TerraLiner:12 m Globally Mobile Beach House/Class-A Crossover w 6x6 Hybrid Drivetrain

thjakits

Adventurer
...someone said there is a rule on this forum, that you can't just start up a big riot with your thread and then disappear - Biotect, you are getting awefully close to be in violation of the rule!:smileeek:


Not that we give much about rules.....


However - .....ANY news? :Wow1:



Cheers,

thjakits :coffee:
 
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biotect

Designer
Hi thjakits,

Sorry for the gap; I've had a million and one things to do.

When time was free, I began working on a very long post that sort of became 5 or 6 different posts wrapped into one, on subjects like Solar, solar awnings, DNI (daily normal irradiation), wind speeds worldwide, etc. etc. I am now re-organizing it all into more digestible "chunks". Promise that I'll post the first installment by the end of this week. It's literally a mountain of material, and then there are some previous posting-series that I have to clean up/complete.

All best wishes,


Biotect
 

Pinstripe

Adventurer
Looks like I'll have to clear some time on my schedule this weekend, biotect's update posts are usually packed with details and links! :ylsmoke:
 

Pinstripe

Adventurer
Look what I found!

http://mountaineers.is/check-out-our-new-luxury-8x8-monster-bus/

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Fully open inside, including driver's cabin!
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biotect

Designer
Hi Pinstripe,

Terrific!!

This vehicle very nicely demonstrates how a MAN KAT 8x8 can be turned into a bus. I came across the same vehicle when posting in the "Camper Thermal Engineering" thread, but back then "Mountaineers of Iceland" did not yet have such large, gorgeous images available in their website. See posts #16 -- # 19 at http://www.expeditionportal.com/for...p-High-Altitude-Arctic-Antarctica-Tibet/page2 .

Actually, the base vehicle may be a MAN TGS or TGA, because the cab looks non-military. The TGS and TGA do not have completely rigid frames as per the MAN KAT or SX series. The lower-cost MAN HX series of military trucks, for instance, are basically built on a TGS/TGA frame. Only the MAN SX series have frames that are completely rigid. So I wonder if "Mountaineers of Iceland" reinforced the frame of this vehicle to make it completely rigid and torsion-free, before putting a bus-cabin on top?

I also wonder whether the cab still has to tilt forward to provide access to the engine. Or whether they might have relocated the engine in the rear, as per a Foremost Industries "Snow Coach" -- see posts #23 to #30 and #40 to #41 , at http://www.expeditionportal.com/for...p-High-Altitude-Arctic-Antarctica-Tibet/page3 , http://www.expeditionportal.com/for...p-High-Altitude-Arctic-Antarctica-Tibet/page4 , and http://www.expeditionportal.com/for...p-High-Altitude-Arctic-Antarctica-Tibet/page5 (standard ExPo pagination).

All best wishes,


Biotect
 
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biotect

Designer
...
...

Dear all,

I've been busy, and have prepared a monster-sized series of posts that (I hope) will give everyone lots of food for thought. For the next week, between now and next Tuesday, September 22nd, please do not post. That way I should be able to finish getting the first section of entries onto the system, in sequence, with all the images included.

By “first section of entries”, I mean posts that will cover everything up to and including “retractable patio cover systems”. This is a type of awning that is quite different from the awnings typically found on on motorhomes. As we'll see, it is a type of awning that will prove necessary for the TerraLiner, if the TerraLiner is to achieve some degree of power autonomy via solar.

Because this is such a monster-sized series of posts, I will probably need at least four months to get all the sections (sections 2, 3, 4....) on to the system as well. Because I want feed-back, I will post one section, then wait for two weeks; post the next section, and again wait for a few weeks; and so on. In each case, I will make a request that nobody respond until I've removed the warning at the end. Needless to say, even after posting all the text for a given section, it will probably take at least another week to insert all the images




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SECTION 1: FUNDAMENTAL ASSUMPTIONS,
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WATER, ENERGY, and WIND




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In this first section of posts, I will cover the following topics. Think of this as a kind of "Table of Contents."



