micklongley
Observer
Hello everyone,
In this thread I'd like to document my experience with Trail Worthy Fab (TWF) and their modification of 8-bolt two piece HMMWV wheels. These wheels are military surplus and TWF goes through them completely - removing the original paint, new O-rings, wheel bolts, etc. They provide a very nice product with excellent welding on the recentered wheel, and a very nice finish. I hope others with benefit from my work and can avoid, or at least know, the pitfalls that come with this wheel option.
Benefits and Options for this wheel and tire:
The reason I chose to pioneer these wheels for these trucks was the fact that they provide huge benefits when travelling off-pavement. One of the biggest things for me was the ability to change and mount a tire to a wheel completely by myself in the backcountry. Since these wheels are two piece, one is able to air down the tire, remove the outer bolts, remove the outside bead lock ring, and pull the tire off of the inner wheel. This allows me to carry spare tires without a wheel and replace a tire instead of a tire/wheel combo if necessary.
Another benefit to the Hummer wheel is the option of using run flats. Run Flats allow you to escape threatening situations even if your tires sidewall has been shredded and the tire has 0 psi. This was very appealing to me as an option.
My current setup uses a PVC insert that allows for double bead lock of the tire. If you are unfamiliar with bead lock you might be missing out on a very functional feature. I have popped beads on aired down tires without bead locks when in the mountains of Colorado and it's no fun. Without a large source of air it is very hard to reseat a bead on a tire and wheel. Bead Locks allow me to air down very far, 0 if needed, and not worry about popping a bead. Since I have a two wheel drive truck this helps tremendously with traction and I can usually crawl over everything I need to.
So with these benefits I believe the HMMWV wheel is a great option for those who are light enough to run them. My current setup is roughly 9500 lbs in typical short expedition trim. Each 8-bolt wheel is rated at 2850 lbs. in stock form, there hasn't been any scientific testing but I believe recentering the wheels to the Fuso bolt pattern adds to the capacity of the wheels. In stock form the wheel is 16.5x8.25" with 7" backspacing - that is quite a bit off-center and I believe putting the backspacing at 4.5" centers the load more, allowing for a stronger combination (remember, this is all speculation at this point). The 37x12.5" Goodyear Wrangler has a capacity of 3850 lbs/tire if I remember correctly. The 12-bolt HMMWV wheel has a rating of 3850 lbs/wheel I believe. This is a better option and I would go this direction if possible.
Another fantastic benefit for me was increasing my stock tire size by 17%. This allowed me to lower my highway cruising rpm from 2500-2800 down to 2000-2200. Believe it or not, these large tires actually lowered my fuel usage. I was at roughly 10-13mpg and now average 13-16mpg. The power still feels okay but I am running the larger 6cyl 5.9L turbo diesel in my Fuso FH. Smaller engines may be affected more than I.
Track Width:
I chose to use 4.5" backspacing on the front wheel and 2" BS on the rear. My front wheels track wider than the rear. This is unnoticeable on and offroad for me, but others may have problems with their tracks not lining up perfectly. This difference shows when you look at the truck. With my camper removed from my Fuso FH it is very noticeable that the front is wider. With my camper loaded it actually looks balanced. The wider stance up front is common on American 4x4's but usually only by about 2" total, mine is a little more but I haven't measured.
One of the major drawbacks of running different backspacing on the front and rear axles is that you either run wheels that are lug nut tapered to be mounted in either direction, or carry two spares. In the Hummer wheel scenario one can replace a tire with the wheel still bolted to the truck, making it unnecessary to carry a spare wheel. I love this (if you haven't noticed already!). Wheels DO fail and I would still recommend carrying a spare wheel if you were very far from civilization, but this is uncommon.
