The J8 thread....

[jingram]

Game Over... no maual makes it "not the truck for me" so there's my opinion from my intrest point.

This was from my conversation with Dave at AEV. Personally, I was looking at the J8 pretty seriously, but the lack of a manual transmission killed it for me. Like you all, I too think it should have been locked front and rear from the factory. Conversation on AEV forums hints that ChryCo is charging an arm and a leg for these rolling chassis because they can, certainly not because the extra bit of frame reinforcement and the bigger rear axle/leaf spring combo costs them much more. In fact, with all of the things being stripped the J8, my guess is cost wise it is a wash for them compared to a Rubi. It is interesting how AEV is playing the kit car angle to get these to folks though. People want to piss on their parade, but the reality is that they don't have a whole lot of choices and are doing this to make some money and provide a service to the jeep and overland communities. If you look at in the context of guys buying JKs and then doing $15k-$20k hemi swaps then it makes A LOT of sense to just buy a J8. ChryCo can say whatever they want about emissions, but the reality is that they are producing JKs in the US with diesels and manuals and shipping them overseas. If we want to get pissy, it should be at ChryCo. Anyway, Lots of this stuff has been hashed over there:

Me:

I know all of the negatives about a manual transmission in this application and know your thoughts on this, but I also know that you came out with a manual option for the hemi kits. Since the CRD in Europe and Aus comes with a manual option, even if the 2.8 has been detuned, will a manual kit be offered for the j8? Honestly, it is really the only thing holding me back at this point. As far as I am concerned this is a lifetime vehicle and the perfect expedition vehicle outside of say a 70 Series LC or Nissan Patrol, but I just can't bring myself to buy a slush box.

Dave:

I understand your caution on the automatic, but here are my thoughts:
•All military vehicles are autos, they are easier to drive and shoot or drive and be injured etc...hopefully the first one is never a concern, but the second certainly can be in the middle of nowhere.
•The 545 is rated to two 17000 lbs and is used in the Dodge Ram, Grand Cherokees, Commanders, Durangos, etc...Its a fantastic transmission (for an auto )
•I don't know what it would take to convert a J8 to a manual, but it should be pretty easy, it might not be something we would offer, but the parts are available oversees as you say, meaning it might cost some in shipping, but its not a fabrication project.
•I've driven the 2.8 auto and the 2.8 manual. While I do like the manual better, its not that much better that it would keep me away from the J8, not at all. For reference, we have a 1 ton Ram manual.Cummins and an auto, the auto is terrible, it feels like a completely different engine and I would never buy another auto in the Dodge again. The J8 is not like that.
•We did the HEMI 5.7 because its more of a "fun" engine than the diesel, and the manual is great for goofing off.

Me:

I appreciate your input very much. Clearly you are right, it would be much easier to drive and shoot or drive while injured and to be quite frank I had never really put it into that perspective before. I know I can try and track parts down overseas. The biggest issue would be canbus and the ecu wouldn't it?

Dave:

No, the biggest issue would be pulling out all the unnecessary wiring that the 545 uses. The ECU would work fine since in this application it operates pretty much as a stand alone computer just for the engine, the trans controller won't be happy but who cares.

 

[Metcalf]

I'm going to bring this one back up again....

I think the J8 has a lot of potential for a bolt together Diesel Expedition vehicle in the USA. Sure, you can convert just about anything to anything, but for a bolt together in the Wal-mart parking lot kind of option I think the J8 takes the cake.

I hear everyone's concern over the auto vs manual. This boils down to the tipping point ( other than cost ) for most people.

If you add it all up even with the reported 50K ticket price, I think you would be VERY hard pressed to build something comparable for less money. Yes, it has its issues where you think....why didn't they just do it this way!....but overall it has to be a proven package for military applications. While I don't fully understand the implications of the 'severe' duty testing that the J8 platform went through, I would have to assume that if the standard JK would have been able to even come close to the durability needed they wouldn't have made so many changes within the J8.

