Tires: C,D, or E YES but do I really need AT?

[bajajoaquin]

You don't specify the tire, just the size.

I re-read your first post, and saw that you have 4wd after all. That would make me

Another post of yours expresses confusion about P and LT tires and load ranges. I agree, it's confusing. When I was looking for tires, I was conscious of the weight rating, and asked about the difference between an over-size D range with the load capacity I needed and a stock-size E range with the same weight rating. I was told that the E would be stiffer and handle the load with greater stability. If you suspect you are regularly going a little over weight, you're probably going over more than you suspect. You really should go with a range up. On your truck D is probably fine (mine is 7,000 pounds empty, before the Callen goes on, so I stuck with E).

The driving conditions you describe don't tell me that you really need to worry too much about the AT tread. I'm no expert on Colorado terrain, but if you're not seeking out slippy areas, you can probably get by in a rainstorm and the surface mud that accumulates. We took my old F150 to Baja with highway rib tires one time and drove down Mex1 in a rainstorm, and at the turnoff were presented with soft, muddy Mexican tracks. I was careful, kept my momentum, and had no problems. Your conditions may vary. For what it's worth, the tires I had were Maxxis commercials, not even the "commercial traction" variant.

 

[Stereo]

C, D, or E? 245 vs 215?

I'm down to the following three tire choices. All close in weight to my existing 265/75/16's. All skinnier (and shorter) which is what I'm looking for. All with AT or more aggressive treads as recommended by you all for hairy situations. BUT they're all different sidewall ratings. I'd prefer the D as a compromise between sturdier sidewalls and a smoother ride but I'd prefer a 245 over a 215. Thoughts? (especially as to the sidewall strength of the Duratrac C's).

Firestone Destination AT 245/75/16 E 41lbs (top-rated on/off road tire and comes with a 30-day guarantee at Firestone dealers)

Yokohama Geolander AT/S 215/85/16 D 38lbs (least expensive and one of the few AT's with a tread warranty though those are hard to get honored)

Goodyear Wrangler Duratrac 245/75/16 C 40 lbs (commercial on/off road tread;but is the sidewall of the C strong enough?)

BFG All Terrains are too heavy and expensive. The BFG Rugged Terrain LT's (not Rugged Trails) look intriguing as a well-rated highway tire with a more aggressive tread but they're a bit heavier (43 lbs) and are said to pick up and hold pebbles "like a vacuum."

I'd appreciate any feedback on my choices, especially between grades but also 245 vs. 215. Thanks!

 

[Jr_Explorer]

I'm down to the following three tire choices. All close in weight to my existing 265/75/16's. All skinnier (and shorter) which is what I'm looking for. All with AT or more aggressive treads as recommended by you all for hairy situations. BUT they're all different sidewall ratings. I'd prefer the D as a compromise between sturdier sidewalls and a smoother ride but I'd prefer a 245 over a 215. Thoughts? (especially as to the sidewall strength of the Duratrac C's).

Firestone Destination AT 245/75/15 E 41lbs (top-rated on/off road tire and comes with a 30-day guarantee at Firestone dealers)

Yokohama Geolander AT/S 215/85/16 D 38lbs (least expensive and one of the few AT's with a tread warranty though those are hard to get honored)

Goodyear Wrangler Duratrac 245/75/15 C 40 lbs (commercial on/off road tread; but is the sidewall of the C strong enough?)

BFG All Terrains are too heavy and expensive. The BFG Rugged Terrain LT's (not Rugged Trails) look intriguing as a well-rated highway tire with a more aggressive tread but they're a bit heavier (43 lbs) and are said to pick up and hold pebbles "like a vacuum."

I'd appreciate any feedback on my choices, especially between grades but also 245 vs. 215. Thanks!

Yeah... DO you have 15" or 16" wheels? I personally wouldn't go from 265's to 215's That is a very big reduction in pavement grip that I wouldn't accept. But your #1 and #3 sizes are for 15" wheels unless you made a typo mistake.

 

[surlydiesel]

I had great luck with one set of General Grabber AT2's and I currently run a set of Grabber HTS on my Jeep GC. Both varieties come E rated in common sizes for trucks and SUV's. Had good luck with them and good wear life. I have E rated BFG's on the Yota right now and they don't notice a heavy load of wood or a heavy trailer only set at 30psi on my little truck. Get an E rated tire and you'll feel much more stable side to side and have more sidewall protection. You don't need mud terrains(nor do I) but it's nice to be prepared with a "good" set of tires.

Cheers,
jorge

 

[Stereo]

Typos yes. I do have 16" wheels

My apologies. I rushed the post after it disappeared when I got timed out again and had to retype it just before heading out for an appointment so I failed to proof read it. I wish this website allowed more time before automatically timing out and/or that it would give a warning that allows you to choose to continue on the site. However, I just saw the "new" feature that allows me to reclaim the auto-saved stuff.