Bolt Pattern:
Here is where things get tricky... The bolt pattern for a 6 lug Fuso/Isuzu/other med. duty truck is generally 6x8.75" with a center bore of 6.5" and a stud hole bore of 1.313". A very popular heavy axle in the offroading community is the Rockwell 2.5 ton axle. It uses the same bolt pattern/center bore/stud bore as our trucks. Marsh Racing Wheel (MRW) states that these are the correct figures for the "Rockwell" bolt pattern. Trail Worthy Fab, who I ordered wheels from, states that the previous specifications are correct EXCEPT for the stud bore. TWF states that 0.85" is the correct stud bore size. Take a look at the photos below and notice the difference in the stud bore size - it's startling.
Since I received these wheels from TWF expecting the "Rockwell" pattern I was pretty distraught when I noticed the big difference in stud bore size. TWF relied on me to take my original lug nuts to a machine shop and have them machined to fit the 0.85" bore size and taper. This was an acceptable fix for me but it added extra cost and headache to what could have been a very easy solution. My suggestion to Andy at TWF was to use the correct Rockwell specifications (1.313" stud bore) instead of having to machine lug nuts.
That being said, I have been running these wheels for nearly 6,000 miles and they have not budged, or loosened whatsoever. I put a reference mark on each lug nut so I would notice if they are loosening or not.
Summary:
I love these wheels and tires. The Goodyear Wranglers have a great tread pattern with minimal road noise. These are incredibly stout tires and flex well at low inflation. For an overland rig I believe this tire and wheel combo is a great choice. The great appeal I see is the ability to go to Single Rear Wheel (SRW), go to a larger tire allowing for better fuel economy, and the many options available for this wheel.
I have had great experience with traction on my two wheel drive truck with my camper loaded. Due to the size of tire and double bead lock I am able to air down to very low pressures and my treads resemble a tank track more than a tire. I would recommend this wheelset if you can actually get Trail Worthy Fab, or other hummer wheel recentering outfit, to use the actual "Rockwell" pattern with a 1.313" stud bore size.
Feel free to let me know if you have any questions about this wheelset.
Mick
My Fuso is for sale here: http://www.expeditionportal.com/for...y-and-in-Durango-CO-25-000-obo?highlight=fuso
In this thread I'd like to document my experience with Trail Worthy Fab (TWF) and their modification of 8-bolt two piece HMMWV wheels. These wheels are military surplus and TWF goes through them completely - removing the original paint, new O-rings, wheel bolts, etc. They provide a very nice product with excellent welding on the recentered wheel, and a very nice finish. I hope others with benefit from my work and can avoid, or at least know, the pitfalls that come with this wheel option.
Benefits and Options for this wheel and tire:
The reason I chose to pioneer these wheels for these trucks was the fact that they provide huge benefits when travelling off-pavement. One of the biggest things for me was the ability to change and mount a tire to a wheel completely by myself in the backcountry. Since these wheels are two piece, one is able to air down the tire, remove the outer bolts, remove the outside bead lock ring, and pull the tire off of the inner wheel. This allows me to carry spare tires without a wheel and replace a tire instead of a tire/wheel combo if necessary.
Another benefit to the Hummer wheel is the option of using run flats. Run Flats allow you to escape threatening situations even if your tires sidewall has been shredded and the tire has 0 psi. This was very appealing to me as an option.
My current setup uses a PVC insert that allows for double bead lock of the tire. If you are unfamiliar with bead lock you might be missing out on a very functional feature. I have popped beads on aired down tires without bead locks when in the mountains of Colorado and it's no fun. Without a large source of air it is very hard to reseat a bead on a tire and wheel. Bead Locks allow me to air down very far, 0 if needed, and not worry about popping a bead. Since I have a two wheel drive truck this helps tremendously with traction and I can usually crawl over everything I need to.
