KTM to withdraw from DAKAR...

efuentes

Explorer
I just have to cross post this :bike_rider::bike_rider::bike_rider:

canalader@advrider.com said:
In other news...the 2016 Dakar wrapped up today with overall winner Ivo Kastan (pictured) arriving to a wildly cheering crowd in Beijing.

Kastan took advantage of his past experience to cash in on this year's new ruling which limited motor bikes to a maximum of 125cc displacement. He narrowly beat out Spain's Nani Roma on the Repsol-Derbi Terra. Rounding out the podium was "hometown hero" WEI Guanghui of China on the specially prepared JINCHENG Lallye.

ASO declared the inaugural running of the Dakar in mainland China to be a huge success following its hasty relocation from last year's Australian venue due to threats by striking Foster's brewery workers.
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cruiseroutfit

Well-known member
Put yourself in KTM's shoes (I have KTM shoes :D), this is a huge hit for them. Re-tooling their entire fleet of race bikes and retraining their riders and support tech... Huge.

Wonger if the organizers are still content with their decision?
 

R_Lefebvre

Expedition Leader
It's because now they know Yamaha will kick their asses! :D Big babies. ;)

What's behind the displacement cap? "Safety"? I don't know whether it was really to end KTM's domination, but certainly announcing this 6 months before the event is crap.

the deployment of 450cc motorcycles, which are unthinkably unsuitable for use in long-distance rallies

I dunno about that. Yamaha has done it.
 

RHINO

Expedition Leader
Put yourself in KTM's shoes (I have KTM shoes :D), this is a huge hit for them. Re-tooling their entire fleet of race bikes and retraining their riders and support tech... Huge.


ya think? i think they are just making a statement to the officials.
 

Stumpalump

Expedition Leader
Who would want a 450 adventure sport bike? KTM is the 2nd largest seller of dirt bikes and Dakar pissed them off ??? Good for KTM to tell Dakar to KMA! Funny thing is KTM has a great 450 class bike but like I said who would want it as an adventure sport type machine because it's too small and 450's need a rebuild at 90 hours. Dakar also pulled that political stunt a ways back. They need new leadership to ever make me a fan again. It's good to see the best dirt bike builder in the world and the 2nd largest got that way by doing things their own way and not by being led around. Hats off to KTM!
Signed a Honda rider
 

HelaJames

Observer
This is not the first time they have done this, 1st was when they got rid of Twins, that is when BMW got out.

Then they capped motorcycle top speed

They are doing this to end KTM Domination, every major manufacturer makes 450's so now they can maybe see a little more interest and competition in the bike class.
 

motoexplorer

New member
I can understand KTM's frustration. They've dominated the Dakar recently and this is like having the rug pulled out from under them. Plus the Dakar has always been associated as being a "big displacement" series (despite the continual downsizing over the years).

However I thought that KTM press release was a bit snotty though. That last quote was a bit underhanded I thought. I think everyone would like to see the Dakar get back to Africa, but I don't blame the organizers for what happened when they moved the Dakar to South America. I though the South American Dakar was pretty cool this year. Nice location, impressive scenery, great racing and no threat of RPG's being lobbed your way.

The Japanese (Honda, Kawasaki, Yamaha, Suzuki) have focused their efforts on 450 development and this move is no doubt engineered to get them more involved in Dakar. On one hand I'd really like to see all these companies involved. On the other hand, what made Dakar cool was that they raced larger displacement bikes.
 

HelaJames

Observer
I think a Honda 450 won the Baja 1000 last year, long been dominated by the Hond 650r.

They have won the last 2 with it because Honda quit Running and selling the 650's to market the 450.

the only reason the displacement shrunk is rule changes in the Dakar for saftey. plus can you relay call it Dakar and not be Dakar?
 

R_Lefebvre

Expedition Leader
Funny thing is KTM has a great 450 class bike but like I said who would want it as an adventure sport type machine because it's too small and 450's need a rebuild at 90 hours.

