switching from a 4runner to a full size?

[nomad_games]

howdy folks. So i'm on my second 4runner. I've had a couple 4x4 vans, but it's been a while. had a couple old full size 2doors, but wasn't doing so much wilderness stuff or outdoor sports back then. my current 4runner is a 2019 TRD ORP. I bought it new two years ago, just hit 61k on it. Haven't had a single issue with it except all the dirt from offroading makes the sunroof not want to close, and I broke a CV on the crux move on Lockhart Basin in Moab. 275/70's with a small lift was not high enough, lol. I bought the 4runner intending to keep it for 20 years but my lifestyle and needs have changed some, and I'm thinking about switching to a full size pickup.

when I got the 4runner, I was traveling non-stop with my dog, doing a ton of offroading, especially in the high alpine in Colorado. also doing a lot of highway commuting followed immediately by accessing backcountry trailheads for mountaineering and backcountry skiing, because Colorado. I liked the short wheelbase, good snow performance, being able to sleep in the back, good amount of room for gear and my dog. I was also mountain biking a lot around Golden/Denver, so I liked being able to fit my bike inside the vehicle, since bike theft is a serious issue there. I love the 4runner, it's comfortable to drive, pretty cozy for sleeping when camping (i took out the rear seats and put a simple bed platform and a real mattress in it). It's great offroad, especially on narrow trails and tight switchbacks. I did a simple spacer lift on it, nothing fancy. I actually did a year on the road with my dog in it, with the bed platform and the biggest yakima skybox.

so...things have changed a bit. I moved to a tiny town (2000 people) in the middle of nowhere. Theft is not really a problem so I don't need my bike inside anymore and would actually prefer just throwing it on a tailgate pad instead of wrangling it into the back of an SUV every time or using a hitch rack. likewise with skis. I don't offroad as much, so that's less of a priority with my vehicle, although I don't want to lose that possibility completely. I live near amazing backcountry winter access, so I really want a snowmobile, and some of the roads don't allow trailers. I have gotten really sick of sleeping in the back of an SUV, I want a camper trailer or slide in camper I can stand up in. I would also like more power or better mpg or both. with the top box and a hitch rack with 3 bikes on it, I'm getting around 13-14 mpg highway. I travel 8-15 hours each way to either chase pow for skiing or to the desert to mountain bike about once every two months. I also would like to be able to fit 35's with chopping my vehicle up, on the 4runner I had to chop plastic to fit 32's, fitting 34's will require extensive body mods and a huge lift etc, and at that point i'll prob be getting 10mpg, which is what I got on an e350 460 v8 4x4 with 33's on it.


so....full size? yes or no? suggestions on which one?

 

[Grassland]

How many passengers, both in people or dogs? You said 3 bikes, so that's what I'm not sure of.

I don't know much about sleds, could you fit one in a 6.5' box with tailgate down?
I'd lean towards an extended/Supercab truck. Smaller cab but still rear sits an adult can sit in for short trips. Otherwise pull the rear seats and have gear storage. 6.5' bed can easily fit bikes and other gear either a cross bed tool box. Or you could go with a topper and keep stuff dry and less dusty. Could even sleep in the bed then. But with topper you would have to take front wheels off the bikes or put them on a hitch carrier. And wouldn't be able to put a sled in it with a cab height topper. Or if you could it would be super inconvenient to do it I'd imagine.

Full sized Ford's such as the F150 if you keep factory offset you can often fit 34s or even narrow 35s, at least on the 12th gen trucks. The newer ones are similar but have crash bars that need to be flipped, cut, or modified to clear.

My 2014 3.7 NA V6 on "34x10.5R17" (which measure like a small 33") with cab high topper and basic roof rack can get as good as 19 MPG highway at 60-65 MPH. When loaded up in the wind with kayaks on the roof and our trailer in tow (4500# 7' wide) it's more like 12-13 MPG again at 65 MPH.
Plus side the fuel tank is 36 US gallons, whatever 136 liters works out to be, so decent range.