Time will tell for sure. Once the first people in the market get there hands on one I am sure we will hear ALL about every little detail!

 

[upcruiser]

I am a huge fan of this vehicle. I think it has great potential as a starting point. Mechanically what do you really need for ovlerand travel? The frame, the suspension components, are all designed to take more punishment then most overlanders will give it stock. It doesn't have lockers? For real overlanding trips, how often do you really need lockers? Maybe a rear sometimes but so what, throw in an ARB setup and have the benefit of onboard air too.

Many members of this board post about how they wish there was a bare bones, all utility offroader with a diesel powerplant available in the US. Well here it is, in a couple of different body styles nonetheless. I'd take this over importing a used, early '80s 70 series Troopy if I was going to embark in a long overland trip. The Troopies are great, but they are used, this is brand spanking new. The price may seem a bit steep but again, as others mentioned, it is comparable to other options in the category, of which you AREN'T getting a new vehicle. I'm sure that it COULD be sold for cheaper but Jeep isn't offering it that way. For AEV to be able to come in and offer us these chasis and powerplants for that cost is pretty amazing IMO. I give them alot of credit for being braver then Jeep, Toyota, Nissan, Land Rover, and anybody else for offering what we've been asking for all along in the US market. Thanks AEV!

 

[BIGdaddy]

I am a huge fan of this vehicle. I think it has great potential as a starting point. Mechanically what do you really need for ovlerand travel? The frame, the suspension components, are all designed to take more punishment then most overlanders will give it stock. It doesn't have lockers? For real overlanding trips, how often do you really need lockers? Maybe a rear sometimes but so what, throw in an ARB setup and have the benefit of onboard air too.

Many members of this board post about how they wish there was a bare bones, all utility offroader with a diesel powerplant available in the US. Well here it is, in a couple of different body styles nonetheless. I'd take this over importing a used, early '80s 70 series Troopy if I was going to embark in a long overland trip. The Troopies are great, but they are used, this is brand spanking new. The price may seem a bit steep but again, as others mentioned, it is comparable to other options in the category, of which you AREN'T getting a new vehicle. I'm sure that it COULD be sold for cheaper but Jeep isn't offering it that way. For AEV to be able to come in and offer us these chasis and powerplants for that cost is pretty amazing IMO. I give them alot of credit for being braver then Jeep, Toyota, Nissan, Land Rover, and anybody else for offering what we've been asking for all along in the US market. Thanks AEV!

yup, this is what I think, too.

109"
D110
G-wagon
J-8

I'd choose the J8 in a heartbeat.

 

[upcruiser]

A couple of points for clarification I'd like to make in this thread. I've seen a couple of statements regarding some details of the J8 that aren't quite true perpetuated a bit on the net. The truck isn't sold to AEV as a "rolling chasis". They actually purchase all the pieces of the chasis and hand assemble the entire vehicle. Secondly, the diesel engine is not the CRD diesel, it is a completely different engine built in Italy as a military spec motor which from what I understand is engineered to quite higher tollerances and designed for much more abusive field duty. I had the pleasure of spending a couple of days with Dave's business partner and co owner last weekend and got the 1st hand low down on the J8's.

 

[Backwoods Rambler]

A couple of points for clarification ......The truck isn't sold to AEV as a "rolling chasis". They actually purchase all the pieces of the chasis and hand assemble the entire vehicle. ..........I had the pleasure of spending a couple of days with Dave's business partner and co owner last weekend and got the 1st hand low down on the J8's.

WOW, that's pretty impressive. What an undertaking! :Wow1:

 

[upcruiser]

WOW, that's pretty impressive. What an undertaking! :Wow1:

Yeah, that's what I thought too. Supposedly the quality of the build is better due to the hand built nature and attention to detail. And the construction I was referring to is specific to the chasis more or less as the engine is obviously a drop in unit that is sourced. They construct the vehicles in AEV's Detroit manufacturing facility.

 

[haven]

Thanks, Kristian, for the clarification.

