Lifting a stock Wrangler - Questions ????

[Brian McVickers]

Hi,
So my stepfather has a 1997 Jeep Wrangler with stock suspension, drivetrain, wheels and tires. He has a few basic mods including a nice 9Klb Warn winch, some aux Hella 500 lights and a rear cargo rack to carry a couple of jerry cans.

After a few Colorado trails last week he is convinced that he needs to do a lift. I think I agree since he got pretty beat up bottoming out on several minor obstacles and we think he also blew both rear shocks that are 60K miles old and OEM.

Can anyone offer some advice and suggestions on lift kits, brands and products to consider?

What he wants:
3" lift, 33" tires and ARB air lockers front and back. The lift will be first, tires second and the lockers a far third in priority of budget, I think.

What he needs: Additional clearance so that he doesn't get beat up on easy to moderate trails. He is not rock crawling or intentionally trying to test his vehicle. He is primarily into scenic mountain passes but he wants to be able to deal with most of the obstacles he may encounter and keep on exploring.
Comfort is also a priority, nothing that will make the vehicle ride rough or rigid.
Load capacity is not a big concern, he is towing the Jeep behind an RV and using it for day trips to carry himself, my mom and thier dog along with spare tire, two jerry cans, recovery gear and maybe some supplies for the day.

Thanks for the help,
Brian
:Mechanic:

 

[articulate]

If I may: tried-n-true Old Man Emu on a TJ (97-06 Wrangler) fits a modest budget and meets the requirements above. Call it done.

 

[BIGdaddy]

a jeep Tj on 31's with a 1-2 inch lift can do the rubicon. no need for 33's...

here's a great way to build his truck:

-2" coil spacers-$15-20.00 per corner
-longer shocks or shock relocation brackets and new stock length shocks-$??.00
-31" tall tires
(the 2"coil spacer lift can be done first to get the 31" on, and the rest can be done later, if he so wishes.)

-1" brown dog motor mount lift -$80.00
-1"-1.25" JKS body lift $100.00

(these should be done together)


-Belly-up skid plate $300-400.00
-lower control arm guards $30-40.00
-engine pan skid $150.00


this route will keep his center of gravity low, and probably will not require that he regears, which
he will need to do with 33's. (at which point you would want to do the ARB's at the same time.)

 

[Mayne]

a jeep Tj on 31's with a 1-2 inch lift can do the rubicon. no need for 33's...

here's a great way to build his truck:

-2" coil spacers-$15-20.00 per corner
-longer shocks or shock relocation brackets and new stock length shocks-$??.00
-31" tall tires
(the 2"coil spacer lift can be done first to get the 31" on, and the rest can be done later, if he so wishes.)

-1" brown dog motor mount lift -$80.00
-1"-1.25" JKS body lift $100.00

(these should be done together)



-Belly-up skid plate $300-400.00
-lower control arm guards $30-40.00
-engine pan skid $150.00


this route will keep his center of gravity low, and probably will not require that he regears, which
he will need to do with 33's. (at which point you would want to do the ARB's at the same time.)

Although I agree with the price of a puck lift, I've heard with a TJ of the '97 vintage, it's probably better to replace the springs. The coils tend to sag after many years. My 05 carries a good amount of weight with bumpers, racks, hand top, winch, and the stock bouncy bits need help already.


Mayne

 

[BIGdaddy]

Although I agree with the price of a puck lift, I've heard with a TJ of the '97 vintage, it's probably better to replace the springs. The coils tend to sag after many years. My 05 carries a good amount of weight with bumpers, racks, hand top, winch, and the stock bouncy bits need help already.


Mayne

groovy, just go for the OME in that case...you're gonna need to drop about 700-800.00, though.

quite a bit different than 70 or 80 for the pucks...

OR

he could find some wrangler rubicon springs in a junk yard that give about 1-1.5" over stock...thats a low buck way to go.

 

[kjp98TJ]

i too would lean toward a full lift kit. can't miss with OME. BDS has good springs also, and a good warranty in my dealings. to go along with the bottoming out, a good high clearance skid would be a good choice. course that bumps up the price quite a bit, with the req'd SYE, new driveshaft, new adj uppers and new adj rear track bar.....

 

[Brian McVickers]

Thanks everyone, all good suggestions.

I know he does not want to go through the expense of regearing so maybe the tire size needs to be reconsidered. In addition he will probably have a shop do the install.

I'll probably recommend to him to go with the OME spring and shock kit and be done. He'll probably only be on trails to really appreciate the additoinal mods about two weeks of every year, other than that its basic fire roads.

Thanks again,
Brian

 

[TJVach]

I'd like to chime in just to ask you a couple of questions. If he doesn't want to regear then he probably has 3.07 gears. If he wants to go to 33's then he is going to lose 5th gear & the ability to crawl (control) over obstacles. I know that you said he doesn't want to do any extreme rock crawling but 33's and 3.07's stink. This is what I have right now and I am saving up for a regear shortly.

