Thoughts: best Toyota pick up

[Dalko43]

I don't think frame rot is really an issue for the newer Toyota pickup's, at least no more than it is for other trucks.

Your truck, regardless of brand, will eventually rot out if it lives in the northern climates...that's the just the nature of the environment and has little to do with any shortcomings of the truck itself.

 

[bkg]

I don't think frame rot is really an issue for the newer Toyota pickup's, at least no more than it is for other trucks.

Your truck, regardless of brand, will eventually rot out if it lives in the northern climates...that's the just the nature of the environment and has little to do with any shortcomings of the truck itself.

I don't think that's accurate. No other brand has had as severe frame rust issues as Toyota.

 

[bkg]

If I had to say my favorite is the 89-95 XtraCab.

I tend to agree. I had a 93 for a while - 4" lift, 33's, 3vz, 5-speed. Sold it to a very good friend who was also very happy with it.

I do wish I had kept my ex's 94 4Runner. 4" Superlift w/ RockStomper spacers, 4.88's, 33's and DOA head work. Fun thing to drive. I'd very much like to build another 94-95 at some point...

 

[DaveInDenver]

I don't think frame rot is really an issue for the newer Toyota pickup's, at least no more than it is for other trucks.

Your truck, regardless of brand, will eventually rot out if it lives in the northern climates...that's the just the nature of the environment and has little to do with any shortcomings of the truck itself.

The original issue was 1995 to 2000 trucks rotting, those got buy-backs. The 2001-2004 trucks eventually got new frames.

That then extended to 2nd gen 2005-2010 Tacomas and some Tundras and Sequoias under a lawsuit settlement. Those of us with those trucks got a 12 year extended frame warranty (mine in fact just expired in May 2020 on a 2008 Tacoma). I'm very active about rust repair and anti-corrosion and live in the desert (3" if rain so far in 2020!) so it's not as bad as Ohio or New York of course.

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www.toyotaframesettlement.com

That then ended up covering 2011-2015 trucks.

https://static.nhtsa.gov/odi/tsbs/2019/MC-10169416-9999.pdf

And now 2016-2017, too.

Frame Corrosion and Toyota Limited Service Campaign

Hey gang, I got the following notice in the mail yesterday and I'm not sure what it means, can anyone help? (Sorry for the sideways photos, I couldn't...

www.tacomaworld.com

Frame recall - 3rd gen

I just got a letter ftom Toyora about the Tacoma through 2017 being granted a 12 year replacement on frames. Anyone else?

www.tacomaworld.com

Frame TSB

Toyota came out with a new frame coating and the TSB goes up to 2017. The new coating is not wet and dries to a hard texture. (Forgot the name of...

www.tacomaworld.com

So so far 1995 to 2017, 22 years of Tacomas have had a continuing frame rot. Now of course nothing lasts forever and they are standing behind better than Ford or GM who probably don't have any better record. But around here at least you still see 1979-1995 trucks but not many 1995-2000 Tacomas. A few 2001-2004 and still plenty of 2005+.

 

[Smileyshaun]

I thought every vehicle from the east coast rots away eventually ?

 

[DaveInDenver]

I thought every vehicle from the east coast rots away eventually ?

It's too broad of a subject so I'll only speak to one aspect, the class action lawsuit Toyota settled on regarding 2005-2010 Tacoma, 2007-2008 Tundra and 2005-2008 Sequoia, since it covered my truck.

The wording from the final order says specifically

http://staging.toyotaframesettlement.com/DocumentHandler.ashx?DocPath=/Documents/Warner_Second_Amended_Complaint_Filed_11_8_16.pdf

"The frames for certain model year Toyota vehicles are prone to excessive, premature rust corrosion because the frames were not properly prepared and treated against rust corrosion when they were manufactured. Excessively corroded frames pose a serious safety hazard to a vehicle’s occupants because a vehicle’s frame forms the basis of a vehicle’s crashworthiness, including its ability to withstand or minimize damage to the occupant compartment in the event of an accident."

So they decided it was better to take a $3.375 billion settlement than have the question of what is "adequate" and "premature" be legally determined. Of course nothing lasts forever but there is an expectation that it should last some reasonable length of time. People were still paying on original loans for a truck deemed unroadworthy by their states' inspections, 4 years old in some cases.

This was on second gen trucks that they had already twice said "Trust us, we solved the frame corrosion issue" after 10 years of production. Perhaps it just looked bad and was a P.R. move just to keep it from looking worse. But that's an awful lot of money so they must have sensed it could be a big problem to let go to trial.

It is of course a subjective question and having a court decide to define it would be bad all around. But Toyota created this problem by making excellent cars 20 and 30 years ago that are now just average. They created an expectation that a Toyota truck should last 10, 20, 30 years maybe and when they don't it's a problem.

 

[Dalko43]

How many 3rd Gen Tacoma's does this TSB apply to?

The wording on the NHSTA website suggests its specific VIN #'s, not entire production years.