Sorry, but that's bunk. Totally depends on usage, but you can't make a blanket statement like that. I've got 40 hours on my WR250 and haven't even had to adjust the valves yet, and it's even more high strung than a 450.

I think 450's make plenty of power for this race, as demonstrated by Yamaha's 3rd place finish last year. It's just a different type of bike, it's going to be lighter overall, and probably the riders will get scaled down as well. Some of the top Dakar riders are big men, and have to be to ride those bikes like that.

I can empathize with KTM's feeling like they got the rug pulled out from under them. This should have been announced in January. But this idea about returning to the "good old days"... The smaller engines make WAY more power than they used to. This is not like being forced to ride an XR400 across the desert (which some people do, BTW.)
 
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R_Lefebvre

Expedition Leader
Huh, looks like there's been some movement on this already. Now the 450+ bikes will be allowed in 2010, but they will get a restrictor:

Bikes: on equal terms

For several years, more and more of the top bikers have won specials or finished in the leading ten overall positions using under 450cc bikes. At the same time, the smaller capacity machines have been more and more present, representing 40% of the registered riders at the start of the 2009 Dakar. Financially more accessible and more reliable than the older bikes of the previous generations and now more adapted to the demands of off-road rallies, the 450cc still have a deficit in performance that prevent them from reaching even higher ambitions. This difference will be totally erased for the 2011 Dakar during which only bikes with engines under 450cc will be accepted.

A bridle in 2010 for the amateurs over 450cc : In order to reach this objective of levelness between competitors that will open the number of potential victory contenders, a transition measure has been taken for the 2010 Dakar. Aware of the important number of competitors already having bikes of over 450cc, the organisers have decided to accept them for this edition with the obligation to set up a bridle reducing the power of the engine. This bridle, conceived to limit the performance to the level of the 450cc, will be provided by the rally organisation. On equal terms, the champions will battle it out using the qualities that define the discipline: physical endurance, piloting, navigation.



For the 2011 event, only bikes with engines below 450cc will be allowed to compete, but drivers owning KTMs more powerful than this can still, of course, enter in 2010 – on condition that a bridle is installed. David Castera answers the various questions being asked by the competitors in question.

Why is this regulation limiting the engine to 450cc being introduced ?
We all want a competition in which real contenders are more numerous, and in which the drivers are competing with similar machines in their hands. In order to achieve this, new constructors must be able to come to Dakar with real ambition. We know that the solution is to limit engines to 450cc. Yet we are also aware that some drivers own very sizeable engines ! All the pilots, professional or amateur, can of course participate in the 2010 edition - but with a bridle to limit air intake to the engine.

How will the drivers concerned obtain this bridle ?
We are working with a developer specialising in motor engineering, who will be responsible for developing the bridle to be installed on +450 cc engines.

Then, the UTAC – which is an independent technical analysis laboratory as well as an accredited European Union expert in the regulation and equipment of motor vehicles - will validate the results of our research.


Following this validation, the ASO will deliver these bridles for the month of September – in time for the period when drivers are beginning to prepare their machines. The system is very quick and simple to install – it only takes about ten minutes to fit one to a bike undergoing preparation. Once it is in place, the bridle will be visible at a glance, enabling stewards to check that a driver has not removed it.

How does it work ?
The bridle is an aluminium ring to be positioned between the carburettor and the air filter. In concrete terms, air flow will be reduced, and the ring diameter calculation will result in performance equivalent to that of bikes with 450cc engines. In terms of pure power, the 660cc will still have a slight edge so as to compensate for the difference in weight, which could otherwise penalise them.

What effect does the bridle have on the mechanical balance of the engine ?
There won't be any effect at all. On the contrary, by minimizing the load on the engine, it's almost as though the driver was being obliged to drive economically. Risk of overheating will therefore be reduced. Engine reliability will be intact.
 

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