If he is going to be doing mountain passes and fire roads then 31's should fit the bill because then he won't get caught up in the snowballing effect.

An Old Man Emu (OME) kit is absolutely perfect (in my opinion) for this type of vehicle. One thing to do is to determine the ending weight of the truck. There are many different spring rates/options for a TJ (including LJ and ZJ springs for additional weight capacities) with the OME springs. I purchased my kit from DPGOffroad and a gentleman by the name of Dirk was one of the biggest helps in choosing the correct springs for my truck and I think he could do just as an outstanding job helping you out, even if you don't purchase from him he will be able to help you with the different spring options.

With only 31's you might not need a body lift and might be able to get by with no Motor Mount Lift as long as he doesn't have vibrations due to the rear driveline angle. Hopefully this helps you out somewhat.

 

[Nullifier]

I have installed several rubicon express lift both short and long arm. The full short arm kit with replacement arms is a sick little kit and puts up great flex numbers for a short arm kit. You could go with the ome springs and shocks and then the rest of the rubicon express lift for maximum performance. You can fit 33x10.50 no issue so 255/85 should fit as well. If I was building a mix use rig (d.d and trail) this is what I would do

 

[WFTW]

1. Join a Jeep club.
2. If they're nice guys, I'm betting they wouldn't have an issue helping with the install of the lift.

This would save you about $800 to $1000 (which can be put towards parts) as well as be a learning experience...not to mention a great way to meet fellow wheelers.

 

[maximumrob]

1. Join a Jeep club.
2. If they're nice guys, I'm betting they wouldn't have an issue helping with the install of the lift.

This would save you about $800 to $1000 (which can be put towards parts) as well as be a learning experience...not to mention a great way to meet fellow wheelers.

Agreed. Best way to learn is to talk face-to-face with guys who've spent way too much money doing it wrong.

By the way, I recommend the ProComp 2.5" spring lift with adjustable MX-6 shocks. It's cheaper than the OME and you get to set the shocks where you want them. I love the ride and it flexes great once the springs are broken in after a few hundred miles. You'll need to buy a 1" spacer for the front, though. My 3/4" spacer is just a touch short for me now that the springs have settled. Without any spacer at all, it will have a severe rake.

The only downside is that you must deal with 4WP (they were fine a few times, then let me down...you know the story, I'm sure!).



.

 

[mrchips]

Use Rubicon Express Springs, Or A Re Short Arm Lift, Can Be Installed Yourself. They Are The Best Out There, And As For Pro Comp, It Is Only A Budget Get Started Lift, And You Will Land Up Replacing It , Buy Something Worth While From The Start, That Will Last, And Do It Right Because Your Wheeling Will Change As You Get More Confident And You Realize The Potential Of The Vehicle.

 

[madizell]

My 3/4" spacer is just a touch short for me now that the springs have settled.

Just personal opinion here, but high quality springs don't settle to any appreciable degree if properly matched to the job, properly installed, and not allowed to over-cycle (read: use bump stops and limit straps for hard off road use). Any number of 20 year old trucks on OEM springs ride at the same height they did when new, give or take a fraction due to bushing compliance and general wear. Besides, the difference between a 3/4" and 1" spacer is only 1/4", a difference that generally you can't see in a lift, new or otherwise. Move a spare tire from left side to right and you will get a quarter inch or more of suspension deflection. We usually don't see these small changes, and they should make no difference in suspension performance.

Have your springs actually settled, and if so, by how much? I was thinking that it could just be a perception now that you are used to the new set up, that it no longer seems as high as it did when new. Measuring ride height now won't do much good unless you measured the height following installation and a trip around the park to "settle" all the parts, but settling of the suspension is not the same as sagging of springs caused by permanent loss of length. I have heard lots of comments over the years about springs "settling" or "sagging" after a year or so of use, but have not seen many instances backed by data. For the price of high quality suspension parts, we should not be expecting or accepting as the norm any measurable degree of sag after as little as one or two years.

For the intended use as described, I would go with a short-arm kit with very modest lift, and stay with 31's at most. You can cover any reasonable terrain on the planet on 31" tires. For that matter, you could do the same thing with stock tires and focus on armoring the bottom of the vehicle, then let it bang from time to time. We all drag bottom, no matter how much lift we have. It just take a different set of circumstances.

 

[maximumrob]

Maybe "settled" is the wrong word. :shakin: The truck is still at or very near original height, but I've decided that I should have used a 1" spacer.

Anyhow, to the Original Poster, most will sing the praises of Rubicon Express, but it's not the only lift package out there and at modest heights, you have LOTS of quality choices. I've even heard of Rough Country guys loving their 4" kits, and occasionally a Skyjacker guy, too.

Hey Mr. Chips, Why Do You Capitalize The First Letter Of Every Word?


.

 

[mrchips]

Caps lock was on, on the keyboard. This better,,,,,

Also using a ACOS spacer is good to adjust ride height, or adjust for extra weight on front or rear of Jeep.