VanIsle_Greg
I think I need a bigger truck!
Excellent...more to read coming to a forum thread new you!
Looking forward to your Africa travels.
Looking forward to your Africa travels.
unURBAN Adventures - Alaska to Argentina to AFRICA!
- Thread starter unURBAN
- Start date
ab1985
Explorer
It's taken me a few weeks to read this entire thread, but I did finish it last night. Let me echo other's comments and just say wow, what an amazing trip! Thanks for all the excellent photos and write-ups, and tons of great info for others who are considering similar trips. Congratulations to both of you for finishing the first leg(s) of your journey and for the good fortune you have to be able to continue on in Africa. I can't wait to continue reading!
Uruguay and shipping pain..
Hello again!
.
This post will basically be about the PAIN related to organizing shipping of a vehicle. Why the he## should this be so expensive, complicated, and time consuming??? The title of this post says “Uruguay”, and the reason is that my first plan was shipping in a container from Montevideo in Uruguay to Cape Town in South Africa. The reason for referring to this as “first” plan and not “the” plan will be explained in detail.
.
We arrived in Buenos Aires just in time for Malin's flight home to Norway. I dropped her off at the airport around 4 in the afternoon, and drove into town to see if I could get on a ferry across to Uruguay. I knew there would be one at 5 pm, one at 7 pm, and then one at 9-something. Arrived too late for the 5 o'clock departure as I hit rush hours, and the next departures were fully booked. That meant I had to look for a place to camp, and that pretty quick as it was getting late. Buenos Aires is a huge city, and moving around takes a lot of time. I had found some coordinates for a camp called L'Hirondelle some 30 kilometers north of town close to Tigre. An hour later as I eventually got closer to my waypoint, I started to have my doubts. Where I was driving was definitely not the nicer parts of Buenos Aires, and I felt I got some pretty nasty looks from the local residents. I still kept driving, and suddenly the road was blocked by a big sign saying “private property”, not very far from where the coordinates would take me. F###!! I turned around and got the hell out of there. It was now dark, and I didn't really know what to do. The only other place I knew about was a nice, expensive hotel in the city center, or 150 kilometers out of town the way I came in.
.
On my way out of the barrio where I was looking for the campground, I started to hear some disturbing metallic grinding noises from the left front wheel. This made me quite nervous. I can't remember if I mentioned it in an earlier post, but a couple of days before we left for Antarctica I noticed an oil leak from my left front knuckle house. A seal in the front axle needs to be replaced, so differential oil is leaking out through the axle. The reason is worn bearings that are due for a change. The plan was to do this in South Africa as parts are more available and prices are better than in South America. I was debating with myself for a while if I would have to deal with this before Africa or if I should just give it a try and drive for Montevideo and shipping, and count on the bearings and seal to hold up for another couple of thousand kilometers. Well, we took off and hoped it would last until Montevideo, after all it IS a Patrol…
.
.
.
So, to make a long, quite stressful evening, into a shorty story, I gave in and went for the nice hotel. Not a good day for my overlander-image, and I was quite worried that the oil from the diff had taken out the grease from the wheel bearings and ruined the bearing and hub. Next morning, in the hotel's parking lot, I had a look at where the grinding noise came from. It wasn't the bearing, but a worn out brake pad. The Patrol's brakes have a small metal bar that will hit the disc when there is about a millimeter pad left, and this makes a terrible sound. Phew. I got on the ferry to Uruguay the same morning. Leaving a huge busy modern city…
.
.
…arriving in the small quiet town of Colonia in Uruguay. I needed a break after all the driving the last week (and that evening in Buenos Aires), so I checked into a guesthouse in the town center. I was also planning to finalize the last few details of the shipping to Africa, so a few days in a guesthouse with good internet was just what I needed. I thought…
.
.
.
.
