Rookies on the Rubicon

[Wh1t3nukle]

I think that this trail takes it's toll on everyone, including the locals... I met a guy in a full-size dodge, who had broken all of his motor/trans mounts, and another guy who had rolled his very capable 4runner(that was running 40's)... someone else apparently broke the frame(!) on his first-gen Toyota, in a couple of places... all that's just within the space of one weekend, in the October off-season... who knows what other damage happened, that I didn't know about.

the locals know every rock on the rubicon, and for them, part of the fun is pushing the limits of their rigs... they will go out of their way to help, and offer lots of good advice.

That Dodge guy is here: http://www.expeditionportal.com/for...odge-Ram-rock-crawler-expedition-build/page19


Us locals encounter changes every weekend. You at least got to check out the latest and greatest new bridge at Ellis Creek. Top dollars at work right there! Hopefully you resolve your rubbing issues and such b/c 37" is the happy medium b/t running pretty much over the majority of the "annoying" size rocks to still being challenged enough that they are not "point-and-shoot" size.

 

[OSV]

LOL, that guy is crazy... "Crushed BOTH doors in on the Rubicon Trail.." "Fordyce Creek: HOLY **** ME!!!!!!!!! Most INSANE trail of the trip... Words cannot explain how crazy that trail is!!!!!!! I broke an Transmission mount and snapped a Rear Driveshaft Ujoint on this trail. EPIC!!!!!!! EPIC!!!!!!!!"

different dodge, tho... the guy I saw was in what used to be a red dodge pickup, he was being followed by what was once an old '70's(?) full size ford pickup, minus the bed... you've probably seen 'em out there before... the guy in the dodge said that he had to strap his drivetrain down to get back out, lol.

I couldn't believe that bridge!! I heard about it from every local that I met... sounds like a giant waste of money to me, over $600k(?) that could have been spent better somewhere else on the trail... here is a good use for that bridge, courtesy of a post on pirate 4x4:

https://scontent-b-sjc.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-frc3/1393742_3493712957769_1259050610_n.jpg

 

[jeremyk]

Great writeup of the experience. It varies for everyone and each different time. The trail changes alot, even more so in the last year-and-a-half. So much has been done by the DOT and recent organized events contributing to the trail's condition. I have video from last year to this year showing drastic change on Cadillac Hill (among other sections), especially the portion right before the right hand turn around the tree (where your video starts in post #102 I think).

Next time you run it in '15, be sure to hit Old Sluice!

Thanks. I have heard that it does change pretty quickly and I can understand that. I'm actually looking forward to next time (with more GC and gearing), but I'm also looking forward to the Dusy.

We will take a close look at doing the Old Sluice, but I'm not going to promise to try it without seeing it...

 

[jeremyk]

I just returned from a brief foray into the rubicon, but only as far as ellis... so many things that you wrote in this thread ring true; this trail never lets up.

I have a far more capable rig than what you all were running, but even then, I found myself pulling over regularly, to look for the safest line to take... I had to drive 500 miles back home, and I needed to keep my parts together.

I think that this trail takes it's toll on everyone, including the locals... I met a guy in a full-size dodge, who had broken all of his motor/trans mounts, and another guy who had rolled his very capable 4runner(that was running 40's)... someone else apparently broke the frame(!) on his first-gen Toyota, in a couple of places... all that's just within the space of one weekend, in the October off-season... who knows what other damage happened, that I didn't know about.

the locals know every rock on the rubicon, and for them, part of the fun is pushing the limits of their rigs... they will go out of their way to help, and offer lots of good advice.

in the end, I turned back because I had brand new 37" mtr's that were rubbing into my back fenders, and a nervous Nellie of a wife who hadn't done much serious rock crawling before, lol

a bit of minor tweaking, and i'll hit it again soon.

thanks for taking the time to write up your experiences.

I can understand how that kind of carnage can happen. One of my greatest advantages is my level of respect for the trail and what might happen if I make a bad mistake or act foolishly. That is a humbling trail.

I hope you get it all fixed up and back at it.

 

[jeremyk]

That Dodge guy is here: http://www.expeditionportal.com/for...odge-Ram-rock-crawler-expedition-build/page19


Us locals encounter changes every weekend. You at least got to check out the latest and greatest new bridge at Ellis Creek. Top dollars at work right there! Hopefully you resolve your rubbing issues and such b/c 37" is the happy medium b/t running pretty much over the majority of the "annoying" size rocks to still being challenged enough that they are not "point-and-shoot" size.

WoW! That is quite a truck, I'm not surprised that it can go just about anywhere. Mine will never be that capable - nice job! We saw the footings for that bridge and spoke with Merlin about it for a while. It is a bit shameful what we are compelled to spend money on.

 

[jeremyk]

bigger tires and better gearing make a *huge* difference on a serious trail like the 'con.

I have dual transfer cases, 2.23/4.70 gearing, and I used all of that combo regularly, all together, even just going in as far as ellis.

the 37" tire size and 5.29 r&p in my rear end puts the odometer within 3% of what mapquest said that my distance traveled was, for the 500 mile drive back... so i'm close to stock, with the big tires and r&p to compensate.

the transfer case gearing is what prevented me from burning up the clutch on the hills and rocks.

Thanks for that info. I would like a two-speed case and front and rear gears - I hope to have both, but I'll probably just go for the gears. And definitely larger tires, or I probably won't do it again. My KM2's are right at 32", which is great for overlanding, but not "trailriding". I'm lucky, I have an auto - which means that I have one less operator thing to think about as I try to keep most of my wheels on the ground.

