New Defender Rage/Hate Thread

[Life_in_4Lo]

sadly, $65K is right in line with premium 4x4 products
Even the top line Bronco and Jeep Rubicons are $50k+

I'm sure Ineos would sell out instantly at that price. They seem to be teasing it coming to the US, but I don't know...

The spartan, back-to-basics Ineos Grenadier will start at £50,000 according to the report below, that's about $65k, give or take. It may well be the genuine spiritual successor of the original Defender, but maybe not in the money department. I am starting to wonder if we'll ever even see it in North America anyway. At such prices, they'll be way too niche of a niche.

Ineos Grenadier review | Auto Express

The Grenadier is a tough 4x4 with real off-road pedigree, but it’s far from cheap

www.autoexpress.co.uk

 

[Carson G]

sadly, $65K is right in line with premium 4x4 products
Even the top line Bronco and Jeep Rubicons are $50k+

I'm sure Ineos would sell out instantly at that price. They seem to be teasing it coming to the US, but I don't know...

That’s $65k before markup. They stated that they’re only going to build a max of 25,000 units a year and that it’ll take them a few years to ramp up production to that amount. If it sells expect a $20k markup.

I can think of a lot of things I’d rather have than a $65k knock off Santana with a bmw power plant.

 

[umbertob]

sadly, $65K is right in line with premium 4x4 products
Even the top line Bronco and Jeep Rubicons are $50k+

I'm sure Ineos would sell out instantly at that price. They seem to be teasing it coming to the US, but I don't know...

Yeah, I was purely translating pounds into dollars for reference. Who knows how they'll be priced here in North America, if and when they decide to import them. With a dealer network to build and limited production capacity, my guess is they'll cost a lot more than $65k, but we'll see. The entry price for a Grenadier at their "home" in the UK appears to be quite a bit higher than anticipated (they were floating £40k just a month ago when they showed the renderings and prototypes.) People on this thread seem to have lots of issues with the price of the new Defender, but it doesn't look like the new Grenadier will be much of a bargain either, although we know very little about it so far.

 

[gatorgrizz27]

Put hockey pucks on the Wrangler and you'll have the same issue. TFL wasn't exactly a source of truth before but now I just skip their off-roading videos. This was already stated earlier but they never actually try anything hard, its just clickbait.

Anyway, just got back from Montana. Turns out, IFS had such little articulation that I couldn't navigate forest service roads. My 32" tires got stuck in every pothole, and then the air suspension failed.

I tried to drive out but then all of my electronics failed. Some guy in a toyota saved me. Thank god.

...right. Another thousand+ mile trip down without an issue and 100% comfort.

Yeah, their videos are extremely disappointing. For some reason they are fully convinced that as soon as they encounter a 6” rock, they need to put it at “off road height”, which in addition to their lift rods makes it ride like a buckboard.

For some reason I watched their LR3 vs Defender video, which was nothing but a staged skit. “Oh man, I forgot I have to stop and put it in off road height, he’s going to catch me! Haha!”

Never mind the fact that you can shift everything on the fly, even if you’re doing it via the GAP tool.

 

[DieselRanger]

My sister in law bought an LR3 new, and has driven it for over 200k miles. We were talking way back before the unveiling about the defender, when we expected it to look like a grenadier, and she was considering getting one since she loved the boxiness of her LR3 but didn't like anything newer.

Let's just say she wasn't the slightest bit impressed, and ended up with a volvo to replace it. Yup, completely different direction, but I think it's telling when someone would rather have a volvo than a defender.

Even the people that are interested ina "luxury suv" dont want it. I'm glad @corgi likes his though.

How is that telling? What does she do with her LR3? Does she intend to use the Volvo in the same way as the Defender was designed?

If not, it's not telling for me at all. If all I wanted was a high-riding vehicle with lots of cargo capacity and superb luxury with the best seats in all of the automotive universe to drive around town and haul the kids and their stuff, I'd pick a Volvo too.