So with these benefits I believe the HMMWV wheel is a great option for those who are light enough to run them. My current setup is roughly 9500 lbs in typical short expedition trim. Each 8-bolt wheel is rated at 2850 lbs. in stock form, there hasn't been any scientific testing but I believe recentering the wheels to the Fuso bolt pattern adds to the capacity of the wheels. In stock form the wheel is 16.5x8.25" with 7" backspacing - that is quite a bit off-center and I believe putting the backspacing at 4.5" centers the load more, allowing for a stronger combination (remember, this is all speculation at this point). The 37x12.5" Goodyear Wrangler has a capacity of 3850 lbs/tire if I remember correctly. The 12-bolt HMMWV wheel has a rating of 3850 lbs/wheel I believe. This is a better option and I would go this direction if possible.
Another fantastic benefit for me was increasing my stock tire size by 17%. This allowed me to lower my highway cruising rpm from 2500-2800 down to 2000-2200. Believe it or not, these large tires actually lowered my fuel usage. I was at roughly 10-13mpg and now average 13-16mpg. The power still feels okay but I am running the larger 6cyl 5.9L turbo diesel in my Fuso FH. Smaller engines may be affected more than I.
Track Width:
I chose to use 4.5" backspacing on the front wheel and 2" BS on the rear. My front wheels track wider than the rear. This is unnoticeable on and offroad for me, but others may have problems with their tracks not lining up perfectly. This difference shows when you look at the truck. With my camper removed from my Fuso FH it is very noticeable that the front is wider. With my camper loaded it actually looks balanced. The wider stance up front is common on American 4x4's but usually only by about 2" total, mine is a little more but I haven't measured.
One of the major drawbacks of running different backspacing on the front and rear axles is that you either run wheels that are lug nut tapered to be mounted in either direction, or carry two spares. In the Hummer wheel scenario one can replace a tire with the wheel still bolted to the truck, making it unnecessary to carry a spare wheel. I love this (if you haven't noticed already!). Wheels DO fail and I would still recommend carrying a spare wheel if you were very far from civilization, but this is uncommon.
Bolt Pattern:
Here is where things get tricky... The bolt pattern for a 6 lug Fuso/Isuzu/other med. duty truck is generally 6x8.75" with a center bore of 6.5" and a stud hole bore of 1.313". A very popular heavy axle in the offroading community is the Rockwell 2.5 ton axle. It uses the same bolt pattern/center bore/stud bore as our trucks. Marsh Racing Wheel (MRW) states that these are the correct figures for the "Rockwell" bolt pattern. Trail Worthy Fab, who I ordered wheels from, states that the previous specifications are correct EXCEPT for the stud bore. TWF states that 0.85" is the correct stud bore size. Take a look at the photos below and notice the difference in the stud bore size - it's startling.
Since I received these wheels from TWF expecting the "Rockwell" pattern I was pretty distraught when I noticed the big difference in stud bore size. TWF relied on me to take my original lug nuts to a machine shop and have them machined to fit the 0.85" bore size and taper. This was an acceptable fix for me but it added extra cost and headache to what could have been a very easy solution. My suggestion to Andy at TWF was to use the correct Rockwell specifications (1.313" stud bore) instead of having to machine lug nuts.
That being said, I have been running these wheels for nearly 6,000 miles and they have not budged, or loosened whatsoever. I put a reference mark on each lug nut so I would notice if they are loosening or not.
Summary:
I love these wheels and tires. The Goodyear Wranglers have a great tread pattern with minimal road noise. These are incredibly stout tires and flex well at low inflation. For an overland rig I believe this tire and wheel combo is a great choice. The great appeal I see is the ability to go to Single Rear Wheel (SRW), go to a larger tire allowing for better fuel economy, and the many options available for this wheel.
I have had great experience with traction on my two wheel drive truck with my camper loaded. Due to the size of tire and double bead lock I am able to air down to very low pressures and my treads resemble a tank track more than a tire. I would recommend this wheelset if you can actually get Trail Worthy Fab, or other hummer wheel recentering outfit, to use the actual "Rockwell" pattern with a 1.313" stud bore size.
Feel free to let me know if you have any questions about this wheelset.
Mick
My Fuso is for sale here: http://www.expeditionportal.com/for...y-and-in-Durango-CO-25-000-obo?highlight=fuso
