesel doesn't get any special treatment. Twice as stringent as EURO 5 even for gas/petrol (EURO 6 coming up in 2014 would only be 170 mg for diesels still). CA adopts even more stringent in 2014 that would cut current values by half.

How would the sub-$40k full-sized truck market change if just the Hilux diesel hit the US market at even $30k? It would dry right up. Big Three will never let that happen. Is that capitalism?

You wish. Diesel usually means +$5000-7000 to price. So they will be solidly in sub 40 market to start with. I'm not saying they won't sell it's just not such a no brainer as in UK with $9/gal gas or diesel. Those save would add up quickly.

 

[off-roader]

I suspect the Euro 5-6 tiers of emissions standards where these small diesels are far stricter than anything we've got in the States. So clearly it's not a case of these vehicles being too dirty to meet our air quality standards.

Not sure about the current standards but I'm pretty sure you're incorrect here. I know for sure that just a few years ago you couldn't buy a VW TDI's in California because they didn't meet CARB standards even though they were fine to sell everywhere else in the US or Europe.

 

[DR1665]

I wondered if that would bite me in the ***. You know what they say about assumptions...

I must have tried a dozen different sets of keywords on Google to try and find specific charts breaking down the emissions limits in the States, but all I ever got was government pages what looked like they were coded by a middle school student in 1993 with links to dozens of PDFs. Hit Wikipedia and they've got the standards neatly organized for the Euro standards in a single place.

Still, it's all moot, given a 25% Chicken Tax on light trucks not manufactured (or re-assembled) in the United States.

Meh. I just need to find a couple 4D56Ts and mind my own.

 

[WP_Rogers]

Found the thread trying to learn more about small diesels

Familiar with Gen 1 Montero's - own 4; all V-6, know they share a lot with Mighty Max P/U [which is also a Dodge Ram 50], [just learned about the Ford Ranger]

Believe the transmission on the 4 cyl and V-6 are different but not sure if I followed the conversation correctly as to a 4D55 or 56 mounting to a V6, LWB 5 speed - would be interested attempting such a swap, if it's something fairly straight forward, otherwise I'll just rebuild a Caravan 3.0 V6 and drop it in [Same engines, different oil pumps]

THANX

Wes
wesrogers0924@gmail.com

 

[plh]

Found the thread trying to learn more about small diesels

Familiar with Gen 1 Montero's - own 4; all V-6, know they share a lot with Mighty Max P/U [which is also a Dodge Ram 50], [just learned about the Ford Ranger]

Believe the transmission on the 4 cyl and V-6 are different but not sure if I followed the conversation correctly as to a 4D55 or 56 mounting to a V6, LWB 5 speed - would be interested attempting such a swap, if it's something fairly straight forward

In general - the 4D55 came in front of the km145 (same gas 4 cylinder 5 speed transmission) and the 4D56 came in front of the V5MT1 (same V6 5 speed transmission except has a 4 cylinder bellhousing pattern). So - either engine can be combined with either transmission if you have the correct parts. All stock 4 cylinder starting point is obviously easier as the 4D56 didn't come to the USA, so those bellhousings need to come from another country. I got mine in Thailand.

 

[Toasty]

I need to make a thread on this...