A:
....
... DESIGN CALENDAR

..............At least one more year thinking through the TerraLiner -- this page


B:
.../.....WARNINGS -- this page


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Ci:
..... .. Some Fundamental Assumptions: SURF GLAMPER

...
.. ....... http://www.expeditionportal.com/forum/threads/124789-Fully-Integrated-MAN-or-TATRA-6x6-or-8x8-Expedition-RV-w-Rigid-Torsion-Free-Frame/page154


Cii: .... ...Fundamental Assumption Two: CAUTIOUS WILD-CAMPING

...
........ .. http://www.expeditionportal.com/forum/threads/124789-Fully-Integrated-MAN-or-TATRA-6x6-or-8x8-Expedition-RV-w-Rigid-Torsion-Free-Frame/page155


Cii .........Fundamental Assumption Three: GLAMPING ON COASTAL FARMLAND

.........
.. .. http://www.expeditionportal.com/forum/threads/124789-Fully-Integrated-MAN-or-TATRA-6x6-or-8x8-Expedition-RV-w-Rigid-Torsion-Free-Frame/page156


Civ: .......Fundamental Assumption Four: COASTAL EXPLORATION

..........
.. ..http://www.expeditionportal.com/forum/threads/124789-Fully-Integrated-MAN-or-TATRA-6x6-or-8x8-Expedition-RV-w-Rigid-Torsion-Free-Frame/page156


Cv: ........Fundamental Assumption Five: The TERRALINER and its TOAD will be conceptually, physically, and programatically distinct

..........
.. ..http://www.expeditionportal.com/forum/threads/124789-Fully-Integrated-MAN-or-TATRA-6x6-or-8x8-Expedition-RV-w-Rigid-Torsion-Free-Frame/page157


Cvi: .......Fundamental Assumption Six: SLOW TRAVEL

...
.......... .http://www.expeditionportal.com/forum/threads/124789-Fully-Integrated-MAN-or-TATRA-6x6-or-8x8-Expedition-RV-w-Rigid-Torsion-Free-Frame/page157


Cvii: ......Fundamental Assumption Seven: THE TERRALINER WILL NOT BE AN "EXPEDITION" MOTORHOME

...........
.. .http://www.expeditionportal.com/forum/threads/124789-Fully-Integrated-MAN-or-TATRA-6x6-or-8x8-Expedition-RV-w-Rigid-Torsion-Free-Frame/page157


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D:
..../....Why have I posted all this material?

...
.. .........http://www.expeditionportal.com/forum/threads/124789-Fully-Integrated-MAN-or-TATRA-6x6-or-8x8-Expedition-RV-w-Rigid-Torsion-Free-Frame/page157


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E:
..........TOILETS

...
.. .........http://www.expeditionportal.com/forum/threads/124789-Fully-Integrated-MAN-or-TATRA-6x6-or-8x8-Expedition-RV-w-Rigid-Torsion-Free-Frame/page158


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Fi:
.........WATER – Recycling Greywater, and Collecting Rainwater from the TerraLiner's Roof versus Water from Ground Sources

.... .........http://www.expeditionportal.com/forum/threads/124789-Fully-Integrated-MAN-or-TATRA-6x6-or-8x8-Expedition-RV-w-Rigid-Torsion-Free-Frame/page158


Fii:........ WATER – The Problem of Obtaining Water from Snow

..... .........http://www.expeditionportal.com/forum/threads/124789-Fully-Integrated-MAN-or-TATRA-6x6-or-8x8-Expedition-RV-w-Rigid-Torsion-Free-Frame/page159


Fiii: ........WATER – AWGs in Greater Depth


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G:
.........The True Meaning of Design Innovation


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H:
..... ...DIESEL ENERGY -- Generators


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Ia:
.........SOLAR ENERGY – Solar Power Technology

Ib:
.........SOLAR ENERGY – Calculating the potential power of the TerraLiner's Solar Array

Ic:
.........SOLAR ENERGY – TerraLiner Solar Power Output considered Geographically, in terms of DNI

Id:
.........SOLAR ENERGY – The Solar Technology of the TerraLiner's Side-Awnings: Thin-Film Flexible


J:
...../.....AWNINGS – The Different Kinds of Side-Awning Technology Currently Available.

