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[ABBB]

Agreed, but my TJR got written off because the air bags and clock spring thingy cost too much, it was a 30kph, 20mph accident..... there was NO body damage.... the airbags added nothing, I've survived worse accidents without injury. We are not talking "handles like a boat" nor do 17 airbags add value. If an airbag was a $20 item, there would be value but we crush vehicles today for no valid reason other than the corporations profit from new sales. not maintenance. Even cell phones today are a write off once the battery dies. You cannot buy a new battery for anything Apple...... THAT is the issue. We are in a world where sales, growth, is based on new sales, not maintenance. And industry is working to kill the shops, mechanics since they extend vehicle life,.... killing new car sales. Not only are cars getting exponentially expensive.... the alternatives are disappearing..... engineered obsolescence IS what drives engineering in ALL industries today.

You are completely missing the point. It is not that we want another 1972 Chevy Vega...... we just want back Henry Fords desire to build it better.

View attachment 707024

You absolutely can replace batteries in all Apple devices. I have a MacBook that is 12 years old and is on its third battery. It’s so well built that I’ve used it daily for its whole life and haven’t had to replace anything but the battery. But I get your point, though Apple is the exception to the rule nowadays that things are more often built to operate for a short time, fail, and be thrown away. Apple’s planned obsolescence comes via their innovation rendering their own products outdated.

 

[billiebob]

You absolutely can replace batteries in all Apple devices. I have a MacBook that is 12 years old and is on its third battery. It’s so well built that I’ve used it daily for its whole life and haven’t had to replace anything but the battery. But I get your point, though Apple is the exception to the rule nowadays that things are more often built to operate for a short time, fail, and be thrown away. Apple’s planned obsolescence comes via their innovation rendering their own products outdated.

I cannot buy a battery for my 2010 nor my 2015 Mac Book Air for LESS than I can buy a new MacBook Air..... hence I own the 2015 version. But I cannot buy a new battery for my iphone 5C.... Period. And when the forward camera quit on my iphone 5C there was no repair, the selfie camera still worked but Apple would not even consider fixing the forward camera function.

There is no doubt, industry would rather sell than repair. And their marketing, vision, mission focuses on that goal. Sell. not Service.

Europe is introducing legislation to REQUIRE service and repair.... long overdue. Globalization has corrupted the world our parents knew.

 

[85_Ranger4x4]

Case in point: the big Right to Repair lawsuit against John Deere. It's not that farmers shy away from high tech, but that it's out of THEIR control. Your ability to rush harvest your grain is entirely dependent on dealer availability to calibrate a sensor with their proprietary computer.

Deere took an incredibly stupid stance where they don't sell farm equipment, they just sell the right to use THEIR farm equipment therefor they can decide who knows how to work on it or some BS like that.

For those that don't know ag doesn't have anything like OBDII (or even OBDI). If you want to diy something electronic fire up the parts cannon and see how good you are at guessing... once you plug it in its yours.

There is no doubt, industry would rather sell than repair. And their marketing, vision, mission focuses on that goal. Sell. not Service.

Not really.

I would say the service side is carrying most dealers right now. Sales can't hardly get anything to sell and since the masses can't find anything to buy they are forced to patch together whatever junk they have to keep going.

The dealer I work at, sales is pretty slow. Has been since I started in August. Service (I am the parts manager) is freaking hopping. Like crazy swamped.

But ok, you have the Ipad of your dreams with everything you want... you gotta know how to use it. And it isn't something you can just youtube your way thru the tutorial and know it forever, if you don't use it you will forget it. I have used Forscan to find weak coils three times in the last three years, I still gotta youtube my way to find mode 6. Automotive diag equipment doesn't just spit out "replace the O2 sensor", it isn't that easy.

The average schmo won't use the program enough to be proficient with it. Or with the vehicle itself which a lot of "you just have to keep up with technology" people underestimate. Especially the guys that have a new vehicle every three years. Unless you do it every day you might have a fancy phone to "keep up with technology" or whatever but you don't know your car as fraction as well as a tech that does it for a living.

If you want to poke around at it in your driveway for giggles that is one thing, expecting yourself to diag (and repair) this stuff in the sticks... ?

