Traded my Land Cruiser for a 2008 4Runner

[Brian894x4]

OK, OK....only for a few days.

I have a sweet deal through my work. We rent cars on a regular basis since we travel between facilities a lot and as an employee I can rent them as personal vehicles fairly cheap. The moment I saw that they had a few brand new 4Runners, I had to try one for the weekend, just out of curiosity.

So far, I only have a few miles on it. I took it out for lunch. It's a 2008 SR5 4WD with the V-6, cloth interior. I'll list the other stuff later on and post some pics when its daylight.

First impressions are that it's slightly smaller than I expected. Especially the interior. Not that I need a big interior. Maybe it's just coming from the Land Cruiser it seems small.

The engine is AWESOME! I can only imagine what the V-8 must feel like powerwise, because the 4.0 V-6 is a incredible piece of machery and makes a lot more power than I'm used too. It seems to really kick in at about 4 grand, almost turbo-like.

Of course, it handles great. I don't like the running boards one bit.

Brakes seem a bit touchy, which is ironic, because my Land Cruiser is exactly the opposite, not touchy enough. But the 4Runner brakes seem to have a lot more stopping power too. Looks like they have the same hydraulic type assist that the LC100 has.

Dash controls seem a bit cheezy and cheap, but the rest of the interior is decent enough. I'm not sure I really like the dash layout all that much. I don't really like the dial knob for 4wD. This 4Runner has 2WD with ADD, and 4H with locking diff and 4L. I like the option to cut off the all wheel drive, because it seems to be quicker in 2WD.

I'm a little confused on the "Auto LSD" and the traction control features.

I'll post some pictures and some tid bits as I drive it this weekend. I plan to take photos all over the thing. Does anyone have any special requests of something they want photographed?

I'll be driving it out in the woods on Friday and maybe a trip to the beach or mountains on Saturday. Then it goes back to the rental company and I go back to my Land Cruiser. To be honest, I wouldn't trade my FJZ80 for this thing...but so far, I can really see why a lot people use it an expedition platform. For a modern vehicle, it's pretty nice.

Until now, I really didn't have much interest in the FJCruiser, but knowing it's generally based on this platform and with the same drivetrain, I'm more curious now. Seems like it would be a bit small though. I do like the 4Runner for its having more room and the more conventional body and layout.

More later......

 

[FourByLand]

I thought you were serious!

WHEW!

:bigbossHL:

 

[Brian894x4]

Nah...but I'll tell ya what, this would make a really nice daily driver.

I've crawled all over it now, getting ready for a trip to the woods in the morning.

A couple things stand out. This thing desperately needs a lift. I'm sure 33s and at least 2-3 inches would go a LONG way, but I'm not even sure that's enough. The fuel tank hangs belong the frame and front skid plate has an nice air scoop...read, tail hook...on the lower front of it. Toyota did do a decent job of trying to make the underside as flat as possible with what it had to work with.

The dang running board would just have to go. I'm not used to using one and i keep banging my foot against it trying to get in and out.

It's a little hard to see out of compared to my Land Cruiser. I think partly because of the steeper windshield slope and shorter appearing windows. Man, the FJ Cruiser must really have limited visibility.

The engine compartment is nicely layed out and extremely tidy and clean. There's actually room to work in there and there's a nice space for a second battery (although it may have to be a short battery).

I noticed a couple of breathers in the engine compartment. I assume one is for the front diff, the other, maybe the tranny? That's an interesting off road touch.

The brakes still feel touchy. I'm not sure if it's me or what, but they seem a bit hard to modulate at very low speeds.

The fog light switch on the light switch stalk is a smart touch. It's a very minor detail, but I like it there rather than on the dash as a toggle switch like other vehicles.

The shifter seems offset a little too far to the passenger side for some reason and I'm not a fan of the foot parking brake one single bit. Hand brake all the way for me.

The headlights are absolute bright as heck. I was shocked. I don't know if it's just the projector lens or what, but they are bright and very nice. I'll be interested to see how they do out in the woods at night.