K:
.../......SOLAR ENERGY – Using the Paramount awning as a precedent for the size of the TerraLiner's side-awnings.


Li:
...../....WIND – The Problem of Wind Considered Geographically, and in Tandem with DNI

Lii:
...../...WIND – Designing for really serious wind


M:
../.......SOLAR ENERGY – 11 to 12 KW of Solar Power?


N:
.... //....SUMMARY – Tying it all together



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biotect

Designer
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PART A: DESIGN CALENDAR

At least One More Year Thinking Through the TerraLiner



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Because of this thread on ExPo, the TerraLiner's design has substantially changed. What began as one kind of TerraLiner, has morphed into a drastically different kind of TerraLiner. All of the “critical inputs” and “helpful suggestions” offered in this thread have made an enormous difference, and have forced me to radically rethink the entire design.

The resulting re-design is now far more interesting than what I began with. But it's still in a state of flux. It will take at least another year before the design finally “stabilizes”, and begins to achieve what Bran Ferren described as design and engineering "closure" -- see at http://on.aol.com/video/designing-a-family-friendly-extreme-expedition-vehicle-517751459 .


When a somewhat famous South African 4WD blogger decided to create his own, custom-built, bespoke, “Ultimate 4WD” SUV conversion, he spent at least 2 years first “conceptualizing” the vehicle, before bringing his vehicle in to Alu-Cab in Capetown to begin conversion – see http://www.alu-cab.co.za , http://www.alu-cab.co.za/index.php/...s/hercules-land-cruiser-range-detail?Itemid=0 , and http://www.alu-cab.co.za/index.php/...built-projects/icarus-project-detail?Itemid=0 :






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biotect

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Two years “conceptuliazing” and thinking through this Toyota Landcruiser conversion, and it was just a 4x4 SUV!!

So I hope that I can be moderately forgiven for stating that the TerraLiner needs at least as long to be properely thought through from the outset. By which I mean really thought through, including at the level of how large solar awnings might remain deployed in 30 m.p.h wind conditions, so that they can take maximum advantage of sunlight in countries that have blistering DNI, i.e. terrific solar radiation……


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Think of this huge, simply gargantuan series of posts as my attempt to “conceptualize out loud” on ExPo, hoping to get as much practical feedback as I can, before I go “back to the drawing board,” and spend another 5 or 6 months working with CAD. I know that everyone was hoping for some conceptual or CAD drawings round this time. But so many aspects of the TerraLiner's design have fundamentally changed, above all because of this thread. I am now thinking of the TerraLiner in a rather different way than even just 6 months ago. I don't want to publish mere "vaporware", mere conceptual studies that bear no relationship to reality, and that cannot be practically justified. There's not much use in publishing such drawings, except at bitter end of a design process, which now looks at least another year distant..... Inadequate drawings published prematurely generally serve as mere food for wolves: for the wolves to descend, and simply state the obvious: "That's just vaporware!!"

So given that I now have lots of free time to really think through the TerraLiner to a completely new level, it seems worth grabbing the opportunity, and seeing just how much further I can get. The "rigid torsion-free frame with fully integrated cab/camper" -- as pictured in those beautiful images posted above by Pinstripe, of a Mountaineers of Iceland "Expedition Bus" -- well, that's one level of design innovation. We've now more or less explored that do death. The only aspect of the under-frame that we still haven't addressed much is the shocks and/or suspension type: for instance, air-bags versus continuously adjustable hydro-pneumatic. So too, I want to write a bit more about the advantages of a Chinese Six axle arrangement. But apart from that, it's now time to move on, and begin seriously addressing other systems.

