Mercedes Vario 4x4 vs. Iveco Daily 4x4 vs. Volkswagen LT 4x4

U

Ukrainian

New member
Hello, my name is Bo and I am planning a road trip all around Europe with Turkey, Bulgaria, Georgia and Kazakhstan included. I definitely need a good 4x4 off-road van (for somewhat stealth camping, that is legal in European cities) and off-roading through Alps, Carpathians and Kazakhstanian deserts. Now I need to choose a base vehicle for my expedition. And I have some ideas on what kind of vehicle I may want to use for my trip.
  • Volkswagen LT 4x4
  • Mercedes Vario 4x4
  • Iveco Daily 4x4
 
Haf-E

Haf-E

Expedition Leader
Welcome! I would suggest you consider the Mercedes Vario 4x4 as it is a better supported vehicle - meaning the ability to get parts and repairs completed. It also is quite wide which allows a bed to be placed across the back, allowing for more usable space inside. This, of course, depends on your height - but I think it is close to 2 meters in width internally. Only downside of the Vario is the rear axle which is a dually setup but that can be addressed with custom rims to allow use of single tires instead.

The VW LT diesel uses an engine that is becoming difficult to get parts for from what I have heard from the few people I know who have them.
 
U

Ukrainian

New member
Okay, so I finally got to the computer again - and my ideas are:

Iveco - a great and awesome off-roader, but it's a little too small for a setup with shower and toilet. Hard to find.
Mercedes - a great vehicle, with not bad off-road capabilities and easy to find parts. However, it might be too big to park in the European cities. And hard to find.
Volkswagen - the easiest one to convert to a camper - I can buy two donor vehicles - a 4x4 van and a Westfalia camper and just swap the 4x4 drivetrain into the westfalia. Plus there are tonns of them on mobile.de


If anyone would be able to send me some links where I can buy a used Iveco Daily 4x4 or Mercedes Vario 4x4 van from any European country - I would highly appreciate that.
 
U

Ukrainian

New member
Oh, and I just found the strange 4x4 Sprinter of the previous generation.
I havent heard of Mercedes making that Sprinter generation 4x4. And I don't think it's any good off-road.
What's your opinion, Expedition Portal?
 
U

Ukrainian

New member
No, I am talking about 2003-2006 Mercedes Sprinter of the last generation. I found some of them for sale as 4x4 versions on mobile.de
 
U

Ukrainian

New member
Have anyone heard of Renault Mascott 4x4? It looks like a great vehicle, and very capable off road! Any info, ExPo?
 
luthj

luthj

Engineer In Residence
The T1N sprinters are a fairly good platform. The 118" and 140" wheelbase versions are suitable for moderate off road use with 4x4 fitted. Iglhaut/Allrad converted/converts sprinters for expedition and off-road use. These vans would be more capable that the factory 4x4 conversion. They are are not wide enough for tall people to sleep sideways without a window flare. Not a problem if you are under 175cm tall. The single rear wheel models have a payload capacity of around 1400kg, which is sufficient for a light-weight build-out. With a mild lift these vans have good ground clearance. Factory 4x4 vans had additional lift for ground clearance.

The T1N sprinters were available in Europe with several different transfer cases. Some had a low range I believe. We never got the 4x4 option in North America, so I cannot say for certain. The Australia members on the Sprinter Source forum have positive things to say about the Factory 4x4 setup and its reliability. Locking differentials were optional. For true off-road (not just back-road) use, a locking rear diff would be ideal.

The 2.7L 5 cylinder engine in these vans are reliable, and parts should be available. In europe a 4 cylinder engine was also available (may be the most common option).

The Renault and TN/T1 sprinter were never sold in North America. A lot of the posters in this forum are from North America, so you may get limited responses on these vehicles.
 
derjack

derjack

Adventurer
I think you need to give some more info, most important the planned budget!

VW LT aren't hard to find in GER and I can see them everywhere. Though 4x4 is a different topic. LT is a very old platform from the 70ies? It's the 4.5t truck. I personally like them but wouldn't want one. Engines aren't a big problem as these are similar to Volvo diesel.

Sprinter depends on year. The never generation are good without a doubt. Not very good off-road, because these are very low. This has its benefits on the other hand. Service and price stability is great. Many parts etc.