 

[plainjaneFJC]

I cannot buy a battery for my 2010 nor my 2015 Mac Book Air for LESS than I can buy a new MacBook Air..... hence I own the 2015 version. But I cannot buy a new battery for my iphone 5C.... Period. And when the forward camera quit on my iphone 5C there was no repair, the selfie camera still worked but Apple would not even consider fixing the forward camera function.
I had mistaken you for a globalist all along…?
There is no doubt, industry would rather sell than repair. And their marketing, vision, mission focuses on that goal. Sell. not Service.

Europe is introducing legislation to REQUIRE service and repair.... long overdue. Globalization has corrupted the world our parents knew.

 

[FAW3]

Nothing more reliable or field fixable than pre emissions vacuum controls.

View attachment 704449

View attachment 704450

Those were the days...looking past an engine and seeing the ground!

I would think that any "handy sort of person" should be able to glance at that photo and see the critical parts like the oil filter, air filter, thermostat housing, master brake cylinder, fuel pump, spark plugs, distributor.

 

[IdaSHO]

I cannot buy a battery for my 2010 nor my 2015 Mac Book Air for LESS than I can buy a new MacBook Air..... hence I own the 2015 version. But I cannot buy a new battery for my iphone 5C.... Period. And when the forward camera quit on my iphone 5C there was no repair, the selfie camera still worked but Apple would not even consider fixing the forward camera function.

As I said before, ignorance.
So please, just stop.

There is VERY little that cannot be repaired today.
You just have to do it yourself.


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[billiebob]

As I said before, ignorance.
So please, just stop.

There is VERY little that cannot be repaired today.
You just have to do it yourself.


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Power draining too quickly? Won't hold a charge like it used to? Use this guide to replace the battery in your iPhone 5c. If your battery is...

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How to replace your front camera

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Use this guide to replace the upper display assembly cable, including the front-facing camera, microphone, and other sensors.

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Well whatever, apple won't do it and I thought that was why dealerships existed, to keep their stuff running. not just sell new stuff
And fact is car dealerships seldom know how to fix anything electronic too. Just from the threads on this forum that is obvious.

Cool to know you like fixing stuff... me, I like to use stuff and I'm more than willing to pay the dealership to keep it maintained.
So quit with the back slapping, yes you are brilliant. The rest of us are just ignorant... thanks for sharing.

 

[IdaSHO]

well whatever, apple won't do it and I thought that was why dealerships existed, to keep their stuff running. not just sell new stuff

And this thread, which YOU started, revolves around "Field Fixes"

So is this thread about the ability of the dealer to come fix your truck for you?
Or for you to fix it on your own?

 

[UglyViking]

This was an interesting read, haha.

I think the first post and the follow up about repairing and paying a dealership, just pretty much sums it up. If it's carbureted and can be repaired that is good technology, if it's battery powered and can be repaired that is bad technology.

I agree that a lot of these "unicorns in sensors" are very annoying, but how often are they really seen? If you do road side repairs, you're seeing them every day. That said, before these sensor issues I bet you were just as busy with other repair problems. It's a bummer that anything breaks down, but let's not pretend that things are the same now with a different replacement part.

 

[85_Ranger4x4]

My issue is how everything is tied into everything.

Stuff broke before but other things generally didn't care.

A modern 4wd is a torn abs sensor wire away from being a 2wd. I see it all the time on farm/construction trucks. My 02 has had the abs light on since last June and the 4wd works great. Not ideal but i am not stuck in a cornfield after a cornstalk grabs a wire either.

My wires are fine, the fault is in the $150 wheel bearing assembly which is still quiet and tight so I am not in a huge hurry to replace it. Not crazy about unit wheel bearings either but at least it isn't a pressed in POS like a lot of them now.

I have seen cars bricked (towed in for no start) from water in a cracked headlight, bad power steering module etc.

My 02 would blow a headlight fuse at worst and doesn't even have a power steering module.

Personally stuff like this makes me cringe and generally I guess I don't see the point.

 

[Todd780]

My issue is how everything is tied into everything.

Stuff broke before but other things generally didn't care.

A modern 4wd is a torn abs sensor wire away from being a 2wd. I see it all the time on farm/construction trucks. My 02 has had the abs light on since last June and the 4wd works great. Not ideal but i am not stuck in a cornfield after a cornstalk grabs a wire either.

My wires are fine, the fault is in the $150 wheel bearing assembly which is still quiet and tight so I am not in a huge hurry to replace it. Not crazy about unit wheel bearings either but at least it isn't a pressed in POS like a lot of them now.

I have seen cars bricked (towed in for no start) from water in a cracked headlight, bad power steering module etc.

My 02 would blow a headlight fuse at worst and doesn't even have a power steering module.

Personally stuff like this makes me cringe and generally I guess I don't see the point.

Meh. I don't think it's anything new. When I was young I had an '80 Caddy Seville.

A dime fell into the the cigarette lighter socket when I was fishing for change at a red light.

The car died immediately and wouldn't restart. Had to have it towed. Guess you could say the '80 SeVille was 'bricked'.

I don't recall what ended up being wrong with it. Guessing it blew a fuse? Maybe it was an 8-6-4 issue with the 368? lol



Looks like a dent in the driver door but it's just the camera flash... I think that's the only pic I have of that car. Traded it for a Jag XJ6 Sovereign.

 

[UglyViking]

My issue is how everything is tied into everything.

Stuff broke before but other things generally didn't care.

A modern 4wd is a torn abs sensor wire away from being a 2wd. I see it all the time on farm/construction trucks. My 02 has had the abs light on since last June and the 4wd works great. Not ideal but i am not stuck in a cornfield after a cornstalk grabs a wire either.

I am not confident but wouldn't that reduce/remove the traction control, not the 4wd? I guess I could unplug a ABS sensor and find out but those systems have 0 dependence on each other, so I don't know why one would affect the other.

 

[Mickey Bitsko]

Appears when company x makes/builds a product that can be repaired
By the average schmuck only a matter of time before they change the design of the part or electronic that can only be fixed/ repaired by a dealer
To fully warranty the replacement.

 

[85_Ranger4x4]

Meh. I don't think it's anything new. When I was young I had an '80 Caddy Seville.

A dime fell into the the cigarette lighter socket when I was fishing for change at a red light.

The car died immediately and wouldn't restart. Had to have it towed. Guess you could say the '80 SeVille was 'bricked'.

I don't recall what ended up being wrong with it. Guessing it blew a fuse? Maybe it was an 8-6-4 issue with the 368? lol

View attachment 709889

Looks like a dent in the driver door but it's just the camera flash... I think that's the only pic I have of that car. Traded it for a Jag XJ6 Sovereign.

Bad designs are nothing new either.

Dad had a similar issue with a penny in his 92 GMC, I think it kept blowing the dash light fuse, the truck ran fine.

I am not confident but wouldn't that reduce/remove the traction control, not the 4wd? I guess I could unplug a ABS sensor and find out but those systems have 0 dependence on each other, so I don't know why one would affect the other.

I suspect it is a nanny feature so you don't throw it in 4wd while you are spinning tires. If the system doesn't see what it wants you don't get 4wd.

 

[DeoreDX]

Any reasonable person who has driven an older vehicle (pre-90s or so) and has also driven a modern vehicle (with "nanny systems") will say that the modern vehicle is undoubtedly superior in every way.

As a Gen-X'er I grew up those those 70's/80s analog vehicles and I whole heartedly agree with this sentiment. I learned to work on cars because I had to in order to get to school on time. But as with most things in life a balance of Yin and Yang is they key to happiness. I think we peaked with the Analog/Digital balance in the early 2ks. Just enough digital technology to make things more efficient and reliable and not enough to lock things out from the every day shade tree mechanic. Feels like in the last 5-10 years we have begun swinging too far in the other (digital) direction. That's probably why when I started looking vehicle to overland I was attracted to older early to mid 2k Toyotas. No great mysteries hidden within the digital infrastructure there. 9 times out of 10 anyone with a volt meter and an OBD2 reader can easily diagnose and repair any electrical issues.