Jeep build specialist - Wrangler Willy’s ecodiesel

[chbolling]

I currently drive a 4th Gen 4Runner with a 3 inch lift, sliders, drawer system and use it to tow a very capable off-road tear drop for our off-grid adventures into the WY wilderness.

My wife runs a 2021 Wrangler Willy’s ecodiesel and I think I’m going to take it off her hands (closing in on 300K with my trusted 4runner) and mod it out for our adventures.

If I had a wish, it would be to find someone to assist with the design/build as it’s a new platform for me, and I spent *a lot* of time researching what I ultimately did with my 4Runner, and I’d love to take a reasonable shortcut to that process.

Of course I could do an AEV package, but it
seems like I could do the same/similar for less. Suspension, front/rear bumpers/winch, lighting, need for gearing?, 35’s, etc. We’re not rock crawlers. We chase trout as far off the beaten path as we can get.

Thoughts and suggestions?

 

[zgfiredude]

I think it's safe to say that fundamentally we can assist you with build advice/opinions even though it may not be diesel specific. Suspension, gears, bumpers/winch, lighting, tires etc. will be mostly universal.

Fire away, we enjoy spending other folks money!

 

[chbolling]

I think it's safe to say that fundamentally we can assist you with build advice/opinions even though it may not be diesel specific. Suspension, gears, bumpers/winch, lighting, tires etc. will be mostly universal.

Fire away, we enjoy spending other folks money!

My interests:
New front and rear bumpers, with winch
3" +/- lift with 35's: Recommended suspension set-up
Front skid
Sliders - can be simple rails
Plate and drawer system. I'll plan on doing at least a 60% rear-seat delete

The rig will tow a SoCal teardrop 510xs, which has been amazing for us.

What are the things I don't know?:
Re-gearing necessary?
What needs to come along with the suspension lift and 35's (as an example, I had to do new UCAs annd trimming just to fit 285/70 on the 4runnner)?

 

[ChasingOurTrunks]

In terms of things you don't know -- well, 99% of the jeeps I've seen on the roads are overloaded. It's easy to overload any vehicle but I think it's a bit easier with Jeep since there is no shortage of "fly by night" fab shops that produce bumpers, rails, and skidplates on the basis of "thick steel = strong product" (as opposed to engineering it with thinner steel reinforced with gusseting and angles). I would encourage you to look at reputable manufacturers of front and rear bumpers, and even consider going with an Alloy option if you can (I believe Quadratec has a few aluminum options) to reduce weight, and anywhere you can in your build, go for the lighter-weight option. There's just so much that is available for a Jeep build, so going light means you have the most flexibility later on if your design/desires shift.

Are you doing a roof rack? If yes, you may want to consider sliders with a step to make it easier to access roof things.

Regearing is probably not necessary - depends on what you are doing with it, but it should be geared well enough to tow (especially with the diesel) as is, and should be geared low enough in 4Lo to do most off-road work. If the Willy's doesn't have a rear locker I'd add that, but otherwise I'd leave the drivetrain alone.

For suspension, I would stick with manufacturers who design a full suspension system, not just a new set of shocks, springs, and lift pucks. If it were mine, I'd be looking to either AEV or Old Man Emu (ARB) exclusively, with AEV getting a bit of a nod because they have (or certainly, had) OEM-level of access, including geometry correction brackets to preserve OEM steering performance that other manufacturers do not usually offer. The cheaper lift kits often have impacts down the road on premature wear and tear; I've not really heard of anyone being disappointed with OME or AEV; I've heard of a lot of people sinking $1k into a lesser lift only to replace it (and a bunch of other components) with AEV/OME after a year or three.

 

[Jc1986.carter]

Aev makes great stuff. You can’t go wrong with it. From your previous build, you probably realize the price for top tier stuff is in the engineering. Aev took the time to make a kit that increases the ride quality of the Jeep for both on and offroad. Most Aev kits include the geometry bracket instead of new control arms upfront. You will get 100 opinions on which is better. Keeping the stock control arms and the Aev geo-bracket will improve the on road characteristics, improving how the Jeep handles braking (less nose dive and better steering feedback). Longer control arms will improve flex.

it’s apples to pears but, I have a gladiator that I have been kitting out. Would have gone the old man emu route if they had decided to release it. With the Jeep to fit 35s, a simple 2” spacer, maybe the mopar lower control arms, and either longer shocks or shock extensions. Adjustable Front and rear track bars are good to recenter the axles.

weight will be the big thing. With the eco diesel, you have a heavy front end already. Depending on how much you carry all the time will determine your spring rates.

it will be less of a problem to get bigger tires than with the Toyota or any other vehicle. Jeep almost designed these things to run 35s stock. 37s are the new 35s for Jeeps.

good luck.

