IdaSHO
IDACAMPER
Here you go... :ylsmoke:
http://www.pirate4x4.com/forum/tow-rigs-trailers/1111870-idashos-idacamper2-0-a.html
http://www.pirate4x4.com/forum/tow-rigs-trailers/1111870-idashos-idacamper2-0-a.html
Lets talk about rigid foam insulation
- Thread starter IdaSHO
- Start date
I am installing the foam board from Home depot/lows. it only has foil on one side and a plastic type film on the other. my upper topper part is where its going. some on the metal area.
then when I get the funds I will add the Jute stuff that has foil on one side to the lower part of the van cause its mends better to the curves and such.
hope it performs as well as I hope for some winter camping.
mine is a work in progress as I need funds for the goods. plus its winter time and hard to glue in cold weather. last week we didn't get above zero.
then when I get the funds I will add the Jute stuff that has foil on one side to the lower part of the van cause its mends better to the curves and such.
hope it performs as well as I hope for some winter camping.
mine is a work in progress as I need funds for the goods. plus its winter time and hard to glue in cold weather. last week we didn't get above zero.
Jr_Explorer
Explorer
That's not a drawback! That's end of the world EMP protection! :wings:
lil_sam1983
New member
i work in the building science industry, i would go with XPS. Polyiso has been found to lose r value at colder temps. It's something to do with the blowing agent of the foam actually contracts as it gets colder therefore decreasing r value. As far as adhesion and sealing, i would recommend vulkem, it is a very flexible and very stick polyurethane sealant you can get at home depot. My boss has two pieces of xps that are joined by vulkem and are still flexible... after 20 years. The only drawback to vulkem is it STINKS while off-gassing.
lil_sam1983
New member
oh, one bonus for r-max, if you get the stuff that is branded "r-max"(i believe a dow product) it is fire rated. and can be left exposed in building situations.
IdaSHO
IDACAMPER
For the record, I'm 100% sold on XPS
We built our custom camper a bit more than 4 years ago now.
And have spent nearly a month in it, every year since building it.
Loading it up again tomorrow evening for another trip :ylsmoke:
It has performed flawlessly, all the way down to -20 or so, so far.
When considering R-value, strength, and weight, Id argue that XPS is as good as it gets.
Excellent R-value, rigid, and lightweight
Also, this is a great link that discusses the typical rigid foam options.
http://www.greenbuildingadvisor.com/articles/dept/musings/choosing-rigid-foam
We built our custom camper a bit more than 4 years ago now.
And have spent nearly a month in it, every year since building it.
Loading it up again tomorrow evening for another trip :ylsmoke:
It has performed flawlessly, all the way down to -20 or so, so far.
When considering R-value, strength, and weight, Id argue that XPS is as good as it gets.
Excellent R-value, rigid, and lightweight
Also, this is a great link that discusses the typical rigid foam options.
http://www.greenbuildingadvisor.com/articles/dept/musings/choosing-rigid-foam
southpier
Expedition Leader
have you noticed any signs of condensation? a month at a time without any would seem like a good testament to your construction materials & methods. did you add a vapor barrier (which side of the insulation) and/ or vent each bay for air circulation?
like the refrigerator light going out when the door is closed, I continue to wonder what goes on inside the wall after the inner surface is installed.
(the provided link wants me to be a "prime" member)
like the refrigerator light going out when the door is closed, I continue to wonder what goes on inside the wall after the inner surface is installed.
(the provided link wants me to be a "prime" member)
IdaSHO
IDACAMPER
With the construction methods used, there is no need for additional vapor barriers.
Prior to insulating the entire interior of the marine plywood skins as well as the VG fir framing, is 100% encapsulated in epoxy.
Then the foam is installed, tight fit, bonded to framing and the interior of the skins.
Then a layer of 3mm luan ply is used for an interior skin. Again, being bonded to the foam and framing.
It is essentially built like a hell-for-stout ice chest. And condensation that is produced will form on the windows, and frames.