Iveco 40.10 are availible in different lengths. I once owned the short one. Check out my website for details and pictures. I loved the style. Very capable off-road!!! Very loud, very slow, very very handy in cities!! I owned the 2.8m wheel base 4.8m total one. Parts available via iveco every where, but partly very expensive, like 4x4 stuff. Engine is reliable from from VM Italy. Same engine in the - totally different- 4*2 trucks.
Side note: people loved my iveco all over Europe! Not a bad thing if you don't want to bother with neighbors anywhere.

Now I changed to an E350 Quigley. Reasons are on my website also. In a nutshell: little more room. Way more power. More comfortable to ride. Way more configurations possible like: gears, power, tires, suspension.
 
Haf-E

Haf-E

Expedition Leader
Always interesting to see a European based overlander who uses an American vehicle as we too often here in the US are always wanting what we can't get from across the pond. Guess that the grass is always greener...

I suppose one other factor in addition to the budget is where you plan to go with the vehicle - what countries?
 
derjack

derjack

Adventurer
Haf-E said:
Always interesting to see a European based overlander who uses an American vehicle as we too often here in the US are always wanting what we can't get from across the pond. Guess that the grass is always greener...

I suppose one other factor in addition to the budget is where you plan to go with the vehicle - what countries?
Click to expand...

Kind of true but I was looking for specific USPs. Ford has its downsides also, like the turning circle is critical in Europe. I live in a 1 million city, streets are partly not passable with my Quigley.

BUT parts in our days are globally no big deal anymore. DHL/UPS etc brings parts within days everywhere in the world. Nice thing is with US cars: parts stores are everywhere and online stores also. Different story with iveco!!!!


PS: Iveco vans, the Belgium police used these can in short wheelbase but with a nice (1.6m height) body. These are now all on sale by dealers. Very very good device to start. But there Belgium cars are all very rusty.
https://www.derjackistweg.de/iveco-40-10-wm-in-der-allradler-spater-ruhm/
 
U

Ukrainian

New member
derjack said:
Now I changed to an E350 Quigley. Reasons are on my website also. In a nutshell: little more room. Way more power. More comfortable to ride. Way more configurations possible like: gears, power, tires, suspension.
Click to expand...

I am temporarily living in Austin, Texas right now, and returning back to Ukraine this summer. I had a chance to drive a Quigley Ford E350 conversion van (the luxury conversion, not a camper though) - and I LOVED it. With a diesel engine it has a decent mileage, many truck accessories fit for off-road use and it is extremely comfortable, however - I don't feel like it's something I'm ready to drive around Europe, too big of an investment for me.

My budget for the expedition setup (vehicle, gear, preparation costs) will be around 15 000 Euros total. But it's negotiable - which means, that if I will find something I really like - I'm ready to invest in it. Afterwards - I will continue to work as a freelance programmer on the road.

There will be another person with me, one of my friends, who will also do freelance jobs online, while travelling, so we will be able to afford proper maintenance and long-term trips.

As I said before - our trip will include literally all of the European countries (basically EU) + Ukraine, Bulgaria, Turkey, Georgia and Kazakhstan.

Which means, that we will face a legitimate amount of off-road (or really bad roads) during our journey.

I am a mountain biker, rock climber and kayaker, so we will need to cruise in the remote areas of Alps, Carpathians and Caucasus. During the winter we will often do skiing and sledding, so we will face a lot of harsh snow. During our Kazakhstan part of a trip we will face many desert roads, and long distance travelling.

Taking the above conditions to consideration - a Mercedes Sprinter would probably be too bad of an off-road vehicle for the conditions, that we will meet, with river crossings, mud, mountains, deserts and stuff.
 
U

Ukrainian

New member
So, I did way more research during the previous days, and I believe, that Volkswagen will actually win over the Iveco in terms of parts accessibility, because 4x4 Ivecos were not popular at all. Speaking of Mercedes - it is a great platform, very decent off road, many parts available and stuff like that, but I haven't found any 4x4 vans in any european websites for sale yet, except one in Germany, that is too expensive for me.

Conclussion -
Mercedes are rare and expensive.
Ivecos - small, and bad on parts (especially in the Eastern Europe and Kazakhstan)
Volkswagen - seem to be good off-road, easy to find, cheap, easy to restore. However there are many rumours about parts being hard to find. How true are those?

And if I would build a volkswagen - is it worth to take a westfalia LT and just swap 4x4 components from a 4x4 truck?
If so, would'nt it suck off road, because of weight and top-heavy configuration?
Maybe it will be better to buy a used 4x4 van and then reconfigure it to a camper, with more lightweight setup?
What do you think, expedition portal?
 
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