RV Fuel Cell: Is This the Future of Off Grid Power?

[TomH]

Four times the output of 100Wp solar, almost no sound, works in the dark, fits in the generator compartment. This is available in Europe and Canada. I wonder if it's legal to drive from the U.S. to Canada and have one installed, or if you could have one shipped from Canada. A problem would be shipping the fuel canisters. What do you guys think?

http://www.efoy.com/

 

[steveg1967]

That looks cool.. But I can see the fuel canisters being the problem. I dont think shipping them would be easy or cheap.

 

[4x4x4doors]

They don't mention what the fuel is in the limited reading I did. I know GM had a small fleet of H2 fuel celled Equinoxes running about the US for a while and it was possible to refuel them in selected areas (generally larger metro areas) so I would suspect there is not a prohibition against. Just being logical though which doesn't always stand up to the full force of government regulations.

The Chevrolet Equinox Fuel cell vehicle uses hydrogen for fuel with water as its only exhaust. The Equinox Fuel Cell uses the fourth-generation hydrogen technology found in the Chevrolet Sequel concept, which was unveiled in September 2009. The fuel cell is designed for only 50,000 miles (80,000 km) of driving, but is engineered to be operable in subfreezing temperatures throughout its life. GM states that the Equinox Fuel Cell is about 500 pounds (230 kg) heavier than the original Equinox and has one inch less ground clearance. To reduce weight, it has aluminum doors and a carbon fiber hood. It uses headlights from the Pontiac Torrent.

A dashboard mounted screen calculates the fuel savings to that of a gasoline-powered Equinox. It also includes a kilowatt meter and a fuel cell energy display. The fuel cell has four vapor outlets that replace the exhaust pipe. Three carbon-fiber fuel tanks store up to a maximum of 9.25 pounds (4.2 kg) of gaseous hydrogen at 10,000 psi (70 MPa), and give the Equinox a range of 200 miles (320 km). The Equinox Fuel Cell is certified by the EPA as a zero-emission vehicle (ZEV). GM built 115 Chevrolet Equinox Fuel Cell vehicles and deployed them in through 2007-2008 in several target areas including New York and California as part of a comprehensive plan dubbed "Project Driveway"

Source: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chevrolet_Equinox

 

[TomH]

It says the fuel is liquid methanol. The fuel cell is not the fuel container, it's the mechanism that generates the electricity. It's the shipping of the canisters that would be problematic. I don't know whether the canisters are refillable or not. I think there are places where liquid methanol can be purchased, but the question would be whether you can go there and refill these specific canisters safely. It may be like those little propane canisters that are supposed to be disposed of and not refilled. I know people do refill them, but supposedly they can leak at the coupling if you do that.

 

[Chazz Layne]

According to the site, the fuel canisters are certified for shipping by air, sea and land.

I'd like to see some pricing info. The little one, at a mere 6kg, puts it in the running for use in a small expedition trailer.

 

[Bluewater Australia]

I've been using an Efoy 2200 for a year or so now. All good. All the units are the same size (dimensions), just the power output is varied and hence the cost and the amount of fuel they will use. Mine is the biggest and still uses very little fuel. The fuel containers are either five litre or ten litre methanol. Not refillable. I pay about $60 for a ten litre and it lasts months. Much cheaper than wrecking batteries by not keeping them charged at all times. The Efoy itself is relatively expensive but does what it promises.

Sound level is about that of the laptop I'm typing on, when it's running. The noisiest part is the occasional old man spit of a bit of water out the exhaust tube. Everything is automatic - just connect it to your 12V and forget about it.

 

[tperkins]

According to the site, the fuel canisters are certified for shipping by air, sea and land.

I'd like to see some pricing info. The little one, at a mere 6kg, puts it in the running for use in a small expedition trailer.

I looked around breifly on google and it looked like the 2200 sold for about 5k Euros, which translates to a little over 7 grand. :Wow1:

 

[TomH]

According to the site, the fuel canisters are certified for shipping by air, sea and land.

I wonder if that is true for just the countries they do regular business in. The U.S. can be picky about what is allowed into the country. If I'm correct, you can't ship any type of camping stove fuel (canisters of propane, butane, white gas, etc.) by common carrier (USPS, UPS, FedEx), though trucking companies transport it from manufacturers to distributors and retailers.

 

[Haf-E]

From the Efoy website:

"An M10 fuel cartridge, for example, weights only 8.4 kg but contains enough fuel to produce 11.1 kilowatt hours of energy. That’s enough to keep your mobile home going for several weeks. Power anytime, anywhere – with EFOY fuel cartridges on board, there are no limits to where you can go!"

"910 hours of lighting (using 10W halogen bulbs)" - which equals 9.1 KWH

So the power density is reasonable good - by comparison a standard group 31 battery weighs about 3 times as much and stores about 1/10th the amount.

To produce the same 2.1 kWH a day that the Efoy 2200 can do with solar - it would take about 500 watts of solar panels on a tilted mount and a good sunny day

However - batteries can be recharged from the engine when it runs - and solar panels
require no fuel purchases or maintenance - so its not a direct comparison.

If the EFOY 2200 unit was running full tilt it would require a new 10 liter (~2.5 gallon) tank of fuel every 5 days or so. You would get only 2 kWH of power each day to use - which is not that much for typical RV users (i.e. no AC units or electric cooking applicances). With careful power management, 2 kWH can be an effective amount of energy for expedition use.

These types of fuel cells use methanol fuel that is mixed with de-ionized water and may have other additives. Its a very safe fuel - usually it will not even burn if lit due to the amount of water mixed in.

 

[Bluewater Australia]

In Australia at least all the freight companies just treat the methanol fuel containers as "dangerous goods" - so you pay a bit more to freight them - same category as aerosol cans, boat flares, paint thinners etc.

In real-world usage, most of the battery charging is done by the vehicle, or by the nearest power point; where the Efoy comes into play is when the vehicle isn't being run and you're nowhere near a power point. Then you have three alternatives: Efoy, generator, or solar. If you don't want a generator running, and really who does, then you can still diminish the Efoy usage by employing solar. So in reality, the Efoy might run a few hours a day on and off, or a couple less if you have solar adding to the system. If solar is keeping the batteries charged, the Efoy just sits there doing nothing.

All of which means fuel usage is less than you might think. I've run my entire camp with vehicle battery charger, camper trailer battery charger, two fridges and a freezer, however many lights and whatever stray chargers the kids use, computer, all that stuff, for five days on the Efoy and no solar or generator - used about three litres. If I'd had solar as well, it would have been less.

And yes, US$7K would be about right for the 2200, which is the only thing that stops me getting a second one - it would be nice to have one as a fixture in the trailer, and another in the vehicle for when they're in different places.

 

[Bluewater Australia]

TomH, if you're serious about it I would expect that you would just have to look further than the FedExs of the world to find a not-so-common carrier for the fuel. I buy them two at a time and have to wait a week for them. Doesn't take much planning.


Installation is very simple. It's really just a matter of connecting into your 12V somewhere; routing the exhaust, which is 10mm soft tubing, so that the water doesn't dribble where you don't want it; and strapping down the box somewhere where it will get a bit of airflow. There's also a cool digital display that tells you all sorts of things, but I never got around to mounting that yet.

 

[Bluewater Australia]

I have mine plugged into the vehicle at the moment and just had a flick through the display screen reports. So far this year it's run for 99 hours, and has used seven litres of fuel. It's been plugged in for a lot longer than that, but that's how many hours it's actually been generating current.