 

[chbolling]

Aev makes great stuff. You can’t go wrong with it. From your previous build, you probably realize the price for top tier stuff is in the engineering. Aev took the time to make a kit that increases the ride quality of the Jeep for both on and offroad. Most Aev kits include the geometry bracket instead of new control arms upfront. You will get 100 opinions on which is better. Keeping the stock control arms and the Aev geo-bracket will improve the on road characteristics, improving how the Jeep handles braking (less nose dive and better steering feedback). Longer control arms will improve flex.

it’s apples to pears but, I have a gladiator that I have been kitting out. Would have gone the old man emu route if they had decided to release it. With the Jeep to fit 35s, a simple 2” spacer, maybe the mopar lower control arms, and either longer shocks or shock extensions. Adjustable Front and rear track bars are good to recenter the axles.

weight will be the big thing. With the eco diesel, you have a heavy front end already. Depending on how much you carry all the time will determine your spring rates.

it will be less of a problem to get bigger tires than with the Toyota or any other vehicle. Jeep almost designed these things to run 35s stock. 37s are the new 35s for Jeeps.

good luck.

Thank you! AEV remains a top choice for me, ARB has an overlanding package that looks interesting also. Is it worth considering a move to 37's? We're Wyoming backcounty and willing to take on whatever is in our way to get to the rivers, but aren't wheeling for wheeling's sake. The 4runner has capably gotten us where we need to go with the lift/armor and 265/70s. This vehicle will be my everyday vehicle, but first and foremost it's about getting out there (I don't have a commute, everyday = around town , to the ski resort, etc.)

 

[chbolling]

In terms of things you don't know -- well, 99% of the jeeps I've seen on the roads are overloaded. It's easy to overload any vehicle but I think it's a bit easier with Jeep since there is no shortage of "fly by night" fab shops that produce bumpers, rails, and skidplates on the basis of "thick steel = strong product" (as opposed to engineering it with thinner steel reinforced with gusseting and angles). I would encourage you to look at reputable manufacturers of front and rear bumpers, and even consider going with an Alloy option if you can (I believe Quadratec has a few aluminum options) to reduce weight, and anywhere you can in your build, go for the lighter-weight option. There's just so much that is available for a Jeep build, so going light means you have the most flexibility later on if your design/desires shift.

Are you doing a roof rack? If yes, you may want to consider sliders with a step to make it easier to access roof things.

Regearing is probably not necessary - depends on what you are doing with it, but it should be geared well enough to tow (especially with the diesel) as is, and should be geared low enough in 4Lo to do most off-road work. If the Willy's doesn't have a rear locker I'd add that, but otherwise I'd leave the drivetrain alone.

For suspension, I would stick with manufacturers who design a full suspension system, not just a new set of shocks, springs, and lift pucks. If it were mine, I'd be looking to either AEV or Old Man Emu (ARB) exclusively, with AEV getting a bit of a nod because they have (or certainly, had) OEM-level of access, including geometry correction brackets to preserve OEM steering performance that other manufacturers do not usually offer. The cheaper lift kits often have impacts down the road on premature wear and tear; I've not really heard of anyone being disappointed with OME or AEV; I've heard of a lot of people sinking $1k into a lesser lift only to replace it (and a bunch of other components) with AEV/OME after a year or three.

Thanks - nice to receive this type of feedback about AEV and ARB. It's hard to imagine not having some sort of roof rack, but I'm orienting toward less on the roof (have a RTT, maxtrax, awning and rod vault on my 4runner) and relying on the teardrop, with a drawer system and rods on the jeep.

 

[ChasingOurTrunks]

Thank you! AEV remains a top choice for me, ARB has an overlanding package that looks interesting also. Is it worth considering a move to 37's? We're Wyoming backcounty and willing to take on whatever is in our way to get to the rivers, but aren't wheeling for wheeling's sake. The 4runner has capably gotten us where we need to go with the lift/armor and 265/70s. This vehicle will be my everyday vehicle, but first and foremost it's about getting out there (I don't have a commute, everyday = around town , to the ski resort, etc.)

As a caveat, I've never used 37" tires on my jeep and actually maxed out at 33", but I will tell you why I did it that way.

The advantage of 37s in making it a bit easier to do things off-road is likely to be offset by the overall disadvantage of running a much bigger tire everywhere else -- 90% of my driving was on pavement to get to the interesting bits, and a 37" is a big tire for everyday highways. From what I have experienced, almost everywhere in North America is accessible with a 33" tire; you might reach for the maxtrax slightly more often with 33" than with 35" tires, but you'll get where you're going. 37" tires do not appear to be a requirement anywhere save for intentional "wheeling" parks/trails with specific kinds of obstacles, and often these will have an alternative route. Since you said you weren't planning on wheeling for wheeling's sake, I would suggest 35" should be plenty big for you.

 

[SoDakSooner]

Ive got a JKU with 37's. I'd stick with 35's. Mine are heavy at 100+ lbs per tire, and you don't need the 37's. I wheeled some crazy stuff with 35's and rarely had an issue. I just got a great deal on the 37's and decided to try. With my lift they looked better too. As far as overall weight, I am pretty minimalist. I still run a steel bumper and sliders, but the front bumper is really small. Did a rear bumper delete (that saves a bunch of weight). I can't comment on the AEV stuff, but there are less expensive alternatives that can do the job. ARB is a good outfit too, but don't know much about their armor offerings.