Once I began really serious thinking about other systems -- solar in particular -- it soon became abundantly clear that the whole physical design of the TerraLiner would have to change. It would need big solar awnings wind-stabilized by large drop-down decks. But this will be design change for the better: the TerrraLiner now looks even more like the brightly colored, winged Phoenix of my dreams.....



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biotect

Designer
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PART B. WARNINGS



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1. Transporation Logistics, Meterology


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ADVANCE WARNING: this is a series of posts only for the truly committed.

You do not have to read these posts!!


This series of posts is gargantuan, and to be honest, at some level I wrote them for mainly for myself, to help further motivate my thinking about the TerraLiner.

They may seem self-indulgent and rambling, but there is a kind of method to my madness.

For instance, much further along I will discuss – in extravagant detail – both Lake Titicaca, Punta De Lobos in Chile, the Nicoya Peninsula in Costa Rica, and the Dominican Republic. The reader might think that I’ve been to these destinations, and that before writing these posts, I was already in love with them. But neither is true. After writing about these destinations at great length, sure, I’ve fallen in love with both.

My main motivation in writing about such destinations was to empirically explore:


(a) The kinds of incredible glampsites that might be avaialable to a vehicle such as the TerraLiner

(b) The utility of having the TerraLiner carry a Hydrojet RIB: a boat with a turbocharged diesel that can function well at high-altitude; a boat that is water-jet driven, not propeller driven, so it can drive easily through marshes and up onto beaches

(c) The tremendous utility of a vehicle like the TerraLiner even on an island-nation like the Dominican Republic, a nation that is famous for not having estensive camping facilities

(d) The accessibility of Caribbean island-nations to a vehicle like the Terraliner, even though at first this may seem unlikely


So a great deal of what follows deals not only with TerraLiner and Hydrojet RIB design, it also deals with transportation and glamping logistics, as well as meterology. I go into these topics in tremendous detail, and they are the kinds of things that will only interest transportation freaks.

For what it’s worth I felt that I had no choice. To get a genuine “empirical” handle on how the TerraLiner might operate in real-world conditions, thinking about Lake Titicaca and the Dominican Republic, for instance, was necessary. So too, thinking about island-hopping in the Caribbean, and crossing the Darien gap.

Personally, I love thinking about “transportation logistics”. So if this is not your thing, then these posts are not for you. So too, I love thinking about climate, and the various possible interactions between latitude, altitude, proximity to water, season, precipitation, wind, etc.; all the things that give a given country or particular place it’s local meteorology and vegetation. The Russian-German climatologist Wladimir Köppen is my hero, because his climate-classification system has allowed me to make rational sense of the scores of different climate types that I’ve experienced in my travels thus far – see https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Köppen_climate_classification :


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biotect

Designer
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2. Sunsetology


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I even like thinking about “sunset-ology”, the way that a given place will have a geography that either enables or blocks the possibility of great sunsets. This obsession was perhaps the unfortunate consequence of living in the Swiss Alps for a few years, where at the bottom of the valleys the sunsets really sucked.

The feeling of missing proper sunsets in Switzerland became so strong, that for that reason alone, and many others, I began to really hate the country. I began thinking of Switzerland as a gloomy, mountain-ringed, xenophobic, democratic-fascist prison.

And then during holidays the great sunsets that I would experience only rubbed salt into the wounds: sunsets on Florida Bay just south of Everglades National Park, or sunsets on Venice's lagoon, as seen from the barrier-island of Pellestrina -- https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pellestrina , https://it.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pellestrina , and http://www.comune.venezia.it/flex/cm/pages/ServeBLOB.php/L/IT/IDPagina/8884 :


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See http://suncalc.net/#/45.2733,12.3011,7/2015.09.24/21:52 .



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biotect

Designer
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On Pellestrina the sunsets are blood-red, no doubt because of the overlying smog in the Po valley, which continues more or else flat-as-a-pancake for hundreds of miles west. The small hills off to the left are the Eugeanean Hills, made famous by Petrarch's poetry -- see https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Euganean_Hills . But the lagoon is so huge, that flat land and vegetation on the opposite shore are barely visible.

