Mundo4x4Casa
West slope, N. Ser. Nev.
This has been a very fair and lively thread. My first thought is, there are hardsides and hardsides;
there are pop-ups and pop-ups.
My bro John has a 9' OUTFITTER! on his '99, LB F-250/Camper package/Diesel/6 speed manual and he loves it. I love it too. When it is cranked up there is a LOT of air space in there. Feels very spacious. He bought it new and went thru the 'period of adjustment' where the electrical system had to be completely redone and the plumbing was also redone. He also broke his leg falling thru the crack between the camper and the scissor steps. It's fine now, and so is he. I think his is a very good lash up.
I have a small/narrow Lance hardside TC. I bought it used and have had very little trouble with it. Some hardware latches, sink spout, water pump, and many parts on the outside of the camper have been scraped/dragged off the sides and roof, like vent covers, clearance lights, side lights, stove vent cover, etc. But I go where regular TC's fear to tread in the land of XTC. Yes, a cross-over 4X4 RV. Here is my rr suspension set, at least until next week when one more set of main leaves go in: note the Stable Load (the black block on the upper end)
Our rigs at an undisclosed location in the High Sierra overlooking Nevada:
The fact is, most people look at a hardside and conclude that it is top heavy. It is a little heavier up high than a soft-side but not much. It's mostly air. Bro John's OUTFITTER! actually weighs more than my Lance. Whoda thunk? By design we store all heavier stuff down low and we keep nothing on the roof. Also there is no metal scissor hardware up high anywhere in a hardside. I have had zero woes with the wind with my hardside, whether driving in high winds or camping in Haboob areas. It has been an interesting ride in 80 mph winds, but no harm-no foul.
It was a steep learning curve to figure out how not to pull the TC to pieces with the tie-downs. I have written extensively about this.
Why do i still like this thing?
1. It's paid for and we have camped in it from the Brooks Range, AK, to Mexico; over 200 nights in the 12 years we've owned it.
2. We are used to it. Don't underestimate the power of 'used to it'. I'm always on the lookout for height obstructions that would invade our 10 foot, 2 inch clearance over the top. Sometimes if i don't fold the mirrors in, a branch or rock will fold it in for me. You develop a sense.
3. We do a lot of stealth camping (I call it camouflage camping or camocamping, everything but the Mountbatten Pink paint job) in big cities and small using Tioga George's and Sleepy's techniques. Since the TC doesn't change shape, it looks like no one is home. We scout out a 'good' spot, sometimes in plain sight before dark, go have supper somewhere else, like at a county park and return after dark to spend up to 7 hours in the mobile domicile; shades down/stairs up. Nothing set up outside the TC.
4. There is NOTHING to set up. Well, if you call pulling down the stair steps set-up, so be it.
5. Some of my favorite things are: it is very quiet in there so we always get the best night's sleep, and it's a twenty foot long, 86 inch wide package that will fit easily along the curb or in a regular parking spot, or in ANY N.P. or N.F. campground, even the ones with length restrictions.
The downsides of the hardside/Dodge are: The model Lance i own does not have enough insulation for continuous, non-summer camping. It needs insulation blocks and double pane windows. Yes, I have done everything i can do to add insulation, but there are still cold spots that cannot be erased. Also, the year Cummins i have is called the, "Cummins alarm clock", as it is the LOUDEST engine at start up in cold weather I've ever heard. So, when you start up in the morning after a great night's sleep, everyone else within earshot is up with you, so you need to beat a hasty retreat!
In the end, only your needs need apply. A lot of this has to do with age. If you are young and have no time for long Expedition-style trips anyway, a few days in a tent or tent trailer, or just laying on the ground is fine. Having had 14 various 4WD's over the years you could trace our needs in them. I've slept on the plywood covered roof rack on my FJ55: camped in the voluminous rear of a '80 Scout Traveller/Nissan TD. As i got older i wanted a truck to haul my rock crawler on trailer to the trail head. Eventually, i did not like to lay on the ground any more and we bought a used Lance camper to go on the truck. Now, the rock crawler just sits a lot and the TC gets used more and more, especially on longer trips. Why? Because we can.
regards, as always, jefe
"We know what we know. We don't know what we don't know. Alas, we don't know that we don't know what we don't know." JR1967
there are pop-ups and pop-ups.