I'd like to hear any additional information anyone has about how the J8's diesel engine differs from the VM Motori four cylinder turbodiesel that's installed by Magna Steyr in Wranglers for sale in Europe.

 

[upcruiser]

Clipped off of AEV's site... "A VM 2.8-liter diesel engine rated at 174 hp and 339 lb.-ft.of torque" which sounds like the CRD unit to me.

 

[Root Moose]

I must admit that I am warming up to the J8 a lot more.

 

[SeaRubi]

The price seems pretty competitive for what you're getting: a heavy duty, hand-built truck to your specifications. I stock Rubicon is sticker'ing for north of 30k.

I suppose the question you have to ask yourself is this: does all that extra beef have a use? If I were needing a vehicle to transport heavy equipment day in and day out, or to have more of a utility type bed for lots of tools to use as some kind of service truck, yes - that would make sense. But as a platform for general wandering? It might be a bit much - a bone-stock JK Unlimited is still a fine vehicle withy plenty of frame to work with. I personally would hate to give up the highway and trail friendly rear coils, or the efficient, trusty little V6.

As for durability - are there common and known deficiencies with the JK platform when abused properly over harsh terrain for months and months?

As far as the comment about the body panels shaking with the door being shut - I have a 2008 and mine exhibits no such behavior. Admittedly, it does seem like the body panels are pretty thin, but that's just fine with me: I'll take the lighter weight panels over an ability to fend off bullets :coffeedrink:

The J8 does seem like an impressive vehicle - just way more than I'd ever need.

 

[alosix]

Clipped off of AEV's site... "A VM 2.8-liter diesel engine rated at 174 hp and 339 lb.-ft.of torque" which sounds like the CRD unit to me.

Well, they both are 'CRD' engines (Common Rail Diesel). The new JKs and J8s got the newer version of the VM Motori engine.

Now, I was under the impression from talking to Jim and Dave via email that the engine/trans were the same ones that go into the euro spec JKs. Chosen more for parts availability than anything. Same reason they don't offer the man trans with it.

Jason

 

[Metcalf]

From what I understand you can get the 6-speed manual behind the CRD in JK's overseas. I think the automatic transmission decision was based more on the availability of the J9 wiring harness. Looking at all the differences between the J8 and JK as far as wiring I think offering another wiring harness just for the 6-speed on the J8 platform wouldn't be remotely cost effective.

I think the durability of the J8 will come into play since this vehicle is going to be more of a 'lifetime' purchase. I don't see people trading these in every few years for a new one. The durability will come into play after the first 10 years of service of so. I don't think the JK has been around long enough to determine what the weaknesses are going to be. Even with the TJ, you are just starting to hear about people wearing them out after years of hard 'wheeling. I heard that Jim Frens over at AEV/Nth wore out a few TJ frames and axles testing his suspension systems. Time will tell. My old 1942 Willys jeep has been going for about 67 years now. Still the original frame and body, but it has been rebuilt at least two times over the years. Its in need of another rebuild soon......

I think the J8 has a lot of potential for sure. It will be interesting to see the reviews and the modifications once they make it into peoples hands.

Has anyone heard anything on delivery date for the first batch?

If I buy one does anyone want to help install the motor/Trans in a Walmart parking lot I think that would make an great story for a magazine!!

 

[haven]

Automobile Magazine had some time behind the wheel of a J8
with diesel engine. The trip was in the eastern Sierra Nevada
mountains. AEV founder, Dave Harriton came along.

There's a gallery of photos showing the J8 visiting the Bodie
State Park ghost town, too.

http://www.automobilemag.com/features/great_drives/0912_jeep_aev_j8_milspec/index.html

 

[Metcalf]

I thought I would move this to the top...

Has anyone heard when the first ones are going to come out of AEV for the public. This vehicle is still high on my wish list. A long wheel base 3-door Diesel J8 could fill a very big void of my life. This model IMOO comes as close as possible in the USA to what Tom Shepard has in his simple functional G-wagen. I really wish that the J8 had this or that....but i'm just being nit-picky because of the price.