Hodaka
Adventurer
Exactly why I will likely be in the market for a "Baja crap" soon
Subaru Questions
- Thread starter Frdmskr
- Start date
I've had a bunch of Subaru's. My last build was over 400hp and would walk 600cc crotch rockets on the highway while on pump fuel. The only one I had that didn't eat oil was the 2.0l WRX. Did the majority of the work myself.
In addition to basic car stuff, I would advise some additional things....
If you are going to get a pre-2000 2.5L anything, make sure you see receipts for a head gasket replacement or plan on doing it yourself.
If you are buying any 2.5L turbo, get a compression and leak down test before buying. They blow #4 piston ring lands extremely easily. late 2006-2008 are by far the worst years for it, but ALL are extremely susceptible to it, especially if coming from 91 octane land. If you get a turbo model that is good to go, put a cobb accessport or protune on it immediately. It will richen and safen the timing curve and EGT levels and give you much much better longevity.
feel free to touch base with any other questions
vicali
Adventurer
<2008 Forester owner, from 5-90,000km so far
We love our Forester, and I recognize a lot of members from sf.org already beat me to it..
Things to keep in mind;
EJ25 is notorious for headgaskets (allegedly fixed after 2004 but still showing up!>), AWD is picky about tire size, watch for rusty lower control arms (there was just a safety/recall bulletin). Manual has 50/50 f/r drive distribution- Auto is dynamic but usually 90/10 f/r. Mileage isn't that great compare to other fwd rigs.
Things you will love;
Unstoppable/unslippable in winter with winter tires. Awesome safety structure. Can carry a lot of stuff. Lots of mods/swappable Subaru parts if you're into that kind of thing.
Outback is more luxo, more room in backseats, but also lower to the ground, and heavier.
Forester is more utilitarian, you sit higher up, more parts available from the Impreza line..
We love our Forester, and I recognize a lot of members from sf.org already beat me to it..
Things to keep in mind;
EJ25 is notorious for headgaskets (allegedly fixed after 2004 but still showing up!>), AWD is picky about tire size, watch for rusty lower control arms (there was just a safety/recall bulletin). Manual has 50/50 f/r drive distribution- Auto is dynamic but usually 90/10 f/r. Mileage isn't that great compare to other fwd rigs.
Things you will love;
Unstoppable/unslippable in winter with winter tires. Awesome safety structure. Can carry a lot of stuff. Lots of mods/swappable Subaru parts if you're into that kind of thing.
Outback is more luxo, more room in backseats, but also lower to the ground, and heavier.
Forester is more utilitarian, you sit higher up, more parts available from the Impreza line..
E.J.
Explorer
Herbie
Rendezvous Conspirator
I've had a bunch of Subaru's. My last build was over 400hp and would walk 600cc crotch rockets on the highway while on pump fuel. The only one I had that didn't eat oil was the 2.0l WRX. Did the majority of the work myself.
In addition to basic car stuff, I would advise some additional things....
If you are going to get a pre-2000 2.5L anything, make sure you see receipts for a head gasket replacement or plan on doing it yourself.
If you are buying any 2.5L turbo, get a compression and leak down test before buying. They blow #4 piston ring lands extremely easily. late 2006-2008 are by far the worst years for it, but ALL are extremely susceptible to it, especially if coming from 91 octane land. If you get a turbo model that is good to go, put a cobb accessport or protune on it immediately. It will richen and safen the timing curve and EGT levels and give you much much better longevity.
feel free to touch base with any other questions
That's great info Kurt. I guess I've made the right choice sticking with my '02. I miss the driveability of the extra torque from the 2.5L engine (had a 2.5RS previously), but maybe I'll stop lusting after the 2.5turbos...
Hondaslayer
Adventurer
Herbie,
The 2.5 ringland issue is extremely over dramatized. Remember, people only complain when there is a problem, you never hear people say "my ringlands are still good!" Many of these 2.5 ringland failures are due to modifications or low octane fuel. Very, very rarely do you see a stock and well maintained failure. Hell, even modified cars with a proper tune (not an off the shelf map) tend to be very reliable.
Source; Me and my decade plus of working for a Subaru dealer.
The 2.5 ringland issue is extremely over dramatized. Remember, people only complain when there is a problem, you never hear people say "my ringlands are still good!" Many of these 2.5 ringland failures are due to modifications or low octane fuel. Very, very rarely do you see a stock and well maintained failure. Hell, even modified cars with a proper tune (not an off the shelf map) tend to be very reliable.
Source; Me and my decade plus of working for a Subaru dealer.
machine1
Explorer
Yeah, my 2013 is 50/50 and 60/40 on the highway.
toylandcruiser
Expedition Leader
X3. If you out the auto in 1st or 2nd it locks it 50/50
"I ask, sir, what is the militia? It is the whole people, except for a few public officials."
