Reccomendations for a rig

[emt.micah]

Looking for recommendations for a new rig.

I'm about to take my Tech license test and am looking for a new radio. I'm currently a FF/EMT and use a VHF radio for public safety use.

My current radio is an EF Johnson P25 compliant with front panel programming. The problem is, it's not type accepted for Amateur use.

Does anyone know of a VHF that is accepted for Amateur and Public Safety use? Better yet, anyone know of a VHF/UHF that is dual type accepted?

I have experience with Icom, EF Johnson and Bendix Kings.

Thanks,
Micah

 

[Joey G]

The problem is, it's not type accepted for Amateur use.

It doesn't have to be type accepted for amateur use.

 

[Jr_Explorer]

Well careful there JoeyG. There are a fair number of regulations about radios NOT being legal to transmit on different bands (i.e. Ham and FRS or Ham and CB) from one radio. Icom radios are great. I personally have Icom and Kenwood. Yaesu has a big following. I (and many others) just find them less intuitive to program and work with.

 

[Joey G]

Well careful there JoeyG. There are a fair number of regulations about radios NOT being legal to transmit on different bands (i.e. Ham and FRS or Ham and CB) from one radio.

In this case it's legal, assuming he hasn't invalidated its certification in some way.

 

[gary in ohio]

The problem with many (not all) commercial radio's on the ham bands is that it requires modifications to make them work properly. Compound that the programming software needs to be hacked to allow ham freq. Even if you can get a stock radio programmed into the ham bands you may find the radio sensitivity and RF output is poor or the PLL will not even lock it on freq. You didn't say what model you have but if its a 5100 it will program into the ham bands with no issues, others are not so easy. If the radio is no your personal radio you will need approval from the cheif and from the company that maintains the radio./

 

[DaveInDenver]

I was talking to other ham friends recently about this, at least one Wouxun radio used by a lot of hams carries a Part 90 certification, the KG-UV6D. The radio has no hardware restrictions on where it transmits, in other words you do not have to modify it to work anywhere it covers. No removing jumpers or resistors to 'open it up' or even firmware soft jumpers.

I understand there might be some programming software differences between the ones sold to amateurs and the ones sold to commercial users that might attempt to prevent out of band configurations, but I'm not positive this is even true.

http://www.powerwerx.com/wouxun-radios/kg-uv6x-dual-band-vhf-uhf-commercial.html

Frequency Receive Range VHF: 136-174 MHz UHF: 375-512 MHz FM: 76-108 MHz
Frequency Transmit Range VHF: 136-174 MHz UHF: 406-512 MHz

The FCC rules seem to imply that gear only loses its original certification when you physically modify it to use on the ham bands, e.g. retuning V/UHF repeaters or 11m radios for 10/12m is clearly such a case. But if you do not have to open up or hack the radio in any way from the design submitted and approved by the FCC for Part 90, then you are not technically breaking the rules, since as Joey G mentions there is no Part 97 type acceptance other than one FCC rule requiring approval on commercial HF amps that arose from CB users using ham linear amps.

There is language in the rules for Part 90 (see Subpart I, § 90.203) that stipulate who can and who cannot program radios, so it's not an open gate. If you go programming personal radios for use in public service you might violate rules and jeopardize the agency's license. So don't do it without telling whomever is responsible for your radios.

http://www.ecfr.gov/cgi-bin/text-id...text&node=47:5.0.1.1.6&idno=47#47:5.0.1.1.6.4

But I'm not sure the Wouxun Type 90 approved would be truly illegal to use on public service and ham concurrently. It would be against the rules to use it on FRS due to restrictions placed upon those radios and without a Part 95 certificate you couldn't use it for GMRS. And it's highly unlikely the antenna would allow such wide coverage simultaneously. Our conclusion was it's not clear and might be a question worth posing to legal counsel, maybe at ARRL.

 

[gary in ohio]

If a radio is type certified for use in the 136-174 then its legal on commercial and ham bands. Now you still need to follow other rules that may apply. For example, NO programmable radio made after Nov 2001 is legal on MURS.. No programmable radio is legal on FRS exclusive channels. Part 90 radios are technical not legal on GMRS (its part 95) but FCC has open said part 90 is ok. You also will need a license and/or approval from the license holder to use radios on various freq. For you volunteer FD/EMT this means your commander would need to a approve in writing its ok to have your radio on his freq.

Now for the public saftey crowd, I would not want to put my life on the line by using a Wouxun or Baefong radio as my sole in the field radio. They are not built to handle the punishment other commercial radios are built for.

 

[DaveInDenver]

Yeah Gary, I'm just repeating a discussion I had recently on this very subject. I've always been sure that once a radio is used in the ham service that it lost its original type acceptance. This was probably a safe presumption even up to a few years ago when you still had to make hardware modification (or the equivalent, e.g. such as the Yaesu soft jumpers) . But in this case I'm just not sure.

I also 100% agree with you on the other points, I'm just offering the hypothetical. I just don't think there is a clear case that the rules as currently written would prevent a Part 90 radio from being used in both services interchangeably. I suspect that the intention is that it does not happen but the argument that the hardware and software as presented to the FCC for approval did not prevent it.

 

[Mtn Mike]

As a licensed ham operator, you can use ANY radio on ham frequencies, so long as you're within "good amateur radio operating practice". In fact, you can even build your own radio from scratch and use it on the ham bands (people do). The radio restrictions and type certifications apply radios that operate on EVERY other band EXCEPT amateur bands.

I have access to two VHF commercial frequencies. For that reason, all of my 2-meter radios are part 90 type accepted. There's no problem what so ever programming them for amateur frequencies. No modifications were needed, and there's no difference in the way they operate.

edit: and to answer your question, I've been using the Icom F5021 VHF part 90 for 2-3 years. I really like it on both the amateur bands and part 90 frequencies.

You'll have a few limitations if you want to use a part 90 radio on amateur bands:
- no VFO function (the FCC does not want part 90 radios to be "field programmable"). You'll need software to program the radio whenever you want a new frequency programmed in.
- Generally part 90 radios are meant to be idiot proof tools-of-the-trade for professionals who need to communicate. So once they're set-up by the technician doing the programming, very little can/needs to be done in the field. This means part 90 radios generally have less features, less adjustability, and they're generally not made to toy around with, unlike amateur radios.