Off-road teardrop wannabe

[jnelson4x4taco]

Okay, after searching high and low for a trailer that will meet my needs I have decided that "to have it done right, you must do it yourself". Im not necessarily saying that I will build it right as much as the design will be "right" for me. I would like to base it off of this one:

http://herebedragonsadventures.org/gallery-4.html

I love the design, style, size, etc. Hopefully the owner doesnt mind me posting the link, I know he is a member on this board. I post other links to trailer builds and if anyone would like me to remove it, I will gladly do so.

My main modification to that is that I want it to still be a functional utility trailer for washers and dryers, sod, dirt bikes, etc. So i am trying to make the camper removable. I have a few ideas about how to make that happen, obviously it will be heavy so it will take a few guys to move.

I am planning on basing the frame off of Box Rocket's build here:
http://expeditionportal.com/forum/showthread.php?t=23624

I will order a 3500lb axle kit and try and mount 33x9.50 or 33x10.50 on 6 lug wheels to match my truck.

I will then skin the floor of the trailer with 3/4" ply, that will be the base trailer.

Then I will start the camper part. I will lay 1/2" ply down on top of that and then build the frame off of that. I will build the frame out of 2x2 or 2x4 wood, then insulate it with 1.5" foam and then skin the interior with either 1/4" or 1/2" ply. I will (try to) fiberglass all of the exterior seams and coat it with Kilz paint and maybe some type of clear (varathane or polyurathane? maybe just fiberglass resin?) I will run bolts through the floor of the camper into the plywood deck of the trailer floor to secure it. Ill also make the back hatch open for a kitchen area, cut in some windows, doors, jerry cans and battery on front, and all that stuff.

So, from what ive tried to explain, does this sound like a reasonable plan. I would like to hear from those of you who have done this and what you have learned from it. Is a 2x4 frame with 1/2" ply exterior, 1.5" foam and 1/4" interior walls sturdy enough? The trailer frame will probably be 2.5" square.

Thanks for all your help guys, im hoping to get most of the planning done so I can buy my steel this weekend. My buddies and I are trying to plan a long weekend in Moab sometime in the spring and I would love to have this ready by then.

-Jeff

 

[Titanpat57]

Sounds great...be sure to post progress.

Love the "scratch builds" !!

 

[05liberty]

Be sure to post photos !
Check out this site
http://www.mikenchell.com/forums/index.php?sid=3e49ecb345fddf1aa13c6470b8f42c3c
If you havent already ! Loads of good info there !
Here is alittle info and a photo of mine ...http://www.expeditionportal.com/forum/showthread.php?t=34573

 

[1speed]

Okay, after searching high and low for a trailer that will meet my needs I have decided that "to have it done right, you must do it yourself". Im not necessarily saying that I will build it right as much as the design will be "right" for me. I would like to base it off of this one:

http://herebedragonsadventures.org/gallery-4.html

I love the design, style, size, etc. Hopefully the owner doesnt mind me posting the link, I know he is a member on this board. I post other links to trailer builds and if anyone would like me to remove it, I will gladly do so.

My main modification to that is that I want it to still be a functional utility trailer for washers and dryers, sod, dirt bikes, etc. So i am trying to make the camper removable. I have a few ideas about how to make that happen, obviously it will be heavy so it will take a few guys to move.

I am planning on basing the frame off of Box Rocket's build here:
http://expeditionportal.com/forum/showthread.php?t=23624

I will order a 3500lb axle kit and try and mount 33x9.50 or 33x10.50 on 6 lug wheels to match my truck.

I will then skin the floor of the trailer with 3/4" ply, that will be the base trailer.