No such thing as a skid on a Wrangler. Just buy a heavy duty diff cover and call it good. With a solid axle there is really no need. My opinion of course. There are bumpers that drop down further, but that's as close as you get.

As far as gearing, IDK, personal choice. I don't know with the diesel platform. A lot more torque, but I don't imagine you have the lower range transfer case that is on the Rubicons. I did gears on mine and personally didn't go far enough, but with the dana 30 up front anything more than 4.56's or 4.88's. If you have 4.10's you are probably ok, but if you are running the 3.21's Id eventually plan on gearing, but drive it first and see how you like it. I pull an old M101a2 military trailer with mine and it does ok, but a bit underpowered.

Can't speak to suspension as I did my own. Mine is a combination of Artec, Core 4x4, stock, Rock Krawler, and Bilstein. Originally had a crappy smittybilt lift on it and I really just replaced all the parts with what I wanted. That said, for me that is part of the fun. I built my own under floor storage system after I took the seats out.

 

[Jc1986.carter]

Thank you! AEV remains a top choice for me, ARB has an overlanding package that looks interesting also. Is it worth considering a move to 37's? We're Wyoming backcounty and willing to take on whatever is in our way to get to the rivers, but aren't wheeling for wheeling's sake. The 4runner has capably gotten us where we need to go with the lift/armor and 265/70s. This vehicle will be my everyday vehicle, but first and foremost it's about getting out there (I don't have a commute, everyday = around town , to the ski resort, etc.)

37s cross into a territory that in my opinion isn’t necessary unless boulders are your thing or if excess stress on the vehicle is something you plan on remedying down the line. The 3rd gen Dana 44s are stout and can handle most of the stress but there are other things to consider. The difference in weight to height doesn’t justify the expense to me. They look cool though.
The diesel and the 8spd can handle most of the work on 35s too without a regear.
Again, I have a gladiator on 35s and I still drag the belly over stuff my frontier on 265s and my wk2 just breezed over but the glady has a horrible break over angle.
What one of the other posters stated, 37s are not easy to find if you do have to replace one away from most civilization. 35s are getting easier especially the 315/70r17 since they are the oem size for the Ford raptor. Losts of good hybrid options too if that’s your flavor of tire.

 

[Dan Grec]

Is it worth considering a move to 37's? We're Wyoming backcounty and willing to take on whatever is in our way to get to the rivers, but aren't wheeling for wheeling's sake. The 4runner has capably gotten us where we need to go with the lift/armor and 265/70s.

If a 4Runner on 265/70s took you everywhere you wanted to go, there's absolutely no reason a Wrangler on 285/70s won't (33s).

Way cheaper, less wear and tear on everything, quieter, better mileage, better on road manners, and still will go everywhere you want to go. That's an easy decision.

-Dan

 

[ZONE ZERO]

If a 4Runner on 265/70s took you everywhere you wanted to go, there's absolutely no reason a Wrangler on 285/70s won't (33s).

Way cheaper, less wear and tear on everything, quieter, better mileage, better on road manners, and still will go everywhere you want to go. That's an easy decision.

-Dan

at some point people will get it. ?

 

[Winterhawk]

at some point people will get it. ?

Hopefully, but they seem obsessed at this point.

Willy’s

I'm being very picky and no disrespect intended, but it's spelled Willys. Willys is pronounced Will-ys (Willis) and not Willy's (Willies). Not likely most people will ever pronounce it correctly, but it's one of my pet peeves.

 

[AggieOE]

If a 4Runner on 265/70s took you everywhere you wanted to go, there's absolutely no reason a Wrangler on 285/70s won't (33s).

Way cheaper, less wear and tear on everything, quieter, better mileage, better on road manners, and still will go everywhere you want to go. That's an easy decision.

-Dan

I definitely second this.
If you can really wrap your head around not modifying, the stock Willy's is great as-is! Especially the new JLs. I think they look great and sit just right.

Now if you add a winch and plan to trailer, heavier-duty springs would probably help since I don't think there is anything worse looking or handling than rear squat. I'd recommend staying as minimal as you can though: AEV 2.5" lift (with geo brackets) and 34" tires which is what I run. I have a Warn M8000 winch and occasionally tow a small RTT trailer with all our traveling gear and baby gear. This setup drives comfortably and hasn't seemed to stress the drivetrain or brakes. As much as 35s would better fill the wheel-wells, 10lbs extra per corner and the additional rolling resistance are probably not worth it, logically speaking.

 

[SoDakSooner]

As far as tire size goes in my case, Mine was set up originally to crawl and trail ride as we have some world class stuff around here. While not a true overlander IMO, I have mixed elements of both just to make it more versatile. If I were starting from scratch with a new jeep, I would most likely leave it nearly stock as far as running gear goes (especially tires). To be honest it sucks to drive on the road.....great off of it! Actually a Jeep Wrangler would not be my first choice as an overlanding type vehicle anyway. Mine had a 4" lift and 35's (dealer installed) when I bought it, and I REALLY didn't know what I was doing. That said, it is too late to go back for me without a lot of expense.