Only to the north, and closer up, on the other side of the lagoon, the Alps become wonderfully visible on a clear day:



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On a clear day one also gets a great view of the Alps from St. Mark's Campanile in Piazza San Marco, in central Venice.

I once spent a summer on Pellestrina, and yes, the sunsets really are this incredible. Pellestrina is one of my favorite places on earth.


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biotect

Designer
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Or consider the sunsets along a strip of coast in Tuscany just north of Piombino and south of Livorno, from a wonderful hill-top village called Castagneto Carducci – see https://www.google.com/maps/place/57022+Castagneto+Carducci+LI/@43.1602047,10.6111301,12z/data=!4m2!3m1!1s0x12d602a3095697f3:0x6a74279d62110eb5 , http://suncalc.net/#/43.1597,10.6117,6/2015.10.01/20:17 , https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Castagneto_Carducci , https://it.wikipedia.org/wiki/Castagneto_Carducci , and http://www.comune.castagneto-carducci.li.it , and http://www.comune.castagneto-carducci.li.it/tourist-information/ :


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From high up one gazes across flat land and then the sea, with an expansive, uninterrupted Mediterreanean horizon, only the northen tip of Corsica barely visible, and Elba far to the south….....:sunny:


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biotect

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Further west, right on the Mediterranean Sea, there's a small village called "Marina di Castagneto Doratico", a kind of "sister port" to the village up on the hill, where there are some beautiful beaches backed by thick groves of pine and oak trees -- see https://it.wikipedia.org/wiki/Marina_di_Castagneto_Carducci and http://www.comune.castagneto-carduc...isti/gallery/marina-di-castagneto-donoratico/ :



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The sunsets are also wonderful from Anacapri (the western half of Capri); from the west coast of Corsica and Sardinia; and from Trapani, or high up in Erice (the far western tip of Sicily):


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So yeah, I am obsessed with sunsets. My idea of a great vacation would be glamping on a big beach with the TerraLiner, taking in great sunsets, and falling asleep to the sounds of ocean waves.

Here is an excellent blog-article that explains the magic of sunsets, particularly those setting on the ocean in the Carribean – see http://www.uncommoncaribbean.com/20...-to-decoding-the-allure-of-caribbean-sunsets/ . But perhaps because I've felt so “deprived” of regular great sunsets for at least 50 % of my life, my approach to sunsetology in this series of posts will be a good deal more scientific and systematic than this article. I will often try to nail down good TerraLiner glampspots that have great sunsets, and then determine whether these would also be good places for the TerraLiner to be, from other points of view, e.g. solar, wind, security, etc.

If sunsets aren't your thing, then just skip over those posts that delve deeply into “sunsetology”.


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3. DNI, Wind-Maps, Low Pressure Cells, Fetch, Wave-Height Maps, and Lots of Videos of Surfing


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There is the added fundamental issue that if the TerraLiner is to have “maximal solar” – more solar cells than any RV ever built – then it's also important to think in detail about how and under what conditions the solar cells will work. So what follows will be filled with lots of maps of “DNI”, or “Direct Normal [Solar] Irradiation”, as well as maps suggesting the kinds of things that can block good DNI, for instance, equatorial precipitation:


DNI-world-map.jpg



Even though countries like Columbia, Venezuela, the Congo, and Indonesia should have great DNI, because they are situated right on the Equator, their weather is so perpetually wet or overcast, that their DNI levels are actually quite poor. So equatorical Africa and equatorial South America, where the sun sits directly overhead, would be exactly those locations where the TerraLiner might find itself heavily reliant on a secondary diesel generator for power. These are equatorial countries where the solar panels will be working at minimal efficiency, not maximum.

In this gargantuan series of posts I will be exploring such “details” at great length.