Then I will start the camper part. I will lay 1/2" ply down on top of that and then build the frame off of that. I will build the frame out of 2x2 or 2x4 wood, then insulate it with 1.5" foam and then skin the interior with either 1/4" or 1/2" ply. I will (try to) fiberglass all of the exterior seams and coat it with Kilz paint and maybe some type of clear (varathane or polyurathane? maybe just fiberglass resin?) I will run bolts through the floor of the camper into the plywood deck of the trailer floor to secure it. Ill also make the back hatch open for a kitchen area, cut in some windows, doors, jerry cans and battery on front, and all that stuff.

So, from what ive tried to explain, does this sound like a reasonable plan. I would like to hear from those of you who have done this and what you have learned from it. Is a 2x4 frame with 1/2" ply exterior, 1.5" foam and 1/4" interior walls sturdy enough? The trailer frame will probably be 2.5" square.

Thanks for all your help guys, im hoping to get most of the planning done so I can buy my steel this weekend. My buddies and I are trying to plan a long weekend in Moab sometime in the spring and I would love to have this ready by then.

-Jeff

I don't mind the link at all!

I am by no means an expert but I have learned a few things.

1)Use marine grade plywood. I had trouble where water wicked in past screws I thought were sealed and caused some delamination.
2) Use a 3500 lb axle for sure. I bent my 2000 lb axle with very little off road use. Also, the spindles on a 2000 lb axle are not up to the task for a 33" tire.
3) Skip the Kilz and paint route, been there done that, not sufficient. I would use CPES http://www.rotdoctor.com/products/cpes.html next time, then auto paint. Since it's proving to be a nightmare to strip mine all down to bare wood, at the suggestion of a trailer builder with a lot of experience I'm going to shoot mine with bedliner this time. Your biggest issue is sealing any srews etc. that punture the finish coat.
4) "2x4 frame with 1/2" ply exterior, 1.5" foam and 1/4" interior walls" is way overkill. I used 3/4" plywood "skeletonized" for the frame with 3/4" rigid foam insulation, 1/2" outside skin and 1/4" inside skin. My wife and I had to crack a window in 34 degree temps because we got hot. Structurally the outside skin could easily be 1/4" if you epoxy it to help against puntures. I still like the plywood framing route I used for torsional stiffness.

Like I said, I'm by no means an expert but I'm happy to help if I can. Unfortunately most of the pictures were lost from my build thread due to an Expo datbase issue, but the text is still there. Here is a post where I gave a few details of the build process http://expeditionportal.com/forum/showpost.php?p=369904&postcount=137 and a link to my photobucket account with a some build photos. I wasn't a member of any forums when I started my build so I didn't document real well at the begining. http://s417.photobucket.com/albums/pp258/singlespeedin/My Offroad Teardrop/?albumview=slideshow

 

[Martyn]

I don't mind the link at all!

I am by no means an expert but I have learned a few things.

Jim you are being way too modest.

You are the expert.

 

[1speed]

Jim you are being way too modest.

You are the expert.

I'm honored! :bowdown:

 

[18seeds]

My needs are similiar to your. I need something that is removeable. My idea initially was to make a camper that fit on one side of a snowmobile trailer. That way I could have a snowmobile on one side and the camper on the other. This was very limiting because the width would only be around 4ft and 5 ft is more ideal.

http://www.microlitetrailer.com/ makes a teardrop that is removeable.

I have followed 1 speeds design and it's one of the best i've seen.

Have you considered outfitting a small 5x8 enclosed trailer? In the end you may end up with something lighter.

I see you are from Colorado. My biggest concern right now is towing capacity for my Taco. I know the truck is completely capable of towing a small camper but the loss of HP at high altitude is pushing me to keep it simple.

If you are looking for a professional to build it for you I have the number of a guy who made pop up truck campers for over 20 years. He built my drawer/storage platform. His hourly rate is cheap but it takes him more hours than you would think. Quality is top notch and he has great ideas. Example my drawer slides are made out of steel L channel and garage door rollers. pm me if you want his contact info

good luck

 

[jnelson4x4taco]

1speed- How did you attach the 3/4" ply skeleton? Is it all put together with pockethole screws? I was only trying to do the 1/2" ply-foam-1/4"ply walls to cut down on costs a bit, when i looked the other night, a 4x8 sheet of 19/32" Aruaco ACX ply was $35. 1/2" went down to $25 and then the 5mm birch skin was $11. I am definately going with a 3500lb axle, i found a kit at ABCTrailer that would be just over $200 shipped to my door. I am also working on a set of matching Tacoma wheels for $100 nearby.

