Pulling an 8000 lb trailer off-road

[calicamper]

Twin turbo gas engines have good low end torque. EcoBoost, Tundra 3.5, Hurricane TT-I6.

Woody is stuck in the 90’s. All the modern turbo units run like 80’s diesel’s for low end torque and scalded cats when you keep the go pedal mashed.
As for weight? Vs unpaved? Even a 8000lb truck is only a paved or dry solid graded road vehicle! You want to go beyond that? You need to leave the house at home and run a light vehicle.

 

[Todd780]

Woody is stuck in the 90’s. All the modern turbo units run like 80’s diesel’s for low end torque and scalded cats when you keep the go pedal mashed.

Agreed. The low end torque for trailer pulling is what made me switch to a V8 to a twin turbo 6. I looked at the 22 Tundra's and F150's.
If Ram had their TT-I6 Hurricane in the 1500's when I was looking, I would have looked at them too. But, GM and Ram were scratched off my list as I didn't want to go the high revving V8 route again. Nooooow if one were to twin turbo those V8's.....

 

[WOODY2]

View attachment 785522


View attachment 785524

I'll hold your beverage.

 

[Todd780]

I'll hold your beverage.

No need. I've got this.



So..... Who's bringing the beer and 8,000 lbs trailer?

 

[WOODY2]

No need. I've got this.

View attachment 785813

So..... Who's bringing the beer and 8,000 lbs trailer?


View attachment 785814

See, nooo problemo. Any bets on MIL in trailer?

 

[Todd780]

See, nooo problemo. Any bets on MIL in trailer?

What's the bet?

 

[wirenut]

The GM 6.0 is great. Or, go older and get an 8.1L. I certainly felt my 8.1 had a lot of low end torque. All modern trucks have about as much power as big blocks and diesels of the '90s.
100,000 miles is not "high miles"; that was in the '80s. I drove my '05 Duramax to 307,000. My 2009 2500 Suburban has 150,000. Even the wife's car is around 130,000. I wouldn't call anythinv under 200,000 high.

 

[BikePilot]

Old big blocks are actually weaker than a modern turbo 6 truck. As an example, the best 8.1L vortech truck engine did 340hp and 455tq. An Ecoboost has 400hp and 500tq (more in raptor or hybrid config).

 

[gatorgrizz27]

I’d wager the older engines will do better at getting a heavy load moving from a stop in sand, while the newer tiny twin turbo engines will do better pulling through a mountain pass at highway speeds.

Towing that much weight “off road” isn’t going to be any fun, or a good idea IMO. Plenty of half tons can do it on the highway, but to get the tires I’d want for clearance in the dirt while not being unstable on the road or tearing up the drivetrain I’d be looking at a gas F-250 on something like 37” all/mud terrains.

If you get that rig stuck in anything other than sand, it’s going to be a nightmare to recover. Go watch the Matt’s Off Road on YouTube for some examples. It’s not something that’s going to come out with another stock 3/4 ton truck and your standard tow strap. I spent a lot of time in my youth getting lifted trucks buried and it was unbelievable what it took to extract them.

The physical size of a camper that heavy is going to be an issue as well. I’d rather pull a 6x12 utility trailer loaded with bags of concrete at the same 8000 lbs than something that’s 25’ long and 9’ high. You’ll find stuff happening like driving past a tree with half the trailer and plenty of clearance, then the tires hit an off camber spot and the whole top corner of the camper is dragging into the tree. Not to mention it’s not going to follow your tow vehicle with tight turns or paths through rock gardens, etc. Spend some time moving an open trailer around in a yard full of trees to see what I’m talking about. Also, that much weight moving around is going to be plain uncomfortable with the jerking, banging, and bouncing around.

Now, if what you actually mean is driving up a 5-10 mile forest or fire road and camping by a lake for several days, it might work fine for you. At that point though you should be fine with a standard camper or cargo trailer conversion, as long as it has sufficient clearance.

 

[vintageracer]

Old big blocks are actually weaker than a modern turbo 6 truck. As an example, the best 8.1L vortech truck engine did 340hp and 455tq. An Ecoboost has 400hp and 500tq (more in raptor or hybrid config).

This is true!

Just remember in 2001 when the 8.1 gas engine was introduced by GM they also introduced the Duramax diesel engine. At that time the 8.1 gas had more HP than the Duramax diesel which is expected. The 8.1 gas also had a HIGHER torque rating than the Duramax diesel engine.

A win/win for the 8.1 gas engine at that time!

With 20 years of engine development comparing a "Vintage" 8.1 gas engine to a modern gas/diesel engine is worthless. During the early 2000's the 8.1 gas engine was the Big Boy on the block in the GM line.