Maybe I'll post a build thread.

 

[Wh1t3nukle]

different dodge, tho... the guy I saw was in what used to be a red dodge pickup, he was being followed by what was once an old '70's(?) full size ford pickup, minus the bed... you've probably seen 'em out there before... the guy in the dodge said that he had to strap his drivetrain down to get back out, lol.

Oh man, no I actually have not seen that one.... Pics by chance? I've got to rally us foolsize dodge's for the Con. lol I saw that pic on Pirate as well. Grrrrr

Thanks. I have heard that it does change pretty quickly and I can understand that. I'm actually looking forward to next time (with more GC and gearing), but I'm also looking forward to the Dusy.

We will take a close look at doing the Old Sluice, but I'm not going to promise to try it without seeing it...

Good on you!

I've not been to the Dusy and if I do, it's require some bob-work. lol But a standard cab dodge ran it earlier this year.... The Dusy, in my mind at this point, is one of the ultimates.

 

[OSV]

unfortunately I didn't get a shot of it :-( it probably was a ram, ~2003 or later body style?? I used to be a mopar guy way back in the day... 1964 sport fury 426 wedge, 1966 charger, 1968 charger r/t 440, etc.

hey Jeremy, lets see that build thread! you got a great writing style!!

 

[eurosonic]

awesome report. Rubicon kicked my *** this year. Ill be going back soon. Luckily I live couple hours away from the trail head.

 

[VanIsle_Greg]

Great read. Thanks for sharing.

 

[Jeremy P.]

.

I want to be able to put 35's (or something close), on steel wheels as an alternate "mode", and I want to be able to switch back to the 285's for overlanding and towing (I hope to get a Bambi someday). So that means re-gearing. I'll probably go with 4.80somethings. I would also like to get a two-speed Atlas for "crawl". I'm also going to have to get stiffer springs for the rear and hopefully lose the spacers and some sort of longer travel shock in the front - I think that I can gain about 1.5" which along with a 1" diff-drop and the BMC and some wheel-well modification should help fit larger tires.

What a great read, I have been thinking about the Rubicon for a few years now. I sold my dedicated rock crawler so now I am maintaining the balance between trail capable and comfort on a road trip. For example this weekend we towed a 16' camp trailer to canyonlands with my 2004 4runner and then ran elephant hill trail (with 7 passengers!) with no problem. I could not have done that with my crawler or my old 1990 4runner. I recently switched out the front OME suspension in my 4runner to Icon extended travel coilovers and light racing uca's, and I feel they vastly improved the ride, on-road and off. The extended travel version maximizes the wheel travel available (on one side I can feel the tripod joint is at its limit at full droop). To get any more travel the front would need to be changed to a long arm suspension.

 

[jeremyk]

What a great read, I have been thinking about the Rubicon for a few years now. I sold my dedicated rock crawler so now I am maintaining the balance between trail capable and comfort on a road trip. For example this weekend we towed a 16' camp trailer to canyonlands with my 2004 4runner and then ran elephant hill trail (with 7 passengers!) with no problem. I could not have done that with my crawler or my old 1990 4runner. I recently switched out the front OME suspension in my 4runner to Icon extended travel coilovers and light racing uca's, and I feel they vastly improved the ride, on-road and off. The extended travel version maximizes the wheel travel available (on one side I can feel the tripod joint is at its limit at full droop). To get any more travel the front would need to be changed to a long arm suspension.

It is hard trying to build: one rig to do it all. But that's what I'm trying to do as well. I think that with driving skills and just enough modification one truck, with well chosen modifications, can do just about anything reasonable without being debilitated in the process.

Those LT Icon's are what I am looking at for front shocks. I already have some Icon's in the rear with the Metal Tech long-travel kit, which works very well.

Hoping to do Elephant Hill next May on my next SE Utah trip. I want to do the Needles section and into Manti-La Sal and then into the Grand Gulch area...

 

[Jeremy P.]

The grand gulch looks like an interesting area. I'm hoping to get to the hole in the rock trail in the near future.

How well did the MT rear suspension handle the weight on the Rubicon, and how is it without weight in the back?

ps. I have an inchworm lefty transfer case and it makes it incredibly easy to creep up stuff, but I do end up shifting between low and high a lot because it is so low geared.

 

[jeremyk]

The grand gulch looks like an interesting area. I'm hoping to get to the hole in the rock trail in the near future.

How well did the MT rear suspension handle the weight on the Rubicon, and how is it without weight in the back?

ps. I have an inchworm lefty transfer case and it makes it incredibly easy to creep up stuff, but I do end up shifting between low and high a lot because it is so low geared.

The MT is too soft to carry much extra weight. I called and complained and they said that they don't carry much and like them soft and then proceeded to make a medium spring option. I hear that those are substantially stiffer so I'll have to pony up another $200 and install those before my trip in May. It drives fine even though I don't run any sway bars, it's fine on the road, it's all down travel.

I want to get a gear box of some type, I just don't understand much about the Inchworms or the Atlases; I just want to be able to keep what I've got and split the gearing in half for "crawling". I found myself lunging the rig to make it up on rocks and ledges and I don't think that that is sustainable for long...

 

[Jeremy P.]

The lefty drops in place of the stock t-case with no driveshaft changes needed. You could put a marlin crawler doubler in front of your stock t-case but then driveshafts need to be modified as well as the crossmember and gas tank I think.