18seeds- those microlite trailers are really neat, probably a pretty penny for those guys. I thought about a 5x8 trailer but really enjoy the building process and I also want to try and keep the height of the trailer, and the budget, relatively low. I too, am concerned with power but I just figure it will be slow going through the mountains and such. My buddy tows a 22' Mastercraft with his Taco and although its slow, it gets the job done. I might look at some performance mods in the future to boost power, like a Cummins 4BT

Has anyone looked at any products like Varathane for a coating? I used this stuff on some outdoor patio furniture and it created what appeared to be a very thick, weatherproof coating, it takes a few coats but the stuff is around $35 a gallon. Anyone know how much epoxy resin I would need for a project this size? I assume that stuff is pretty pricey. Thanks again for all your help guys, im hoping to get my sliders welded on this weekend and then get started on the trailer, just need to finalize my design.....although is any build design ever "finalized"? I didnt think so.

 

[1speed]

1speed- How did you attach the 3/4" ply skeleton? Is it all put together with pockethole screws? I was only trying to do the 1/2" ply-foam-1/4"ply walls to cut down on costs a bit, when i looked the other night, a 4x8 sheet of 19/32" Aruaco ACX ply was $35. 1/2" went down to $25 and then the 5mm birch skin was $11. I am definately going with a 3500lb axle, i found a kit at ABCTrailer that would be just over $200 shipped to my door. I am also working on a set of matching Tacoma wheels for $100 nearby.

I used Gorilla glue and deck screws for the structure. If you look on the teardrop forum, www.mikenchell.com most people frame with 1x4's and pocket srews. That should be plenty sturdy if you glue everything together. 1/4" skin on both sides glued and srewed to 1x4's with rigid foam glued on both sides in between should be make a good "SIP" (structural insulated panel). I thought the plywood "frame" I used would be the ultimate insurance against "racking".

I would still recommend the CPES, it penetrates deeply into the plywood rather than just laying on the surface, I don't think it's all that expensive.

 

[jnelson4x4taco]

Where did you guys source your windows and what was the cost? I founf some flushmount windows with sliders and screen here that seemed pretty good for around $25 a piece.

Ill look into that CPES stuff, any idea about how much I would need?

 

[1speed]

Where did you guys source your windows and what was the cost? I founf some flushmount windows with sliders and screen here that seemed pretty good for around $25 a piece.

Ill look into that CPES stuff, any idea about how much I would need?

From their site:

"CPES Warm Weather Formula (down to 50° F / 10° C.)*
101 2 pint unit (946 ML) $ 34.32

102 2 quart unit (1.9 L) $ 54.79

103** 2 gallon unit (7.6 L) $ 177.71"


"Product Coverage and Shelf Life
Unmixed CPES, kept in closed cans and at above freezing temperatures, has a shelf life of over 5 years. If you mix it, though, you must use it.

The coverage of CPES™ will depend entirely on the surface to which it is being applied. On rotted logs in log homes it can take a gallon every three to four feet to soak bad wood, yet for surface application on clean, sanded hardwood it can go about 300 sq. feet per gallon (7 sq. meters/liter). In any application of CPES™ the key is to allow the wood to absorb all that it can. It is especially important that CPES™ be applied generously to edges and end-grain areas because this is where the rot likes to get started.