 

[summerprophet]

Stereo,
If you DO have 4WD, than you have more choices available to you. You CAN get away with an All Season tire rather than an All Terrain tire. You kind of need to Juggle your usage against your comforts.

As an example, I have a 2WD Toyota Tundra with highway tires. I have dedicated Winter ice tires for it.
I also have a 4WD 4runner with Mud Terrains.

I am regularly ASTONISHED at what I can do in 2wd with Mud Terrains. Climbing loose and rocky hillsides, rock crawling, you name it..... however, the smallest patch of ice on a hillside, and the mud terrains fan be in 4WD both diffs locked and I will slowly spin my way up the hill. My ice tires never lose traction to begin with..... 1 wheel drive, not even limited slip. I guess the point I am trying to make is tires really can change the performance of your rig.

All terrains would be mandatory if you are up in the hills with a camper in 2WD. But if you DO have 4WD, you can get away with a tire more comfortable on the highway. It is really up to your preference. If it is 90% highway I would go highway tire.... but if it was only 70% highway, I would be torn as to what way to go.

 

[Jr_Explorer]

O.K. The Firestone Destination is available in LT245/75R16 "E" rated tire. The Firestone has probably the LEAST aggressive tread (therefore quietest).

The Yokohama Geolander AT/S is available in the same LT245/75R16. But is ALSO available in the rare LT235/85R16 (both load "E" tires). IF the 235 fits you get more ground clearance and the higher ground pressure of the slightly narrow tire. Aired down those tire will make a nice, long footprint that will "wheel" great.

The Goodyear Duratrac comes in both of those sizes (245/75 and 235/85), both load "E". The Duratrac's seem to be getting good reviews and they are the most agressive of the A/T tread patterns (often described as almost between an all terrain and a mud terrain).

Finally the BFG A/T's also come in those sizes. They really are a true A/T tread (more agressive than the Firestone and Yokohama tires you are considering) but not quite as agressive as the Duratrac's. And they just work. Wear well. Are tough with tough sidewalls. Pricy but like I said in a previous post... Seach tire discusion threads and there is always a majority of people who run the BFG A/T's.

For what you plan to do I think ANY of those four will work. On pavement width = grip. Off-road (like fire roads) any of these will probably work fine.

 

[redthies]

Duratracs are not lasting well in my area (really rocky) due to weaker sidewalls. A load range C will be more prone to failure in the rocky conditions in Co. Either of your other choices are fine, but I would go with either the stock 265 or 245 size. As said above, the BFG AT is pretty much the best bang for your buck. We got over 70,000 miles on the set we put on our '01 Tacoma doublecab 4x4. It saw a ton of off highway too.

 

[ExpoMike]

Keep in mind that the C, D and E load rating, you shouldn't just look at max capacity. The higer the letter, the stiffer the sidewall will end up. With a camper on and loaded up, the stiffer sidewall will prevent excess sway which makes driving much easier. My E rated BFG AT's look almost the same at 30psi as they do at 65psi. This is on an almost 9000 lbs rig. Traveling on paved mountain roads, I frequently catch other cars as I am able to drive quicker since I don't get that typical camper sway. Not saying you need E rated but I don't think I would look at anything below a D rating.

 

[Stereo]

235/85/16's are +3.7% different than stock 265/70/16's. A problem?

I had previously decided against the 235/85's because they're outside of the 3% diameter difference that I've read is recommended to stay within; the 235/85's are +3.7%. They're also even taller than my current 265/75/16's. I'd rather go a little shorter if anything. There are a ton more choices in that size though.

Duratracs are not lasting well in my area (really rocky) due to weaker sidewalls. A load range C will be more prone to failure in the rocky conditions in Co.

You've confirmed my concerns about the Duratracs so they're off the list.

I think I'll also scratch off the 215's since I do a fair amount of highway driving to get to the trails (though it's hard to fathom that a difference of 1.2 inches in tread width between the 215 and 245 could make that much difference but what do I know...not much. )

I'll reconsider the BFG All Terrain (and maybe the Rugged Terrain too) since I do believe in considering the overall cost rather than just the front-end cost but I'm leery of the greater weight. I'm trying to reduce overall weight.

...you shouldn't just look at max capacity. The higher the letter, the stiffer the sidewall will end up. With a camper on and loaded up, the stiffer sidewall will prevent excess sway which makes driving much easier. Not saying you need E rated but I don't think I would look at anything below a D rating.