The 5 speed tranny is sweet. You can really feel it downshifting when you let the engine management system do the engine braking for you.

And of course, love that V-6 engine, but when I win the lottery, I'd have to have the V-8.

More later.....

 

[p1michaud]

Land Cruiser vs. 4Runner

I'm very interested in reading about your report.
Cheers,
P

 

[Redline]

Even though I own one I’m enjoying your opinions. All the things you mentioned need doing I have done and agree with: lift, skids, 33s, etc.

I have done all of these and it changed everything. It is still a bit low compared to other rigs I have owned, but the OME 2.5-3-inch lift makes the car a perfect everyday height. Not too tall to get in and out of.

The running boards do need to go (replaced with skids) & the brakes are excellent, they don’t seem to need an upgrade even with all my extra weight and 33-in tires. The cab is more comfortable than an 80 for me because of where my long legs rest: left on the door of course but the right along the center console, extended, instead of up high and bent and unsupported. This is a common ergonomic problem for tall me that the 4Runner doesn't have.

I'm glad you have an SR5, I have seen few SR5 4Runners, but maybe they are more popular in the V6 version? Does it even have the 16-in wheels?!

James

 

[DaveInDenver]

I'm glad you have an SR5, I have seen few SR5 4Runners, but maybe they are more popular in the V6 version? Does it even have the 16-in wheels?

All 4Runners have a 16" base and you can get a SR5 with one of 17" wheels options. You can't get the 18" wheels in an SR5, though.

 

[Grim Reaper]

It's a little hard to see out of compared to my Land Cruiser. I think partly because of the steeper windshield slope and shorter appearing windows. Man, the FJ Cruiser must really have limited visibility.

....

I wanted to love the FJ...I really did. Every bit of literature for it I was grabbing. I was seriously thinking about buying one new and while I have had 14 different vehicles in the last 20 years and only one was bought new because I'm a cheap *** I about convinced myself I had to buy one.

We had our annual Blood drive and the Local Toy dealer was invited to participate and bring up a could cars to show off. I crawled all over it. Sales person handed me the keys.

I sat in it closed the door and the smile went away. It was like sitting in a bucket compared to my 4Runner, Suburban and K5's. Didn't even start it just got out extremely disapointed handed the keys to the sales guy. He saw how fast my expression changed as asked me what was wrong. I told him "its a car not a off-road vehicle. Off road vehicles are designed for visibility. You cant see out of this thing. Its every bit as bad as my company van with the cargo divider.

 

[Bergger]

A couple things stand out. This thing desperately needs a lift. I'm sure 33s and at least 2-3 inches would go a LONG way, but I'm not even sure that's enough. The fuel tank hangs belong the frame and front skid plate has an nice air scoop...read, tail hook...on the lower front of it. Toyota did do a decent job of trying to make the underside as flat as possible with what it had to work with.
QUOTE]

A 2-3 inch lift will take this truck very far. My buddy has an 06 V8 sport edition and still has the OME tires and running boards with no lift. He has amazed me on multiple occasions when he has followed me with only very minimal scraping. I don't know if the V6 has the same traction control as the V8 but his truck is very impressive. He'll be putting a couple of inches of lift in it soon and then it'll probably be more capable than my 03 Tacoma. If I ever get rid of our 06 Xterra it'll be for one of these.

 

[Redline]

Yep. What I was trying to say what that I have seen few with sixteens like mine, though I prefer them. Have seen many SR5 & Sport models with 17s.

All 4Runners have a 16" base and you can get a SR5 with one of 17" wheels options. You can't get the 18" wheels in an SR5, though.

 

[Brian894x4]

This particular 4Runner had 17s. Here's some scangauge readings I took today comparing my FZJ80 with the 4Runner....