To determine how much CPES™ you might need, use your best judgment based on the type, finish and condition of the wood. On new wood you can plan between 200 and 300 sq ft per gallon (5-7 sq meters/liter), although on rough, porous woods such as Cedar the coverage can go down to 100 sq ft per gallon (2.5 sq meters/liter). If the wood is rotted or deteriorated, or if there are large areas of end-grain, then it's pretty much a guess. Just look at the area that is going to be treated, imagine how much water it would absorb if generously applied, and that's going to be close to the amount of CPES™ you will require.

And remember -- the drier the wood the better the absorption. If you press the wood and water emerges then it's too wet for CPES™ treatment. If it's slightly damp application is okay, but you should always try to apply CPES™ to wood which is in the normal range, 12% to 20% moisture in average humidity conditions."

I got my front window from an Ebay seller. The side ones I got for free from a friend that worked at an RV dealer from a wrecked trailer they dismantled.

 

[18seeds]

Where did you guys source your windows and what was the cost? I founf some flushmount windows with sliders and screen here that seemed pretty good for around $25 a piece.

Ill look into that CPES stuff, any idea about how much I would need?

Call Jay at 5 star RV in Henderson CO. He has an RV junkyard. Get some used windows.

 

[ntsqd]

Looking at Rocket Box's build I'm guessing that your base trailer will also have steel sides up to at least the top of the fenders? With the structure that he put into the sides you can anchor the slide-in at that level. Will likely be more convenient and won't require holes in the floor of the trailer.

Some suggestions to consider:

Make the floor easily replaceable. I inherited a trailer built around a 4x8 plywood sheet. The sheet is not even fastened down. It sits on a perimeter ledge and multiple small cross members. Makes cleaning it out very, very easy. And when the floor is scarred beyond being desirable to use it can be replaced and re-purposed.

Use older Import pick-up tailgate latches, the kind that are a draw-latch. They are the best and easiest way that I've ever seen to make a rattle-free tailgate. They also tie the tailgate into the rest of the trailer structure, making the whole stronger.

Consider the lighting at the start. I would use the so-called "Torsion Mount" lights. These are those that you see mounted in a rubber grommet. Make where ever they mount to be part of the trailer and protected rather than merely added on later. Give the same consideration for the license plate and it's light, if required. You can not go too robust with trailer wiring.

Include the tailgate in the slide-in design. I would suggest sizing the box such that the tail gate will close on the slide-in. If it is too low to use as cooking surface then make sure that it's hinges allow it to swing at least 180*

 

[jnelson4x4taco]

Thanks for the tips guys, tight after i posted I went onto the CPES site and found all that info about price and coverage. I will definately check out that RV place for used windows, that would be great.

Im really only following Rocket Box's build for the frame, tongue and axle setup. I will not be adding sides or a tailgate as of now. In the future I may decide to add sides but right now I dont see it as a necessity. I will definitely be researching wiring as i feel that it will be fairly difficult for me. I have worked with wood for quite a few years now, and am fairly familiar with metal. That said, I still get terribly confused when i start thinking about wiring, it just makes my head hurt lol I have found that diagrams help though so i will be doing lots of drawing i think. I need to research a good deep cycle battery setup for the trailer What gauge wire do you suggest and whats a good place to source low draw lights? This may be a dumb question but; should i have any concern about heat from the wire melting the styrofoam?

 

[compactcamping]

Here is some actual CPES coverage info from my projects. Different plywoods had different absorption rates. Radiata Pine sucked up three times as much as Okoume did. A 24 sq ft area of Radiata Pine took 18 oz on the first coat and 6 oz on the second coat. A 49 sq ft area of Okoume took 20 oz on the first coat and 6 oz on the second coat.

The Radiata Pine and Okoume took two coats to seal it. To completely fill the grain on the Okoume it took an additional coat. Radiata Pine and Fir plywood have similar absorption rate.

When building plywood trailer boxes, I glue all pieces that form an external joint with thicken epoxy. This forms a waterproof joint. I then further thicken the excess and use it to filler the countersunk screws holding the panel in place. I've never had a screw hole leak.