The aluminum trucks can squeeze out better especially if you keep the aerodynamics good with more stuff in and less stuff on. Not sure about when getting into 35s.
Do you really need 35s?
Any time I've been stuck with 34s having an extra inch wouldn't have made a difference.

 

[Wallygator]

I switched from 4Runner to a Tundra. I loved the 4 but Wanted the Tundra for more comfort on road trips and of course more power and capability of carrying things etc, ...it has delivered. From what you say you would need I would recommend you get a one ton and be done.

 

[Grassland]

Or like Wally said skip the halfer. I'd lean towards a gasser 250 though and not a 350 unless for sure you are going to have a heavy camper on the back all the time.

 

[nomad_games]

Why gas and not diesel?

 

[billiebob]

Why 35s? They kill the gas mileage and sure won't improve the ride.

One conflict I'm trying to figure out. You mention snowmobiling without a trailer. Will you be camping or hoteling it. A sled in the box pretty much means towed accommodations or an RTT in the sky..... or will you base camp then take the sled up the "no trailers" road. If you need comfortable sleeping plus the sled in the box, you really only have a choice of a compact trailer.

Going bigger will let you have it all. Altho you likely want smaller than this which hauls 4 sleds, sleeps 4 guys and feeds a small army.

Since you are changing everything except the dog, keep an open mind for crazy options.



Sledding and dogs...

Sleeps 18
Hauls any number of sleds

 

[nomad_games]

How many passengers, both in people or dogs? You said 3 bikes, so that's what I'm not sure of.

I don't know much about sleds, could you fit one in a 6.5' box with tailgate down?
I'd lean towards an extended/Supercab truck. Smaller cab but still rear sits an adult can sit in for short trips. Otherwise pull the rear seats and have gear storage. 6.5' bed can easily fit bikes and other gear either a cross bed tool box. Or you could go with a topper and keep stuff dry and less dusty. Could even sleep in the bed then. But with topper you would have to take front wheels off the bikes or put them on a hitch carrier. And wouldn't be able to put a sled in it with a cab height topper. Or if you could it would be super inconvenient to do it I'd imagine.

Full sized Ford's such as the F150 if you keep factory offset you can often fit 34s or even narrow 35s, at least on the 12th gen trucks. The newer ones are similar but have crash bars that need to be flipped, cut, or modified to clear.

My 2014 3.7 NA V6 on "34x10.5R17" (which measure like a small 33") with cab high topper and basic roof rack can get as good as 19 MPG highway at 60-65 MPH. When loaded up in the wind with kayaks on the roof and our trailer in tow (4500# 7' wide) it's more like 12-13 MPG again at 65 MPH.
Plus side the fuel tank is 36 US gallons, whatever 136 liters works out to be, so decent range.

The aluminum trucks can squeeze out better especially if you keep the aerodynamics good with more stuff in and less stuff on. Not sure about when getting into 35s.
Do you really need 35s?
Any time I've been stuck with 34s having an extra inch wouldn't have made a difference.

Sorry, didn’t see this one the first time for some reason.
It’s usually just me and my dog. On longer trips I take multiple bikes. Like a long travel enduro, a gravel bike, and a shorter travel trail bike. Sometimes I have another person with me. I would like another dog, so it will probably be me and two dogs sooner than later. No, I don’t need 35’s. I would like them because I go pretty deep into the backcountry alone and I would like to do whatever I can to lessen the chances of getting stranded.

 

[nomad_games]

Why 35s? They kill the gas mileage and sure won't improve the ride.

One conflict I'm trying to figure out. You mention snowmobiling without a trailer. Will you be camping or hoteling it. A sled in the box pretty much means towed accommodations or an RTT in the sky..... or will you base camp then take the sled up the "no trailers" road. If the you need comfortable sleeping plus the sled in the box, you really only have a choice of a compact trailer.

Going bigger will let you have it all. Altho you likely want smaller than this which hauls 4 sleds, sleeps 4 guys and feeds a small army.

Since you are changing everything except the dog, keep an open mind for crazy options.