So, back to this “first” plan. I had been in touch with a couple of shipping agents in Montevideo, and had a few date of vessel departures to choose from. The idea was to drive the car into a 20 foot container. If I remove the roof top tent, and strap this to the rear bumper or put it on the hood, I should just clear the 2,28 meter high door. However, after emailing back and forth with some shipping agents, I learned that containers leaving Montevideo for Cape Town had three transshipments, and an estimated shipping time of 46 days!! In addition you have a couple of days in each end loading, unloading, and paperwork, AND there is in most cases a few days of delays! We were suddenly looking at almost TWO MONTHS between South America and South Africa. I couldn't really make sense of this as I repeatedly would find sailing schedules online with vessels supposedly corresponding that would take about 20 days to Cape Town?!?! Another thing that started to become an issue was the price. In the beginning we were told that we would be looking at about 3000 USD for shipping a container from MVD to Cape Town, but as we started digging into the matter, we learned that the total would be more like 4000 USD with all the port fees, custom fees, and container handling. Maybe even more. We decided to try to look for alternatives.
.
While figuring all this out, which takes a surprisingly large amount of time, I did some sightseeing around the coast of Uruguay.
I went to take a look at Montevideo, and even drove by the container port to see what it looked like. This could have been my final destination in South America.
.
.
.
The city of Montevideo
.
.
.
Further east is Puente del Este, “the Ibiza of South America” and where the rich and famous go to play. Beautiful beaches, but crowded and touristy. Not a very unURBAN place…
.
.
Bridge in Puente del Este
.
Found a more quiet beach further west on my way back to Colonia where I stayed for a couple of nights. Just outside the smaller town of Piriapolis.
.
.
By the time I got back to Colonia, we had a new plan for shipping across the Atlantic. A ro-ro (roll on – roll off) vessel was leaving Zarate in Argentina, a small port up the river north of Buenos Aires a few days later. We were suddenly back in the shipping game, and at least a 1000 USD saved. And from where I was in Uruguay, it was only a couple of hundred kilometers away.
.
I was told to show up at least two days before to sort out the paperwork. Talking with customs I got a nice surprise. There was NO paperwork to take care of?!?!? I was told to hand in my temporary vehicle permit (that you get at the border when entering the country) when driving in to the port for loading, and that would be it! Excellent! Could it be this easy?
.
Not really. But it wasn't the customs fault. The ship was supposed to be here on 3rd of March, 10 days ago, and I was supposed to be on my way to Africa by now. Shipping just sucks sometimes. The vessel scheduled to arrive at Zarate sails under British flag, and it turned out that the union operating the port will not deal with British vessels, believe it or not… UK and Argentina do have a history (read about the Falkland War on wikipedia), but I hadn't expected this. And I really expected that the people operating these vessels would know such things. The vessel was anchored up outside Montevideo for three days, and for a little while it looked like they could go to port in Montevideo, and that I would be able to load there. Fortunately (or I'm just starting to learn...), I didn't abruptly drive to Montevideo when that option came up. The next day it turned out that the port did not have space for the cargo, and it ended up with the vessel sailing back north to Brazil and out of reach for me. To Rio Grande in Brazil it would be 1300 kilometers, two borders, new custom policies to deal with, and a new port with regulations and fees for loading. All to be sorted out in less than 36 hours. Wise men have said that you should choose your battles carefully, so I stayed in Zarate. In the time of writing, the next available ro-ro vessel leaves for South Africa on the 1st April. That is three weeks from now, and one hell of a delay! So, not really sure what to do at the moment, but will keep looking for alternatives. Mental note to self: remember to check the flag the next vessel is sailing under.....
.
Not giving up on Africa yet!
Espen
Hello again!
.
This post will basically be about the PAIN related to organizing shipping of a vehicle. Why the he## should this be so expensive, complicated, and time consuming??? The title of this post says “Uruguay”, and the reason is that my first plan was shipping in a container from Montevideo in Uruguay to Cape Town in South Africa. The reason for referring to this as “first” plan and not “the” plan will be explained in detail.
.