With respect to accumulated condensation, there really isn't any way to 100% avoid it. Minimize it, yes, but you will never completely avoid it (with a passive system).
The only time we have more than a little bit of condensation is during the winter, when we use the camper as a ski lodge. We camp out for weeks at a time sometimes at ski resorts.
Only then do we have to address condensation as a "problem". The roof hatch collects enough that it will drip, and the aluminum frames on the dual pane insulated windows will sweat, and frost.
Best I can figure is that the added moisture being tracked in on boots, clothes, and gear push the moisture level to the point of it being an issue.
It still isnt bad though. Nothing a hand towel wont fix. I did add a roof vent a few years ago to address this issue, and it has helped a great deal.
It does effect the overall efficiency of the heating system though, as you are allowing hot air out, and drawing cold air in (from somewhere).
A non-passive method would be a dehumidifier, which would work great. But so far, it simply isn't enough to worry about.
If we were full-timing it, Id consider it. But for a few weeks or months at a time, I dont see the payoff.
When camping even in zub zero conditions, but not on a ski trip, condensation is never an issue.
The window frames will sweat a bit and frost, but there is never enough moisture to even wipe down.
Prior to insulating the entire interior of the marine plywood skins as well as the VG fir framing, is 100% encapsulated in epoxy.
Then the foam is installed, tight fit, bonded to framing and the interior of the skins.
Then a layer of 3mm luan ply is used for an interior skin. Again, being bonded to the foam and framing.
It is essentially built like a hell-for-stout ice chest. And condensation that is produced will form on the windows, and frames.
With respect to accumulated condensation, there really isn't any way to 100% avoid it. Minimize it, yes, but you will never completely avoid it (with a passive system).
The only time we have more than a little bit of condensation is during the winter, when we use the camper as a ski lodge. We camp out for weeks at a time sometimes at ski resorts.
Only then do we have to address condensation as a "problem". The roof hatch collects enough that it will drip, and the aluminum frames on the dual pane insulated windows will sweat, and frost.
Best I can figure is that the added moisture being tracked in on boots, clothes, and gear push the moisture level to the point of it being an issue.
It still isnt bad though. Nothing a hand towel wont fix. I did add a roof vent a few years ago to address this issue, and it has helped a great deal.
It does effect the overall efficiency of the heating system though, as you are allowing hot air out, and drawing cold air in (from somewhere).
A non-passive method would be a dehumidifier, which would work great. But so far, it simply isn't enough to worry about.
If we were full-timing it, Id consider it. But for a few weeks or months at a time, I dont see the payoff.
When camping even in zub zero conditions, but not on a ski trip, condensation is never an issue.
The window frames will sweat a bit and frost, but there is never enough moisture to even wipe down.
IdaSHO
IDACAMPER
Sorry about that.
Try this one.
http://www.ecohome.net/guide/polyisocyanurate-foam-hot-new-building-product-learn-use
And another
http://www.finehomebuilding.com/2009/05/01/which-rigid-insulation-should-i-choose
IdaSHO
IDACAMPER
Thanks!
The prototype used LOTS of PL Premium.
This includes bonding the foam to the structure.
Epoxy used is a marine epoxy. Although when using marine ply you can get away without any fiberglass cloth.
Lower grade plywoods tend to "check" which will crack the paint. Marine ply does not check.
As a prototype I felt like it was a good way to test the theory, so we went without glass. So far so good.
All that said, Im currently testing monstaliner and will more than likely coat the entire thing with it. :ylsmoke:
The prototype used LOTS of PL Premium.
This includes bonding the foam to the structure.
Epoxy used is a marine epoxy. Although when using marine ply you can get away without any fiberglass cloth.
Lower grade plywoods tend to "check" which will crack the paint. Marine ply does not check.
As a prototype I felt like it was a good way to test the theory, so we went without glass. So far so good.
All that said, Im currently testing monstaliner and will more than likely coat the entire thing with it. :ylsmoke: