Looking for a hand held 1st HAM

[ScoutII]

I total agree. With HAM radio you need to get involved with a group, so you can learn about how the public service folks work with HAM during a flood or other type disaster. Your best bet is to get ahold of another HAM that can call 911 on a hardline. For example: Somebody in your group has a heart attack.
Some repeaters allow you to call 911 if they have it setup.

 

[ScoutII]

I'm curious, where in California do you use Ham radios to talk to helicopter pilots in an emergency? What county is this taking place in?

I guess I'm not in the norm so I better provide an example.

Real life drama from last year. It was about 9 pm when a guy in a pickup got out of his truck to check a big drop off that was in front of him. The vehicle started to roll forward and he got caught in the door and the vehicle rolled on top of him causing major injuries. Some in the group started on first aid while another ran down the trail looking for somebody with a HAM radio, as there is no cell Ph service to call for help.
The HAM radio operator was able to get a hold of other HAM operator that is a SAR veteran and they call in for a life flight helicopter, to rush the young man to the hospital. Since they were off road the helicopter just can't land anywhere as it's hilly, brush covered, trees, water, etc. They gave there general location and a second HAM operator knew of a GPS location not far from where they where to give to the life flight folks. The problem is the lading zone is still very small and its night time. The HAM operator in the field can help guide the pilot in. Remember they are going fast so it easy to over shoot the GPS location and time is of importance. The HAM on the ground makes sure everyone has turned off there lights in the area and only he has a light. He talks with the pilot letting him know he hears him coming, and pilot will respond as he sees the light. The next thing is you need to provide hazard information, like large tree to the north. They also like to know wind direction. We carry a small strip of flagging tape. Once they get close they turn on there light. You also need to make sure nothing is around to get sucked up. Like take your hat off if your wearing one. No tents near by,etc. If something were to get sucked up the pilot would have to call for back up and mechanic to check out the engine( i.e. not a happy pilot)
The young man's life was saved. As to his recovery, he had 9 broken ribs, puntured lung, bronken shoulder and a concussion.

FWIW only the CHP helicopters have a long line so they don't need to land.

I can't find the news article at the moment. It was back on 8/22/2009 or 23

 

[gary in ohio]

Subpart E—Providing Emergency
Communications

97.401 Operation during a disaster

Nothing in 97.401 says you can operate out of band. with the exception of alaska emergency channel.

97.403 Safety of life and protection of property.
97.405 Station in distress.

It says you can use any means to to communicate. When the rule was create there was no out of band radios. The rule ment that you could operate SSB if you only had CW license. you will find similar worded rules in almost all radio parts. It allows a non-ham to use a ham radio to called for help. It was never intended to allow hams out of band.

97.407 Radio amateur civil emergency service.

Unless your a an approved RACES station this doesnt apply to you and still doesnt give you the ability to talk outside the ham bands.

97.111 part 3
Transmissions necessary to exchange
messages with a station in another
FCC-regulated service while providing
emergency communications

This is the one that allows transmissions outside of the ham bands, but ONLY in an emergency (IMMEDIATE THREAT TO LIFE). The instance the threat is gone the transmission is illegal. This doesn't give a ham or a fire squad the right to use ham radio to coordinate an attack on a forest fire. It doesnt allow a EMS to use ham radio because they are always responding to an emergency.

I wont even count armed forces day when you can talk with the military.

Armed forces day has nothing to do with out of band transmission. At no time does the ham radio signal go out of band. Yes you are cross banding between services but the hams transmits on the ham bands a listens in the military band and the military transmits on the military band and receives in the ham bands.

[/QUOTE]

 

[ScoutII]

Google is your friend:victory:

I guess I can't write or your work for 60 minutes.

 

[ScoutII]

I'm also not sure where you're getting your information about helicopters and their capabilities, ie, "long lines" but you're completely and totally incorrect.
.

I'm not talking about every kind of helicopter made! If you call for a life flight they anit coming with a long line, so they have to land.

I was not the "HAM operator" if I was I would said "I"
I can't be the only person on this board that got a radio in case of an emergency. If the local police or fire or anybody that serves in the that capacity was around. I would get them, they have better training to handle such issue. But that is not allways the case. When your in timbucktoo ( that is a pun for some place way out there) you need to take some responsibliy and be ready. Would you go off the beaten path and not take a spare tire?

I goolge a story for you, not the one I was looking for. But you can see groups of people use there radios for than just ******** chat.
http://elkodaily.com/news/local/article_e337a954-f9d4-11df-8201-001cc4c002e0.html

http://www.arrl.org/news/california-hams-help-coordinate-off-road-rescue

 

[rambrush]

Just take a deep breath, anytime anyone makes a comment about moding radios there will be a flood of anti people who will enjoy making ones life miserable.
So just kick back and let them vent, then go google your particular radio and maybe take a look at the pages under modifications.

 

[gary in ohio]

If jumping on the helicopter with your portable raido was a once in a life time event to save someone then yes its legal. If its your standard operating procedure then its not.

If there was NO one else on the ground with a radio that could talk to the helicopter then it would be legal, If there was anyone in another radio service
on the ground this it would not be legal.

