odd request for any flippac owners

[thebrassnuckles]

As the title states, I have an odd request.

I have a flippac, but no torsion bar. I have been on the "waiting list" to get one for 8 months now.

I have been designing a way to open and close the top without a torsion bar, due to its common breakage, and unavailability.

What I need is a broken torsion bar. the side that the crank handle goes on. if anyone has one theyd like to get rid of, it'd be outstanding.

I promise i'll post pics... and diagrams once its finished...:coffeedrink:

thanks!
Bill

 

[Harp]

Torsion bar

The opening and closing without the bar isn't much of a problem. The trick is once it is open having a system to keep it at a certain level and supporting the weight of 2 adults in it. The poles supplied with it I don't trust enough to support 500 lbs (2 adults plus the top) A system like the JK earthroamer has would work but the middle pole would have to be beefed up. I would be interested to see what you have in mind. The failure of the bars listed here have me concerned enough I would convert to a system where I could do without the bar.I don't have a bar for you but would be interested in seeing what you have in mind. Keep us posted.

 

[austintaco]

This is sort of a hi-jack. Does the Flippac's torsion bar work on the same principle as the Wildernest? The wildernest literature states that it can support the weight of two adults without the poles. In fact, the poles are only there to add support during high winds.

I bring this up to illustrate how crucial the hinge/torsion mechanism is in the Wildernest, in case its the same in a flippac.

 

[RHINO]

i can not imagine the torsion bar itself will hold two adults in a flippac, even if they said it would i would be concerned about it not doing so and tearing the tent out of the corners. if your planning on something using the torsion bar end to flip open your pack w/o the spring i would really be concerned about the hinge ripping out of the mounts. i use a pole, i drilled a hole for a bolt to run into the side of the lid near the latch and attach a pole with an eye and little clip like the hood support uses. its easy to flip open and close with the pole that i dont think i am going to replace the broken torsion bar. i also made new legs for the lid support because i need the roof completely flat to fit in the garage.

 

[Martyn]

This is sort of a hi-jack. Does the Flippac's torsion bar work on the same principle as the Wildernest? The wildernest literature states that it can support the weight of two adults without the poles. In fact, the poles are only there to add support during high winds.

I bring this up to illustrate how crucial the hinge/torsion mechanism is in the Wildernest, in case its the same in a flippac.

The Wildernest uses a spring hinge anchored to the vertical walls of the structure along with a cable system that goes from the vertical wall on the vehicle side of the shell to the apex of the center pole down to the outside end of the open lid. This system put enormous stress on the spring anchor points which ends up cracking the fiberglass vertical wall and splitting the embedded wood.

The Earthroamer JK uses a beefed up center pole, winch cable, and winch to open and close the lid. The nature of the design causes the lid to pull off center.

The FlipPac uses a torsion rod that is under zero torsion when the lid is in the vertical position. The torsion bar provides support to the open lid, along with the legs to the vehicle when open. Failure of the torsion bar is the primary drawback with this system. I'd guess there is a 15% failure rate if you looked at all the FlipPacs made since 1979.

Having gone through the design and manufacture of torsion bars for the JK Habitat I'd say the following. The torsion bar system is very reliable if the bar is well designed, and made by a forge that has extensive experience making torsion bars. I do not know who makes the torsion bars for FRP and they don't seem keen to tell me. The FlipPac torsion bar failures I know of seem to be random rather than related to bad production batches, and don't seem to follow any pattern when it comes to the usage of the FlipPac, i.e. on road vs. off road.

As you can see none of these systems are perfect. The Wildernest and Earthroamer systems produce the same results over time so they are consistent with their issues. The FlipPac has random issues.

The good news is that FRP just got torsion bars in stock, so if you need one call them and place your order.

 

[Harp]

Torsion bar

Rhino, Got photos of the pole system?

As far as the earthraomer the winch is what causes the problem but the support lines themselves work very well. the same system could be used on the Flippac with a larger center pole. A rope could then be attached to the far lip of the top of the unit and it could be pulled open and closed. If you leave the rear tailgate and window closed on the truck the air suction retards the quick opening and closing of the cover. I worry about having the bar break the first day of a trip out of town and trying to deal with it. It seems to me the protective sleeve on the bar just holds in the moisture after a rain. I just replaced the caulking on mine today again and noticed surface rust on the arm. I would be very interested in any mod that would get rid of the torsion bar.

 

[RHINO]

i can take a pic when i get back home, i drilled a hole in the hammock pole (perfect length). i drilled and tapped a hole through the fiberglass lid and the steel tube that runs the length of it and screwed in a 5/16" bolt with loctite. then i cut the head off giving me a 1/2" rod to attach the pole to. i drilled a hole in the rod for a pin like the factory hood pins use. works perfect for me. i still have the broken torsion bar in place but plan to replace it with 3/4" bolts/nuts and keep the plastic spacers so the hinge will never even know.

 

[kevek01]

This is probably a dumb question, but how is the torsion bar for the Flip-Pac different than a torsion bar for suspension?

 

[Martyn]

Rhino, Got photos of the pole system?

As far as the earthraomer the winch is what causes the problem but the support lines themselves work very well. the same system could be used on the Flippac with a larger center pole. A rope could then be attached to the far lip of the top of the unit and it could be pulled open and closed. If you leave the rear tailgate and window closed on the truck the air suction retards the quick opening and closing of the cover. I worry about having the bar break the first day of a trip out of town and trying to deal with it. It seems to me the protective sleeve on the bar just holds in the moisture after a rain. I just replaced the caulking on mine today again and noticed surface rust on the arm. I would be very interested in any mod that would get rid of the torsion bar.

The outer tube shouldn't seal water inside it. If the fit is such that it is forming a seal against the outer collars then you need to drill drain holes in the sleeve so the water can drain.

 

[Climber Rob]

This is probably a dumb question, but how is the torsion bar for the Flip-Pac different than a torsion bar for suspension?

Same idea. As Martyn stated above, the design would be fine if the bars were well-made.

 

[RHINO]

just to add to martyns example,,, the biggest difference between the two is the amount of movement the flips torsion bar takes, 180* vs maybe 30* in a vehicle. the saving grace is that it doesnt hold much weight and is very long and thin, if it were similar size of a cars bar it wouldnt even move enough to operate the flip.