My bro John has a 9' OUTFITTER! on his '99, LB F-250/Camper package/Diesel/6 speed manual and he loves it. I love it too. When it is cranked up there is a LOT of air space in there. Feels very spacious. He bought it new and went thru the 'period of adjustment' where the electrical system had to be completely redone and the plumbing was also redone. He also broke his leg falling thru the crack between the camper and the scissor steps. It's fine now, and so is he. I think his is a very good lash up.
I have a small/narrow Lance hardside TC. I bought it used and have had very little trouble with it. Some hardware latches, sink spout, water pump, and many parts on the outside of the camper have been scraped/dragged off the sides and roof, like vent covers, clearance lights, side lights, stove vent cover, etc. But I go where regular TC's fear to tread in the land of XTC. Yes, a cross-over 4X4 RV. Here is my rr suspension set, at least until next week when one more set of main leaves go in: note the Stable Load (the black block on the upper end)
Our rigs at an undisclosed location in the High Sierra overlooking Nevada:
The fact is, most people look at a hardside and conclude that it is top heavy. It is a little heavier up high than a soft-side but not much. It's mostly air. Bro John's OUTFITTER! actually weighs more than my Lance. Whoda thunk? By design we store all heavier stuff down low and we keep nothing on the roof. Also there is no metal scissor hardware up high anywhere in a hardside. I have had zero woes with the wind with my hardside, whether driving in high winds or camping in Haboob areas. It has been an interesting ride in 80 mph winds, but no harm-no foul.
It was a steep learning curve to figure out how not to pull the TC to pieces with the tie-downs. I have written extensively about this.
Why do i still like this thing?
1. It's paid for and we have camped in it from the Brooks Range, AK, to Mexico; over 200 nights in the 12 years we've owned it.
2. We are used to it. Don't underestimate the power of 'used to it'. I'm always on the lookout for height obstructions that would invade our 10 foot, 2 inch clearance over the top. Sometimes if i don't fold the mirrors in, a branch or rock will fold it in for me. You develop a sense.
3. We do a lot of stealth camping (I call it camouflage camping or camocamping, everything but the Mountbatten Pink paint job) in big cities and small using Tioga George's and Sleepy's techniques. Since the TC doesn't change shape, it looks like no one is home. We scout out a 'good' spot, sometimes in plain sight before dark, go have supper somewhere else, like at a county park and return after dark to spend up to 7 hours in the mobile domicile; shades down/stairs up. Nothing set up outside the TC.
4. There is NOTHING to set up. Well, if you call pulling down the stair steps set-up, so be it.
5. Some of my favorite things are: it is very quiet in there so we always get the best night's sleep, and it's a twenty foot long, 86 inch wide package that will fit easily along the curb or in a regular parking spot, or in ANY N.P. or N.F. campground, even the ones with length restrictions.
The downsides of the hardside/Dodge are: The model Lance i own does not have enough insulation for continuous, non-summer camping. It needs insulation blocks and double pane windows. Yes, I have done everything i can do to add insulation, but there are still cold spots that cannot be erased. Also, the year Cummins i have is called the, "Cummins alarm clock", as it is the LOUDEST engine at start up in cold weather I've ever heard. So, when you start up in the morning after a great night's sleep, everyone else within earshot is up with you, so you need to beat a hasty retreat!
In the end, only your needs need apply. A lot of this has to do with age. If you are young and have no time for long Expedition-style trips anyway, a few days in a tent or tent trailer, or just laying on the ground is fine. Having had 14 various 4WD's over the years you could trace our needs in them. I've slept on the plywood covered roof rack on my FJ55: camped in the voluminous rear of a '80 Scout Traveller/Nissan TD. As i got older i wanted a truck to haul my rock crawler on trailer to the trail head. Eventually, i did not like to lay on the ground any more and we bought a used Lance camper to go on the truck. Now, the rock crawler just sits a lot and the TC gets used more and more, especially on longer trips. Why? Because we can.
regards, as always, jefe
"We know what we know. We don't know what we don't know. Alas, we don't know that we don't know what we don't know." JR1967
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