View attachment 694726

I won’t be camping or staying in hotels when snowmobiling. I live 15-30 minutes from a lot of fun sled areas. In winter, trailers are not allowed on the pass, but there is good sledding up there.

 

[billiebob]

I would like to do whatever I can to lessen the chances of getting stranded.

Selectable Lockers in both axles.
Then a winch but I find if I'm in marginal territory, locking up and finding a better route means I never use the winch.

Selectable lockers and you won't even want or need bigger rubber.

 

[Grassland]

Sorry, didn’t see this one the first time for some reason.
It’s usually just me and my dog. On longer trips I take multiple bikes. Like a long travel enduro, a gravel bike, and a shorter travel trail bike. Sometimes I have another person with me. I would like another dog, so it will probably be me and two dogs sooner than later. No, I don’t need 35’s. I would like them because I go pretty deep into the backcountry alone and I would like to do whatever I can to lessen the chances of getting stranded.

If you keep it lighter, a half ton extended cab would do majority of what you list and get reasonable fuel economy. Many small lifts and suspension packages from a variety of manufacturers are available, and many half tons can go up a couple inches in tire size on OEM wheels quite easily. If you keep weight in check they are quite the jack of all trades.

And gasser vs diesel because the upfront costs of a new diesel are very high, the maintenance costs are high, and modern emissions equipment is where much of the reliability issues reside.
Unless you need the diesel for towing, your realistic break even mileage is quite high.
New gasser HD trucks have considerable capabilities and a large market share is geared towards fleet operators who want lower upfront costs and lower maintenance costs with minimal down time.

**Edit**
For fuel economy on the half tons, most of the spectacular numbers I've seen are on non lifted trucks with P rated OEM tires.
Drivetrain weight really effects the trucks. Total weight and aerodynamics does as well, as business associate and friends F150 with a wedge topper and roof rack with several ladders and 1000# of payload on top of that has a 4 liter per 100km increase of fuel consumption compared to stock and it's on OEM P rated factory tires still (somehow, only a matter of time as it's been two years)

 

[nomad_games]

Selectable Lockers in both axles.
Then a winch but I find if I'm in marginal territory, locking up and finding a better route means I never use the winch.

Selectable lockers and you won't even want or need bigger rubber.

Not true. I have a selectable locker on my 4runner and 32’s. I broke a CV because there was only one way through and I didn’t have the clearance to not get stuck on my skid plate.

 

[nomad_games]

This is a problem that can be both prevented and solved

You don’t say.

 

[Littlehouse]

Yes.

I went from a 1/2 ton crew cab 5.5 bed to a GX460 and will be moving to another full size in the future. I'd like a Tremor with the 7.3, but I don't think it will fit in the garage. F150 Tremor with the torsen front, new Tundra, Raptor, and Silverado ZR2 are all options I'll take a look at. All will probably have better gas mileage than the GX.

 

[billiebob]

Not true. I have a selectable locker on my 4runner and 32’s. I broke a CV because there was only one way through and I didn’t have the clearance to not get stuck on my skid plate.

Excellent point. And the reason the Jeep Rubicon uses Dana 44s on both axles. In 4LO and all locked up it is possible to send ALL the torque thru one tire. No doubt about it, CVs are not engineered to take ALL the torque. Every mod leads to the next mod and my signature says the rest.

But the Rubicon lockers I've had for 10 years are to die for. Incredible how many places I can crawl thru. Since I no longer need momentum I never break anything and I can Tread Lightly thru those places I used to spin my tires. Lockers used correctly truly are a game changer. After years of bigger tires I am also back to skinny 31s and loving the smoother ride and better fuel economy..... translated to an extra 95 miles of overlanding range. I never paid attention to gas mileage as I went from 31s to 33s to 35s..... but WOW going back to 7.50R16s was sure noticeable. Literally an extra 95 miles on the highway.

 

[Grassland]

Yeah that Tundra could be something. It will take forever to be available in central Canada, and will probably be obscenely priced, but they've had a lot of time to come up with it and do it right.
If they offer the rear locker and tow package on a lower trim I'd be interested.