Frame Strength, Who to Believe! The RV Sales Guy or the New Truck Dealer? Maybe Neither?

[tacollie]

@jbaucom I think speed is a huge factor. I have a buddy with a Tacoma/FWC combo that has been that way for over 100k miles and sees a lot of off road all over Colorado and Utah. He drives slow on road and really slow off road.

Fancy shocks can really improve your driving experience. They can also get you in trouble faster?

 

[rruff]

Fancy shocks can really improve your driving experience. They can also get you in trouble faster?

Especially when "going fast" usually makes washboard more pleasant... until you get surprised by a rut.

 

[Alloy]

Ya, like... when the trailer gets air and slams down right when the rear of the truck is already bottoming out...

I'd like to know more about the provisions for crash standards. My brief search indicates that 1 ton pickups are crash rated, while 1 ton cab-chassis are not. So what exactly is done to the pickup frames to make them collapse on impact... and is this what is making them fail under load?

It also appears to be a "shortbed phenomena"... maybe where the weak part of the frame and the highest stress location coincide?

And... I wonder about fully boxed frames. They are torsionally stiff which is great, but they may not be strong enough to stand high twisting forces with a big load. In this case the initial damage to the frame was probably caused by twist, but it didn't completely fail until later.

I could only find NTSB and IIHS reports up to 3/4 ton.

Crash rating wouldn't matter because it's not going to overrule payload capacity.

My buddy owns body shop so I've seen a couple of PU that were smashed at 70-80mph......reason we take the truck NOT the car on road trips.

The more high strength steel (and aluminum) is used the more fatigue (which I'll bet is what happend in this case) cracking there's going to be. Wouldn't suprise me if the purpose of the weighing system on the new FORD trucks is to counter warranty claims. I should ask one of my buddies at FORD what happens to the warrany if it is disconnected.

 

[tacollie]

@Alloy My understanding is the scales work through the tail lights measuring suspension sag. Easy to counter sag. It was a while ago but Ford officially claimed they weren't going to track the scales to void warranties. Obviously they can change policy in the future.

 

[rruff]

Crash rating wouldn't matter because it's not going to overrule payload capacity.

Not overrule, but they are trying to satisfy conflicting goals, which means greater compromise. Bean counters and lawyers have more to say about final design than you might think.

Fully boxed frames are kind of new on heavy duty pickups, and "overlanding" is more popular as well.

The forces that a frame might be subjected to are all over the map, depending on use. Open C frames have been "reliable enough" for a long time with hard mounted service bodies. Try using one as an overlander though, and you'll probably have a cracked frame where the bed attachment terminates before long. It may be a surprising to some, but the payload number is mostly determined by scaling from past experience... the number of warranty claims, lawsuits, bad press and pissed off customers, etc. Sure there is extensive modeling, but when you are offroad the *possible* forces that the frame might be subjected to are extreme. The question is, how many customers are going to do things that cause a failure, and is dealing with the aftermath worth beefing up the frame?... which will cost more, and interfere with crash standards.

 

[AbleGuy]

@Alloy Ford officially claimed they weren't going to track the scales to void warranties.

Yeah, sure they won’t.
???

 

[Alloy]

@Alloy My understanding is the scales work through the tail lights measuring suspension sag. Easy to counter sag. It was a while ago but Ford officially claimed they weren't going to track the scales to void warranties. Obviously they can change policy in the future.

There are sensors at each corner. The taillights works the same way as bars for a battery indicator and will flash if the truck is overloaded.

 

[Alloy]

Yeah, sure they won’t.
???

The story will change from FORD "doesn't record the data" to they "had to" for the police and lawyers (insurance companies).

 

[jbaucom]

Yeah, sure they won’t.
???

I'm sure it'll be available on a case-by-case basis when it comes to warranty work. If you show up to warranty a broken frame, I'd bet that load data would be the first thing they look at.

 

[Todd780]

Well don't overload your truck and it won't be an issue. The scales help with that. I love mine.

The scales are also an option. So I guess if you're intended to run overloaded, don't order them.

Or just get a truck with a sufficient payload rating for your intended purpose....

 

[Alloy]

Well don't overload your truck and it won't be an issue. The scales help with that. I love mine.

The scales are also an option. So I guess if you're intended to run overloaded, don't order them.

Or just get a truck with a sufficient payload rating for your intended purpose....

I haven't seen the option so I assumed it was included on the 350/450/550

 

[Todd780]

I haven't seen the option so I assumed it was included on the 350/450/550

It became an option on the F150 with the 2021 redesign and will be an option on the 2023 Super Duty.

 

[Alloy]

It became an option on the F150 with the 2021 redesign and will be an option on the 2023 Super Duty.

All I've seen is "available onboard scales" and I didn't see the opton on FORD.COM when building a 2023. Might be like the 2kw inverter that's included trims above XLT

https://shop.ford.com/configure/superduty/model/customize/

 

[jbaucom]

GM will also be offering a GCWR alert system on the 2024 Silveraod & Sierra HDs.

 

[calicamper]

I still don't understand how, in some of those pictures above, there are bent frames from towing a teardrop camper. How is that possible?

I’ve seen tear drops with 500lb tongues add a steering wheel holder that does high speed whoops and pop goes the frame.