 

[Cortttt]

That being said an 8K trailer off road is insanity.

We're probably going to settle at a trailer that tops out loaded at 7K. I can think of many forest and desert roads I think should be able to handle it actually.

Color me skeptical about what can go where and the need for every off road doo-dad. I've been taking a 9500 lb 2-wheel drive van all over the West for the past 7 years. I'll let you know how it goes!

 

[Cortttt]

I’d wager the older engines will do better at getting a heavy load moving from a stop in sand, while the newer tiny twin turbo engines will do better pulling through a mountain pass at highway speeds.

Towing that much weight “off road” isn’t going to be any fun, or a good idea IMO. Plenty of half tons can do it on the highway, but to get the tires I’d want for clearance in the dirt while not being unstable on the road or tearing up the drivetrain I’d be looking at a gas F-250 on something like 37” all/mud terrains.

If you get that rig stuck in anything other than sand, it’s going to be a nightmare to recover. Go watch the Matt’s Off Road on YouTube for some examples. It’s not something that’s going to come out with another stock 3/4 ton truck and your standard tow strap. I spent a lot of time in my youth getting lifted trucks buried and it was unbelievable what it took to extract them.

The physical size of a camper that heavy is going to be an issue as well. I’d rather pull a 6x12 utility trailer loaded with bags of concrete at the same 8000 lbs than something that’s 25’ long and 9’ high. You’ll find stuff happening like driving past a tree with half the trailer and plenty of clearance, then the tires hit an off camber spot and the whole top corner of the camper is dragging into the tree. Not to mention it’s not going to follow your tow vehicle with tight turns or paths through rock gardens, etc. Spend some time moving an open trailer around in a yard full of trees to see what I’m talking about. Also, that much weight moving around is going to be plain uncomfortable with the jerking, banging, and bouncing around.

Now, if what you actually mean is driving up a 5-10 mile forest or fire road and camping by a lake for several days, it might work fine for you. At that point though you should be fine with a standard camper or cargo trailer conversion, as long as it has sufficient clearance.

I wouldn't dream of pulling that weight with a half-ton. Forest roads and good desert roads - that's what I mean. That said - I am prone to test things (lol).

 

[Cortttt]

With regard to the puny torque from the 8-cylinder gassers - that's no longer so true with the newer HD Chevy (6.6 L) and Ford (Godzilla) engines that are designed to take on - at least in some applications - the more expensive diesels. While it can't beat a dieselfor low-end torque there is quite an improvment.

"Producing 401hp and 464lb-ft. of torque, the L8T produces enough power for what it’s built for. The L8T has more displacement, longer stroke, and a forged crank all for the purpose of generating low-end torque. While it can’t tow the 36,000lbs. that the Duramax can, the low-end torque makes the L8T capable of pulling nearly 18,000 pounds. Overall, the 6.6L is built to be a heavy work and fleet truck."

GM 6.6L L8T Engine Guide - Specs, Performance, Problems

How reliable is GM's L8T engine? Check out the specs of the 6.6L gas engine as well as the common problems and performance potential.

chevytrucks.org

 

[WOODY2]

We're probably going to settle at a trailer that tops out loaded at 7K. I can think of many forest and desert roads I think should be able to handle it actually.

Color me skeptical about what can go where and the need for every off road doo-dad. I've been taking a 9500 lb 2-wheel drive van all over the West for the past 7 years. I'll let you know how it goes!

Kudos for taking a 9500# van all over but attaching a trailer changes the whole equation even in the best of circumstances. If you don't get stuck backing out of a shelf road or tight situation may alter your perception of where it's prudent to venture regardless of trailer weight. Good luck in your travels.

 

[Todd780]

With regard to the puny torque from the 8-cylinder gassers - that's no longer so true with the newer HD Chevy (6.6 L) and Ford (Godzilla) engines that are designed to take on - at least in some applications - the more expensive diesels. While it can't beat a dieselfor low-end torque there is quite an improvment.

"Producing 401hp and 464lb-ft. of torque, the L8T produces enough power for what it’s built for. The L8T has more displacement, longer stroke, and a forged crank all for the purpose of generating low-end torque. While it can’t tow the 36,000lbs. that the Duramax can, the low-end torque makes the L8T capable of pulling nearly 18,000 pounds. Overall, the 6.6L is built to be a heavy work and fleet truck."

GM 6.6L L8T Engine Guide - Specs, Performance, Problems

How reliable is GM's L8T engine? Check out the specs of the 6.6L gas engine as well as the common problems and performance potential.

chevytrucks.org

I'd be curious to see where the torque curve for those engines are vs their diesel counterparts at say 1,500 RPM.
Low end torque for towing is what steered me to an EcoBoost vs a naturally aspirated V8.