Furthermore, I will be exhibiting an obsession with surfing. My agenda will not be merely finding great glamp-sites, but great glamp-sites with great surf. So I will go deeply into the details of seasonal Low-Pressure systems, "Fetch", and Wave Height. And get ready for lots and lots of videos about surfing......:sombrero:


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Yes, there is a huge quantity of information and material here. But I hope that at least some of it will prove useful, and that it will help “advance” the thinking of those who are truly interested in this thread. I know that these posts helped my own thinking tremendously, just researching and writing them! And believe it or not, this is my idea of fun…..:).... So this is a very “idiosyncratic” series of posts, posts that I sort of gifted to myself, in celebration of the end my academic year.

Remember: YOU DO NOT HAVE TO READ THESE POSTS!!!

So please, if you don't like what follows, or if you simply don't like the quantity, yes, I know perfectly well that I've posted a mountain of material all in one go. Please do not respond with complaints following these posts. I've only posted so much stuff in one place, in one go, because those who have long attention spans may find this useful. For those who don't have the time or the interest to follow these posts, please just ignore them, and skip ahead as if they'd never happened.


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biotect

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PART Ci: Some Fundamental Assumptions


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1. Fundamental Assumption One:
SURF GLAMPER


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Again, I wrote these posts to help clarify my design thinking. Sure, good transporation design is also about aesthetics and engineering details. But for a vehicle like the TerraLiner, a vehicle whose “mission profile” is not as clearcut as a standard vehicle type such as a Sports Car, thousands more sketches and CAD renderings are not going to help. What's needed instead is further clarification of the mission profile, or as architects would call it, “the program”.

I am a surfer, so I've given myself permission to go all out, and think of the TerraLiner as a “Surf Glamper”: a bad-road, globally-capable Class-A-sized motorhome purpose-built to support watersports. In what follows there will be lots of videos about surfing, and speculation about surf spots where the TerraLiner might sojourn for a few months, catching some great waves….. emoticon

Although the TerraLiner will be a very large, Class-A size motorhome, its ultimate "locus of design inspiration", if you like, will be the original VW Kombi Samba edition, the one with 23 windows, the one that features in the vast majority of vintage surfing photos:



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2. If the TerraLiner is a Surf-Glamper, this means it must also be a Surf-Chaser.

....And perhaps also Winter-Bad-Weather Chaser, and even a Storm Chaser


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Now in the course of writing theses posts, I realized that as a “Surf Glamper”, the TerraLiner must be imagined and designed as a bit of a “Storm Chaser”, as a vehicle that does not avoid wind, and that can camp perfectly well on sandy beach. To the contrary, the TerraLiner might actively seek out windy conditions, at least in so far as they generate ocean swell on the water.

But this will stand in potential direct contradiction to another big design agenda: that the TerraLiner should be a vehicle as autonomous as possible in terms of power, via massive solar not just on the roof, but also thin-film flexible solar on large side awnings. Awnings that will then have to withstand a good deal more wind than is typical of most motorhome awnings. Many of these posts in this series could be understood as explorations of this potential – but not geographically inevitable – contradiction. Not an inevitable contradiction, because often the wind that produces major ocean swell occurs thousands of miles away from where the waves finally land.

It's also an unfortunate fact about surf in both hemispheres that it's best in the winter, when big low-pressure cells get generated in the northern Pacific and northern Atlantic (October to April), or the southern Pacific, southern Indian Ocean, and southern Atlantic, near Antarctica (May to September). In the following excellent video of wave-height globally for all of 2012, notice how during the late spring, summer, and fall months (April to October) there is virtually no significiant wave action in the northern hempisphere: neither in the north Pacific nor the north Atlantic :






And also notice how the reverse is true of the coast of Chile in South America: relatively calm during the southern hemisphere's summer months, from October to April, with big waves only hitting the shore during the winter months, April to October.

Put simply, great surf happens in both hemispheres when the sun will be lowest in the sky, when the climate might be rainy, there's more wind, and the DNI will be the least impressive.



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