In fact, in about 2 years when the wife's lease is up on her Mazda we will be looking very hard at the Polestar 2, which has everything but the "lots of cargo capacity".

 

[Life_in_4Lo]

That sounds about right with regards to pricing. But I'm sure they would still sell every one imported here.
And, no one can expect such a small builder vehicle to be cheap.
Sadly, I'm sure a full-tilt Bronco will cost nearly as much with demand.

$50k is the new $35k
I remember when $100k was strataspheric. Now, almost every luxury make has a $100k option....

Having said that, i'm genuinely excited by the concept and design of both the Ineos and Bronco.
The nice thing about focusing on a niche, they can design exactly for that market with little compromise.
Both products are not diluted. I feel the same with the SFA Jeeps.

When you design towards the middle, everything gets homogenized. That's why people complain "everything looks the same".
It's because it is. But honestly,when you design for numbers, that's whats needed.

This guy makes some solid observations about the Ineos, and I feel the same.
The old Defenders are awesome

Yeah, I was purely translating pounds into dollars for reference. Who knows how they'll be priced here in North America, if and when they decide to import them. With a dealer network to build and limited production capacity, my guess is they'll cost a lot more than $65k, but we'll see. The entry price for a Grenadier at their "home" in the UK appears to be quite a bit higher than anticipated (they were floating £40k just a month ago when they showed the renderings and prototypes.) People on this thread seem to have lots of issues with the price of the new Defender, but it doesn't look like the new Grenadier will be much of a bargain either, although we know very little about it so far.

 

[Blaise]

I also remember when a nickel bought me a pack of gum and gas was $0.89. And I had to walk uphill to school both ways in the snow...

Cmon, inflation is inflation. Vehicles now are far better, dollar for inflation-adjusted-dollar.

 

[Life_in_4Lo]

Isn't that what I just said?

Cmon, inflation is inflation. Vehicles now are far better, dollar for inflation-adjusted-dollar.

 

[Blaise]

Guess I misunderstood. Apologies. I get a bit wound up when folks start with 'how come a base truck is $30k now I remember when they were $10k!'

 

[Corgi_express]

Why do people keep sharing 4XO's "I am mad that Land Rover stopped inviting me to their events" biased garbage videos like he has anything of merit to say? He's a grouchy clickbait troll with an axe to grind.

 

[TexasTJ]

Why do people keep sharing 4XO's "I am mad that Land Rover stopped inviting me to their events" biased garbage videos like he has anything of merit to say? He's a grouchy clickbait troll with an axe to grind.

And he’s a Nerd.

 

[Life_in_4Lo]

didn't realize he was so popular. He is annoying but he also has a lot of experience and credible opinions.
I can seperate the delivery from the message. But he's tough to take sometimes for sure.

Why do people keep sharing 4XO's "I am mad that Land Rover stopped inviting me to their events" biased garbage videos like he has anything of merit to say? He's a grouchy clickbait troll with an axe to grind.

 

[Carson G]

didn't realize he was so popular. He is annoying but he also has a lot of experience and credible opinions.
I can seperate the delivery from the message. But he's tough to take sometimes for sure.

Overall I like Andrew however he has a bad habit of speaking before truly researching stuff.

 

[roving1]

Overall I like Andrew however he has a bad habit of speaking before truly researching stuff.

This. That whole LC intercooler location thing was epic level stupid.

 

[Corgi_express]

Overall I like Andrew however he has a bad habit of speaking before truly researching stuff.

Yeah I would not call the stuff he says "credible". It's not just the "delivery", he spouts off things that are just plain wrong, and never acknowledges or apologizes for it. The message is bad too.


I don't care if he's a nerd, or if he's abrasive in the way he talks. I am a nerd and I am abrasive when I talk. He just says stuff that's not true because he's being a crybaby about Land Rover taking his toys away after he said something that was not true.