Sears Diehard Differences?

Ace Brown

Retired Ol’ Fart
I just replaced my Odyssey battery with the Diehard Platinum. I had considered the Marine version but a close look at the two batteries and review of the specs told me they were identical except the auto version was on sale at $172 while the Marine was only discounted to $206. Both had sticker price of $230. Pics are of marine, auto and my old Oddy.

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BigSwede

The Credible Hulk
The Die Hard Platinums are made by Odyssey (http://www.odysseybattery.com/batteries.html). These are a new construction AGM battery. Here is a snippet from their website: "Some batteries provide enormous cranking power. Others, deep cycle reserve power. The revolutionary ODYSSEY® battery is designed to do both."

So if you have one and only one battery and it needs to be both the starting battery and a "house" battery they seem ideal.

Ah, good to know. Thanks to you and hoser.
 

takesiteasy

Adventurer
Yes, the only difference between any of the PC2150 ODYSSEY series batteries is labeling and terminal configuration. They all perform the same and are manufactured using the same TPPL AGM technology.

Thank you for contacting EnerSys/ODYSSEY.

Sincerely,

Kathy Mitchell
ODYSSEY Sales/Support Representative
Phone: 660-429-7551
Toll Free: 888-422-0317
Fax: 660-429-1758
Email: kathy.mitchell@enersys.com
Web site: www.odysseybattery.com
Corp site: www.enersys.com

This is why I like this forum- good information and I learn something everyday. Poking around on the Odessey site (which I have not done before), I see they classify the batteries as "deep-cycle." I guess the Diehard "marine" label is just marketing. Well, you do an extra set of terminals, haha. But it doesn't seem worth giving up a year of warranty since you can buy add-on terminals for less than the upcharge. Maybe the marine warranty contemplates a harder use factor- more deep discharges than on a typical auto-type application. Anyway, I've changed my view- buy the auto-type, save money and get a longer warranty.
 

CKent323

New member
I just finished exchanging emails with Ms. Mitchell at enersys and she confirmed what @Hoser posted above, i.e. that all their technology is common to all their batteries (Odessey, Sears Die-Hard Platinums) and they are all deep cycle (there are differences in capacity between group sizes of course).

Here are a couple of youtube links she sent (the first one is quite informative):


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3P-wqckJ2nM&list=PLR4mlEnI7ztnbFMzcihoz4dVnsLk0cbVG Manufacturing Facility video J

http://www.youtube.com/user/OdysseyBatteries other product/consumer videos if you are interested in other videos

They recommend AGAINST combining Odessey batteries with batteries from other manufacturers. Also, how charging ais done as well as storage during periods of non-use (for house batteries) is important. Go to the Odessy website and read about charging and storage.

http://www.odysseybattery.com/faq.html


Regards,

Craig
 

wrcsixeight

Adventurer
I talked with length with an Odyssey tech, who did confirm that there are no internal differences between SEars DHP and Odyssey.

The marine versions have both the automotive posts and threaded studs.

What I called the tech about was the recharging requirements.

When deeply cycled, they want a very high recharge rate. 0.4C, or 40 amps for a hundred amp hour battery. Once 40 amps brings the battery upto 14.7V, the charger is to hold the battery at 14.7 for 4 hours, then drop back to 13.7 float voltage.

not meeting these rather high charge currents on a deeply cycled battery will never allow the battery to reach full recharge.*

I asked about a not so deeply cycled battery, and he said they still require this charging regimen for maximum lifespan and performance during that lifespan.

I was mainly concerned about my 200 watts of solar not being able to even come close to this number for one battery, much less the 3 I was considering.

My alternator can meet 40 amps at 14.7, but I don't drive for 4 hours straight very often
I do not have a charger able to meet 0.4c for the capacity I was considering

I did not feel I could properly recharge an Odyssey/DHP in my application. I suspect few can and actually do.

I did acquire a Northstar AGM battery as my Engine battery. These also have similar charging requirements when cycled deeply. I do have a charger which can meet the 0.4C for a 90 amp hour battery, but I am not sure I am going to cycle this battery often.

However I have taken it down to 40%, and recharged it at 0.4C, held 14.65 for 4 hours, and 7+ hours after removal from charger the battery was still at 13 volts. Before cycling it this deeply and recharging it at 0.4C, it would not rest above 12.8 from alternator or solar the first three days after purchase. It had to be cycled and recharged at 0.4C for it to hold the 13.0 rested OCV.