Regardless, Toyota trucks, in general, don't have a rust problem. The current generation of 4runners, Tundra's, GX 460's and LC's handle the northern climates just as well as any other domestic vehicle....or, to put it another way, the domestic counterparts don't have some super secret magic sauce which makes them any more resistant to rust. I see rusted out Jeeps and F-150's (many of them no more than 5-6 years old) all over the place...never hear a peep from those OEM's on "correcting" that problem.

 

[bkg]

Regardless, Toyota trucks, in general, don't have a rust problem.

I spit out my drink on this one. Thanks for the laugh.

You're patently wrong, but I appreciate the humor this afternoon.

 

[Todd780]

How many 3rd Gen Tacoma's does this TSB apply to?

The wording on the NHSTA website suggests its specific VIN #'s, not entire production years.

Regardless, Toyota trucks, in general, don't have a rust problem. The current generation of 4runners, Tundra's, GX 460's and LC's handle the northern climates just as well as any other domestic vehicle....or, to put it another way, the domestic counterparts don't have some super secret magic sauce which makes them any more resistant to rust. I see rusted out Jeeps and F-150's (many of them no more than 5-6 years old) all over the place...never hear a peep from those OEM's on "correcting" that problem.

I spit out my drink on this one. Thanks for the laugh.

You're patently wrong, but I appreciate the humor this afternoon.

I do like Toyota trucks. I really do. As does my dad. When he was looking for one quite a few years back, his only criteria was and I quote 'No rust holes bigger than my fist'.

He did end up finding one. But, he gave up on the no rust holes criteria and ended up swapping on a less rusty bed. Then painted the whole thing John Deere green. Man that thing was ugly.

 

[DaveInDenver]

I spit out my drink on this one. Thanks for the laugh.

You're patently wrong, but I appreciate the humor this afternoon.

Wonder how a fanboy would explain away the *other* major 2nd gen rust issue? This one was a bit more serious in that it caused fuel tank ruptures. I got a new set of rear leaf springs sitting in the garage although I never qualified for a new frame.

https://www.caranddriver.com/news/a...t-could-snap-damage-fuel-tank-and-brake-line/

"The Toyota Tacoma is being recalled for rust problems yet again, this time with leaf springs on the rear axle that can corrode, snap off, and move enough to puncture the fuel tank or sever the rear brake line."

But, but, but they aren't any worse than anyone else! Yup, exactly. Which is why when the day comes to replace my Tacoma I also won't pay the Toyota Tax premium.

 

[Todd780]

Which is why when the day comes to replace my Tacoma I also won't pay the Toyota Tax premium.

Did you figure out what you'll replace it with yet?

If you're still undecided, I think you should start a Tacoma vs. XYZ Truck poll. That'll be amusing.

 

[DaveInDenver]

Did you figure out what you'll replace it with yet?

If you're still undecided, I think you should start a Tacoma vs. XYZ Truck poll. That'll be amusing.

No idea. I can't really move to a full size due to WilderNest sizing. If I had the money, time and space I'd love to grab a decent 89-94 XtraCab to sit on and restore.

If my Taco was wrecked and forced the issue I honestly don't know. Since my truck is 12 years old and not worth much the pay out would sort of indicate another Tacoma of similar vintage. I like the size of the Ranger but I don't have the money for anything that new and at this point I have experience, service manuals and SSTs to deal with 1979-2015 Toyotas so practically it would have to be about finding a realistically priced one.

The main problem with 2005+ is finding stick shifts that aren't clapped out and rusty. So if I take the manual off the table then I don't see that strong of a draw to stay with a newer Tacoma.

 

[bkg]

No idea. I can't really move to a full size due to WilderNest sizing. If I had the money, time and space I'd love to grab a decent 89-94 XtraCab to sit on and restore.

If my Taco was wrecked and forced the issue I honestly don't know. Since my truck is 12 years old and not worth much the pay out would sort of indicate another Tacoma of similar vintage. I like the size of the Ranger but I don't have the money for anything that new and at this point I have experience, service manuals and SSTs to deal with 1979-2015 Toyotas so practically it would have to be about finding a realistically priced one.

The main problem with 2005+ is finding stick shifts that aren't clapped out and rusty. So if I take the manual off the table then I don't see that strong of a draw to stay with a newer Tacoma.

and that 6-speed doesn't have a pilot bearing... weird design

 

[DaveInDenver]

and that 6-speed doesn't have a pilot bearing... weird design

It is novel. That's not really an issue, though, at least as near as I can tell. The issue I have with the RA60F is the alloy extension that the release bearing slides on. Mine was worn and grooved enough to need a sleeve at 90K miles. I used one of those PDM clearanced bearings with their snoot sleeve. The RC62F in the 2016+ has a steel extension so it should be an improvement.

 

[Dalko43]

I spit out my drink on this one. Thanks for the laugh.

You're patently wrong, but I appreciate the humor this afternoon.

Actually I'm not wrong. The Tundra, Tacoma and Sequoia of certain model years had rust problems.

Toyota trucks in general do not have rust problems. Plenty of high mileage Tundra's, 4runners, 460's and even Tacoma's running around in the northeast.

What's laughable is that people seem to associate Toyota's with rust, and yet there are no lack of 5-year old F-150's and Silverado's with rusty, crusted over chassis and bodies running around on the streets.