— George Mason, in Debates in Virginia Convention on Ratification of the Constitution, Elliot, Vol. 3, June 16, 1788
I don't think it is. Stock engines are MORE prone to failing than ones with an off the shelf tune. A cobb OTS is the cheapest insurance you can get and it still doesn't make it immune. The problem is the start up emission standards and the horribly crappy tune they put on the ej25 from the factory. To get the tq they wanted with the deck height they had to work with, they had to run too large a bore on the 2.5, giving the piston a huge surface area. Combine that with ****ty flowing heads and super lean fuel enrichment, and the things like to knock like Sheldon on Penny's door. It runs WAY too lean in closed loop fueling, WAY to lean at start up, has WAY too much oil blow by(causing more knock), does not get equal cylinder distribution of fuel or air due to poor designs of the spider intake manifold and fuel rails, and has an ignition timing curve that is all over the place. Its why when you drop the hammer on almost any ej25 powered car you get extremely surgy acceleration.
Subaru went through 4 engines on a 2011 STI just to shoot that year's commercial.
Go to any subaru shop, any subaru forum and ask what the #1 most common problem is on an EJ25. It is universally a cracked #4 piston ringland. There are lots of people that are driving around ej25's with cracked ringlands that don't even know it. They keep getting cyl misfire on bank 2 CEL codes, the dealers generally pull a compression test but not a leak down, are never able to diagnose the problem, and just deactivate the code.
The EJ25 was an attempt to keep pace with the output of the domestic 4G63 and 4B11 because they couldnt get the twin scroll EJ205 or EJ207 from Japan to pass emissions at the power and tq outputs they needed to be competitive.
IMO buying a used EJ25, especially from years known to be worse than others, is an extremely risky proposition.
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Hondaslayer
Adventurer
Kurt,
I am on several Subaru forums and have been for many years. Again, people only complain when there is a problem. For every engine that fails there are many that are perfectly fine. Compression test will show a cracked ringland and by the way a dealer cannot "de-activate" a code. #1 the SSM3 is not capable of that and #2 it is a violation of Federal Law to do so.
Since you want to bring up the 4G63 and 4B11, I am now working at a Mitsubishi dealer. I have seen more 4B11's fail than I ever saw EJ255 and EJ257's fail. Currently we have 2 EvoX and one EvoVIII in here with engine failures. 10 + years at a Subaru dealer, 2 years at a Mitsu dealer.
I am on several Subaru forums and have been for many years. Again, people only complain when there is a problem. For every engine that fails there are many that are perfectly fine. Compression test will show a cracked ringland and by the way a dealer cannot "de-activate" a code. #1 the SSM3 is not capable of that and #2 it is a violation of Federal Law to do so.
Since you want to bring up the 4G63 and 4B11, I am now working at a Mitsubishi dealer. I have seen more 4B11's fail than I ever saw EJ255 and EJ257's fail. Currently we have 2 EvoX and one EvoVIII in here with engine failures. 10 + years at a Subaru dealer, 2 years at a Mitsu dealer.
Opinions vary. Ive seen 4b11 and 4g63 engines fail, and those are generally to extremely high output and/or abuse. Seldom does a 4g63 simply have a failure with the engine due to a design defect.
Ive also personally pulled apart an EJ25 that passed compression test to standard and had a cracked #4 piston ringland. It kept having misfire codes and failed leak down, and sure enough when the block came apart the piston was cracked.
You can deactivate(not just clear) any code you want. I did it for my cats and my secondary air injection system.
There are REGISTRIES on forums to keep track of the number of blown pistons by year of production. I'm not saying its not a statistical minority compared to the total number sold, but its far from "insignificant" imo.
I've owned 5 subarus...2 turbo and 3 NA. I'm stearing clear of them now. They burn oil and break pistons. Its just what they do, especially if you run them hard.
Vios con Dios, mis amigos! I dont want anything to do with them again.
Ive also personally pulled apart an EJ25 that passed compression test to standard and had a cracked #4 piston ringland. It kept having misfire codes and failed leak down, and sure enough when the block came apart the piston was cracked.
You can deactivate(not just clear) any code you want. I did it for my cats and my secondary air injection system.
There are REGISTRIES on forums to keep track of the number of blown pistons by year of production. I'm not saying its not a statistical minority compared to the total number sold, but its far from "insignificant" imo.
I've owned 5 subarus...2 turbo and 3 NA. I'm stearing clear of them now. They burn oil and break pistons. Its just what they do, especially if you run them hard.
Vios con Dios, mis amigos! I dont want anything to do with them again.
Hondaslayer
Adventurer
Kurt,
The dealership cannot de-activate codes (what you claimed the first time around) to de-activate a code you need an aftermarket solution such as Romraider or an accessport. The dealerships select monitor cannot do it, period. Again, the reason for this is because it is a violation of Federal law to tamper with emissions control devices.
Steer clear all you want, I don't hesitate to drive my Subarus and will be replacing them with more Subarus at some point.
The dealership cannot de-activate codes (what you claimed the first time around) to de-activate a code you need an aftermarket solution such as Romraider or an accessport. The dealerships select monitor cannot do it, period. Again, the reason for this is because it is a violation of Federal law to tamper with emissions control devices.
Steer clear all you want, I don't hesitate to drive my Subarus and will be replacing them with more Subarus at some point.
Theprofessional
Silent Footfalls
Drive them until they die, fix it, then drive another 100k, rinse, repeat.
Subarus like to be beat up.