4Runner: (weight confirmed 4600lbs)

60 mph, 5th gear = 1800 rpm, 2.6 gallon per hour, 42 h.p., 23 mpg

60 mph, 4th gear = 2500 rpm, 3.0 gallon per hour, 50 h.p., 19 mpg

Idle, park = 720 rpm, 0.36 gph, 5.9 h.p.

Maximum h.p. readings after multiple passes = 279

------------------------------------------------------------------

FZJ80: (weight approximately 6300lbs)

60 mph, 4th gear = 2000 rpm, 3.8-4.3 gallon per hour, 70 h.p., 13 mpg

Idle, park = 650 rpm, 0.48 gph, 7.8 h.p.

Maximum h.p. readings after multiple passes = 255

------------------------------------------------------------------

I'm not sure what the scanguage uses to determine h.p.. Obviously, the readings are high, but they do seem to be at least consistent. There's an 11% difference in the maximum official h.p. ratings and there was a 10% difference in the readings I got on the scangauge. So it's at least good enough for comparision purposes.

The 4Runner weighed a lot less than I expect and that probably explains why it's so darn peppy. This thing just plain hauls but on the highway. That 4.0 engine and 5 speed auto combination is pure beauty on the road. There's enough power to throw you back in the seat and I can't believe the official rating is only 230something.

Off road, it disappointed. It handled the fire roads with ease, but had trouble just driving over even small branches and I had trouble over even the most minor obsticles. To make matters worse, I major problems getting 4L to work. At one point, I had the gears grinding like crazy, like it was half engaged and half not. I hate that stupid electronic 4WD dial. I'm sure a lift and taller tires would transform it, as others have done and said. I'm not saying this can't be a great off road platform. Many have proven that it is with some mods, but with the stock set up, its pretty worthless on anything other than graded roads. Again, the problem seems to be mostly ground clearance and the front skidplate, which is way too low.

One thing about the brakes is kind of interesting. When comparing my FZJ80 brakes with the 4Runner, I discovered that when the engine is off, instead of the pedal becoming hard when a vacuum booster runs out, the exact opposite happens. The pedal on the 4Runner goes to the floor. Once you turn the ignition on, but the engine off, the pedal rises and goes back to normal. So, I guess the brake system is actually electrically controlled. How interesting. I noticed no vacuum booster, but I wasn't exactly sure what Toyota used to power the brakes.

Gas mileage on the first tank, which was mostly highway and slow speed logging road driving, was 16.5 mpg

The second tank was mostly highway was 17.5

I left in 4H with the center diff unlocked most of the time. I didn't try 2H which probably would have netted better mileage. That would be an interesting experiment, especially to see if its really possible to improve mileage on the 80 series with a part time conversion.

 

[Life_in_4Lo]

brian,
the reason for the 'turbo' feeling at higher rpms is the VVTi and the valve timing changes. I really enjoyed the motor at 4K+, it felt so smooth and powerful.

the brakes are Electronic Brake Force Distribution. No LSPV, no hydro brake booster. A much better system EBFD. If you pop the hood and turn on the 4R to acc, you can hear the booster charge on. Sometimes you can hear it as you start to drive.

The dial control is not as good, however for the US market, it frees up a lot of space for the gigantic cupholders and storage. Compare to the GX470 w/ t case lever & not nearly as good in the storage department. FJC did a good job to mix the 2 needs. (all 3 are the same platform)
Also, sometimes the change takes a moment. Read the manual and you will see, it's not too bad at all once you get used to it. Lever is better but....


Orig. HP rating was around 245HP. With the revised EPA system, it is around 235HP.

 

[Redline]

Agreed, the low-range/4x4 dial on the dash sucks. This is my first ride with this ‘feature’ but probably won’t be my last as this is the future of 4x4 engagement for most vehicles.

I have yet to have problem putting my 4Runner into low-range (were you in neutral?) and have only heard a very slight grind. To avoid any grind I have turned off the engine with the trans in neutral, turned the dial for the shift, a solid clunk/shift occurs without any grind. Restart. I don’t do this every time but it sounds better than when things are running.