Nice summary of the benefits, ExpoMike. Yes, I do feel the E's are overkill for my Toyota but again, the choices are few in the D-range and as others have said, airing down can help reduce the stiffness of the ride (but I still wonder if that underinflation effects tire wear; maybe not since they're so stiff). The Destinations do come in a D in my stock size 265 70 16 but I was hoping to go skinnier. I'm wondering were all the C's and D's went. I did some searching two years ago when I first thought I needed new tires and there were LOTS of choices.

Thanks for your input.

 

[tanglefoot]

I'm probably one of those who threw off the consensus on your earlier post. I've never used higher than C-range, LT tires with the pop-up camper on the Toyota (I have 15" wheels), and they've fully been up to the task. I use 45 psi in the back and 35 in the front.

I do like an AT-pattern for Colorado. While you don't need much tread in most cases (we don't have much of that slimy mud like Louisiana and Alabama), I seem to keep running into unexpected snows overnight (hmm, I heard some rain on the roof earlier and now it's just really, really quiet ). That's when it helps to have some extra teeth to crawl out of there in the morning. Highway tires are very scary on snowy trails.

I don't think you'd have trouble with the C-range on the Duratrec, but it's practically a mud tire--quite aggressive and noisy. It'd surely put a dent in your highway fuel economy.

The Geolandar AT/S and Destination A/T are both well-mannered, highly-rated all-terrain tires. It'd be tough to go wrong with either of those.

I'm personally a fan of skinny tires--I'd be inclined to try the 215s but 245/75 is a nice, balanced size. That's really a personal preference, though.

Using E-range tires on a light truck isn't much of a concern either. Most people with them don't object to the slightly stiffer ride and most observe slightly better handling. You don't need to lower tire pressure with the E. You can keep an eye on the tread wear and adjust pressure accordingly. Worn tread center=pressure too high. Worn shoulders=pressure too low.

I've used a few sets of BFGoodrich A/Ts (used though--too pricey for me new) and they're a tough, grippy tire, no question. They're not the quietest or fastest-rolling though--not the best for fuel economy. I'm on a milder tread now (Nankang FT-7...milder AT, LT tire...also used) and really like how quiet and smooth they are compared with the BFG AT's. I've even had them on for one of those unexpected overnight snows--they did admirably getting me out of there in the morning.

G'luck!

 

[Stereo]

I like this explanation too: "Tacomas can't carry enough weight to justify an LT tire on load alone. However, an LT tire, with its thicker casing and increased number of sidewall plies is more durable off road, and less likely to suffer cuts and punctures. The downside is the (considerably) increased weight and rolling resistance makes for a less comfortable ride and increased gas mileage." http://www.tacomaworld.com/forum/wheels-tires/140607-load-range-c-d-e-p-metric.html

 

[Jr_Explorer]

My truck was a work truck (WT trim level) and actually came with undersized tires compared to the LS and LT Silverado's. So I had 245/75R16's (30.47" dia). The other trim levels came stock with 265/70R17's which are 3.73% larger (31.61" dia). I jumped all the way to 285/70R17's (32.71" dia or 7.35% jump). The acceleration is noticeably slower (but with the diesel still plenty fast) but where I noticed a HUGE difference was stopping power. I estimate (purely subjective) that I have to press the brake pedal fully 25% harder for the same amount of deceleration! I am going to change to Hawk LTS brakes to try to get the stopping power back. So are first gen Tacoma's known for tones of reserve power? Maybe sticking to the same diameter would be the hot ticket for you.

The only two times skinnier is better than wider is in rain on the highway (a little less tendency to hydroplane) and in snowy conditions (again, higher ground pressure helps you cut through to the pavement or trail underneath). But dry traction goes down and wear goes up (think of it the same as if you could put smaller brake pads on your car). In my humble opinion rubber is good!

Like I said... I just went through this exercise and I changed my mind seven times a day for three months! LOL! :Wow1:

 

[Stereo]

Using E-range tires on a light truck isn't much of a concern either. Most people with them don't object to the slightly stiffer ride and most observe slightly better handling.

Tanglefoot, it's great to hear from you again. You've always given solid advice backed up by the rationale for your opinion. Your posts always leave me better educated.

I think I'm going to go with the Destination 245/75 E-rated mainly because Firestone has a 30-day warranty on them. That way, if I don't like the ride on an E-rated tire, I can take them back and get a refund or move down to the 265/70's in D, though I'd lose the skinnier tire. (The C-option seems to have disappeared across the board in 16" tires.) If I chose 215/85's from another company and didn't like them, I'd be stuck with them (unless someone knows of another good tire that has a similar trial period).

JR_Explorer, your experience with loss of power is what I feared if I went to the taller 235/85 along with the speedo issues. But like you, I could change my mind in the next hour. If nothing else, I am learning a lot about what issues to consider when looking for a tire.