The Odyssey tech said at least two discharges and recharges at 0.4C would be required to bring an improperly charged battery back up to its maximum remaining capacity/ energy density.

I think any reports of poor performance/ lifespan from Sears DHP or Odyssey are largely user induced by not meeting the rather extreme recharging currents recommended by the manufacturer. Many will say you do not need a special charger for AGM. When the manufacturer recommends a certain charging profile that is outside other AGM specs, or FLA specs, it is for a reason. Ignore them at the expense of your wallet. Perhaps you do not have to meet them exactly to get good service from them, but the closer you can come to meeting them, the better.

* The Odyssey tech did say the battery could be fully charged by lesser currents, but required higher voltages(16.5) and low current(1.8 amps), and lots of time.

16.5v is in the danger zone for automotive electronics so I ruled out these Dualpro marine chargers he names as being acceptable for their batteries despite NOT meeting the 0.4C recharging rate.
http://www.powerprosinc.com/Pro-Charging-Systems-Professional-PS3-Battery-Charger.html

Also to note that currents over 5 amps at 15 volts will pop the vents. Do not think you can just run a charger on the flooded battery equalization setting to make up for the lack of 0.4c charging current.


While I can fit 2 group 27 batteries in my auxiliary battery tray, I lowered my overall capacity with just one group 31. A Flooded group 31 US battery that recommends an ~0.1C recharge rate. My Solar can almost meet this, in the summer, and I hope to achieve more cycles by coming much closer to this manufacturer recommended minimum recharge rate. I did not ever require the full capacity of 2 '27's.

The Low and slow trickle charge mentality, In my opinion, is an old wives tale.

Also, beware of the Flooded marine battery, and do not listen to those who say a Marine battery is a deep cycle battery. Any battery can be deeply cycled a few times, that does not make it a deep cycle battery.

One company told me I was buying a 130 amp hour group 31 deep cycle battery from a reputable manufacturer. My capacity test the first night revealed it to be under 100 amp hours and my "extreme cycle service battery" was just in fact a lightweight marine battery.

The scale revealed it to be 56 Lbs. I returned this "Extreme cycle service" group31 battery for a USbattery in the same exact case dimensions, which weighed 10 Lbs more.

Extreme cycle service from a flooded marine battery? What a joke. Buyer beware. Bring your bathroom scale and armed with knowledge. Trust no salesman.
 

4x4junkie

Explorer
^^

I think your volt meter may be off a bit...

No battery (AGM or flooded) will have a resting voltage of 13 volts... It will be either 12.65 or 12.80 at full charge (@ 80°F), depending on it's plate composition (lead-antimony or lead-calcium).
It is possible for a battery freshly off a charger to show a surface charge of 13 volts or a little higher for a brief period (half-hour to a few hours maybe), but after sitting overnight this surface charge will dissipate.

And as for marine batteries, there are two types: Marine/Starting, and Marine/RV.
No doubt, a Marine starting battery you don't want to cycle deeply just like you wouldn't an automotive starting battery. A Marine/RV battery on the other hand is deep-cyclable, however for sure they are not as robust long-term as a dedicated storage battery like ones used for off-grid power storage. The upside is they have lower self-discharge rates, usually require less maintenance, and should tolerate vehicle vibrations better.
 

4x4junkie

Explorer

ETAV8R

Founder of D.E.R.P.
Update:
Both batteries are now the same price and substantially higher than they were when I started this thread.
 

taugust

Adventurer
The Sears website now lists the Platinum batteries at $206.99 with exchange. Does anyone know what the non-exchange price is? I am not looking to replace an existing battery, and don't have a core.
 

ETAV8R

Founder of D.E.R.P.
Love it, price dropped within the past four hours. Just need it to go back down to around 180 like it was.
 

Rando

Explorer
When I picked up one of mine, I brought in a (dead) $12 scooter battery for the core, and that was sufficient. That could be an option if they insist on a core.

The Sears website now lists the Platinum batteries at $206.99 with exchange. Does anyone know what the non-exchange price is? I am not looking to replace an existing battery, and don't have a core.
 

ETAV8R

Founder of D.E.R.P.
For those interested both types of these batteries are on sale right now for $184 and just under $200 out the door with in-store pickup. I finally ordered mine.
 

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