 

[Brian894x4]

Yep, I read the owner's manual to just be sure and it was in neutral. Sometimes the darn light would blink and a bell would chime, no matter what I did. Sometimes it would work just fine.

Apparently, if you engage 4L and the light is blinking and you start to move, you hear the most horrendous gear mashing sound ever. I waited several minutes before I started to move, so I can only assume it started to lock and somehow got stuck midway.

The brakes are awesome, but being electrical, and knowing that the pedal goes all the way to the floor after a few pumps once the ignition is off, I have to wonder what happens if you're driving along and the battery shorts out, or the main fuse blows or something as simple as a connector comes loose. Does that mean no brakes whatsoever, after a few emergency pumps? Not good.

To make matters worse, the foot ebrake is worthless as an emergency brake. One you start to press it, the only way to release it is to press full down. It's not modulable like a hand brake.

 

[DaveInDenver]

Apparently, if you engage 4L and the light is blinking and you start to move, you hear the most horrendous gear mashing sound ever. I waited several minutes before I started to move, so I can only assume it started to lock and somehow got stuck midway.

No fan of the electronic shift, definitely. But you can't shift a manual transfer while you are moving either without some complaint. Just 'cause it's got an actuator doesn't change the fact that the transfer gears are not cut to be shifted while moving. I wonder if the center diff locked transfer case in a 2WD case needs more attention getting into 4-low than a full time like in the Cruiser or V8 4Runner? I mean, normally the front end is not moving like a standard part time case, so it's possible that the gears and front engage clutch hang up worse than a full time 4WD where the front is always engaged. Just thinking out loud, I'd still like to have a lever fer sure. But I've had some horrible driveline wind-up that took a lot of muscle and monkeying around to get my truck out of low range, so I'd bet that actuator is a bully and can put a ton of force on the t-case. So it doesn't surprise me that it might make some brutal noises.

The brakes are awesome, but being electrical, and knowing that the pedal goes all the way to the floor after a few pumps once the ignition is off, I have to wonder what happens if you're driving along and the battery shorts out, or the main fuse blows or something as simple as a connector comes loose. Does that mean no brakes whatsoever, after a few emergency pumps?

The brakes are still hydraulic, the booster is electronic. No different than if you stall and loose vacuum assist in that sense. Well, a little different being 4 wheel disc rather than rear drum, drum brakes work reasonably without power where as disc brakes need to be assisted. I sort see this as a push, they work better normally and during a stall or other abnormal condition all power assist systems have their downsides.

 

[Brian894x4]

When I shifted into 4L I was always at a complete stop and in neutral, just like the manual said. I even had my foot on the brake. Still no avail most of the time. I only started moving after I waited for several minutes for the light to stop blinking, thinking maybe it really was in 4L. Personally, I think there is something wrong with that particular vehicle.

Correction on the foot e-brake. You can press it part way and release it, with a gentle quick press. But still not the best thing to have in an emergency.

As far as the electric boost on the brakes, I have to imagine the hydraulic brakes still work with no electric power, but the thing is, with the engine off, press the pedle several times to bleed off whatever reserve boost or braking force they have (which is probably the fail safe mode) and the pedal goes all the way to the floor as if there is no brake at all. I think the electric system is more than just a boost, because if it was, the pedal would be progressively firmer, just like they do with vacuum boost models when the engine is off. Also if the pedal is to the floor and you turn on the ignition, you can hear an electric motor and the pedal rises up off the floor. So the pedal itself appears to be electrically controlled somehow, which appears to mean that if you lose all battery power.....that could be really bad.

One thing about ground clearance. I compared this 2008 with a few earlier models, but same generation 4runners, and it looks to me like this 2008 is much lower to the ground. It's definately much lower than the previous generation. So, I'm thinking Toyota must have lowered it overall, probably to help prevent roll overs, kind of like what Jeep did with the Liberty.

I noticed in the owner's manual, there's a height control option on the upper scale models, using a compressor and airbags, I think. This one didn't have it.