 

[xtatik]

Just take a deep breath, anytime anyone makes a comment about moding radios there will be a flood of anti people who will enjoy making ones life miserable.
So just kick back and let them vent, then go google your particular radio and maybe take a look at the pages under modifications.

Truth be told...I was biting my tongue and trying to stay civil and informative.
There's a huge difference between trying to make someone miserable and nudging them back on to the right side of the law. I don't care if people mod their radios. Hell, half the clowns that do it end up destroying them in the process anyway. I just don't want them transmitting on them outside their assigned spectrum without knowing what their doing.
The last thing I want to read in Amateur Radio sites or rags are about abuses coming from within offroad community. There was a rash of abuses a few years back in the yachting community. Fortunately, there were enough good operators amongst them to coerce the rest into accord. I'm certain we can set a better example...we've done so to this point, and we're one of the fastest growing segments in the Amateur community.

 

[ScoutII]

Just take a deep breath, anytime anyone makes a comment about moding radios there will be a flood of anti people who will enjoy making ones life miserable.
So just kick back and let them vent, then go google your particular radio and maybe take a look at the pages under modifications.

Np, when xtatik posted misleading info I had to do may part to show what he said is not what is written. I'm game for discussing part 97 as written. Not making assumption, reading between the line,etc. John everyone must make there own decisions. I'm mean you get in your car and don't break the law, why? Because you know the rules of the road. Same thing with HAM radio you need to know the rules. You need to learn cut and paste or something as I never told anyone to do something wrong. If modding your radio is wrong post that section up. If helping somebody so there life is saved and that is wrong post up that section. Get my point, you and xtatik are posting stuff that is not 100% true. Its like you two are trying to intimidate people, whats up with that?

Try posting the rules as written, so people learn right way. I posted the link to part 97 so it should be easy for everyone to find it and read it. It's a seachable pdf.
so as xtatik said "I'm certain we can set a better example"

 

[wildmed]

OK so lets clear some things up.... As a SAR team rescue professional, at least in my area, you can tx on government channels. A rescuer you have a designated government radio call sign, just like a police/firefighter, and you use the radios JUST as they would. We even have our own tactical channels here. This was never a question of if Mtn. rescuers are allowed to transmit on those channels. After talking to some higher ups on the team I have decided that a vertex standard Hand held that transmits through both the HAM and the government bands stock, is the best option for my multiple uses. I have checked, and this is legal. Thanks everyone for your input, I appreciate it.

 

[ScoutII]

First working within the system is better than outside, when it come to needing help. i.e if your cell ph works and you need help, call 911.
Its a system that works. No need to complicated if you don't need too.

If you need a second spare tire, thats not a 911 call.


Here its spelled out in plain English.

§ 97.403 Safety of life and protection of property.
No provision of these rules prevents
the use by an amateur station of any
means of radiocommunication at its
disposal to provide essential communication
needs in connection with the immediate safety of human life and immediate
protection of property when normal communication systems are not available

Most people don't need life saving measures. Thats were a HAM radio works really well too. You can call your friends and ask for help, because you need a second spare tire.

 

[ScoutII]

OK so lets clear some things up.... As a SAR team rescue professional, at least in my area, you can tx on government channels. A rescuer you have a designated government radio call sign, just like a police/firefighter, and you use the radios JUST as they would. We even have our own tactical channels here. This was never a question of if Mtn. rescuers are allowed to transmit on those channels. After talking to some higher ups on the team I have decided that a vertex standard Hand held that transmits through both the HAM and the government bands stock, is the best option for my multiple uses. I have checked, and this is legal. Thanks everyone for your input, I appreciate it.

Sorry for the total hijack of your thead.

Glad you found a radio

 

[xtatik]

OK so lets clear some things up.... As a SAR team rescue professional, at least in my area, you can tx on government channels. A rescuer you have a designated government radio call sign, just like a police/firefighter, and you use the radios JUST as they would. We even have our own tactical channels here. This was never a question of if Mtn. rescuers are allowed to transmit on those channels. After talking to some higher ups on the team I have decided that a vertex standard Hand held that transmits through both the HAM and the government bands stock, is the best option for my multiple uses. I have checked, and this is legal. Thanks everyone for your input, I appreciate it.

A Vertex could be the answer...not sure which model you're considering. As I stated earlier, you can use nearly any type of equipment within the Amateur Service. This is in keeping with the hobbyist history of homebrewing and modifiying old military and broadcast equipment for use in the ham bands. The FCC's assumption is that hams know more about what they are doing with radios than other services. Other services are usually channelised and simplified for "non-radio types" of personnel that would usually be reliant on hired techs to keep their radios in alignment. With the exception of the Military Affiliate service (requires its own licensing), you cannot use amateur "type certified" equipment in other type certified services. If you're a licensed ham, you can tackle the problem from the opposite direction by using equipment that is type certified for other services.

 

[gary in ohio]

Many of kenwoods radio part 90 radio's will also work on the ham bands.

 

[rambrush]

and I will just lay back and watch, like a soap opera