We arrived in Buenos Aires just in time for Malin's flight home to Norway. I dropped her off at the airport around 4 in the afternoon, and drove into town to see if I could get on a ferry across to Uruguay. I knew there would be one at 5 pm, one at 7 pm, and then one at 9-something. Arrived too late for the 5 o'clock departure as I hit rush hours, and the next departures were fully booked. That meant I had to look for a place to camp, and that pretty quick as it was getting late. Buenos Aires is a huge city, and moving around takes a lot of time. I had found some coordinates for a camp called L'Hirondelle some 30 kilometers north of town close to Tigre. An hour later as I eventually got closer to my waypoint, I started to have my doubts. Where I was driving was definitely not the nicer parts of Buenos Aires, and I felt I got some pretty nasty looks from the local residents. I still kept driving, and suddenly the road was blocked by a big sign saying “private property”, not very far from where the coordinates would take me. F###!! I turned around and got the hell out of there. It was now dark, and I didn't really know what to do. The only other place I knew about was a nice, expensive hotel in the city center, or 150 kilometers out of town the way I came in.
.
On my way out of the barrio where I was looking for the campground, I started to hear some disturbing metallic grinding noises from the left front wheel. This made me quite nervous. I can't remember if I mentioned it in an earlier post, but a couple of days before we left for Antarctica I noticed an oil leak from my left front knuckle house. A seal in the front axle needs to be replaced, so differential oil is leaking out through the axle. The reason is worn bearings that are due for a change. The plan was to do this in South Africa as parts are more available and prices are better than in South America. I was debating with myself for a while if I would have to deal with this before Africa or if I should just give it a try and drive for Montevideo and shipping, and count on the bearings and seal to hold up for another couple of thousand kilometers. Well, we took off and hoped it would last until Montevideo, after all it IS a Patrol…
.
.
.
So, to make a long, quite stressful evening, into a shorty story, I gave in and went for the nice hotel. Not a good day for my overlander-image, and I was quite worried that the oil from the diff had taken out the grease from the wheel bearings and ruined the bearing and hub. Next morning, in the hotel's parking lot, I had a look at where the grinding noise came from. It wasn't the bearing, but a worn out brake pad. The Patrol's brakes have a small metal bar that will hit the disc when there is about a millimeter pad left, and this makes a terrible sound. Phew. I got on the ferry to Uruguay the same morning. Leaving a huge busy modern city…
.
.
…arriving in the small quiet town of Colonia in Uruguay. I needed a break after all the driving the last week (and that evening in Buenos Aires), so I checked into a guesthouse in the town center. I was also planning to finalize the last few details of the shipping to Africa, so a few days in a guesthouse with good internet was just what I needed. I thought…
.
.
.
.
So, back to this “first” plan. I had been in touch with a couple of shipping agents in Montevideo, and had a few date of vessel departures to choose from. The idea was to drive the car into a 20 foot container. If I remove the roof top tent, and strap this to the rear bumper or put it on the hood, I should just clear the 2,28 meter high door. However, after emailing back and forth with some shipping agents, I learned that containers leaving Montevideo for Cape Town had three transshipments, and an estimated shipping time of 46 days!! In addition you have a couple of days in each end loading, unloading, and paperwork, AND there is in most cases a few days of delays! We were suddenly looking at almost TWO MONTHS between South America and South Africa. I couldn't really make sense of this as I repeatedly would find sailing schedules online with vessels supposedly corresponding that would take about 20 days to Cape Town?!?! Another thing that started to become an issue was the price. In the beginning we were told that we would be looking at about 3000 USD for shipping a container from MVD to Cape Town, but as we started digging into the matter, we learned that the total would be more like 4000 USD with all the port fees, custom fees, and container handling. Maybe even more. We decided to try to look for alternatives.
.
While figuring all this out, which takes a surprisingly large amount of time, I did some sightseeing around the coast of Uruguay.
I went to take a look at Montevideo, and even drove by the container port to see what it looked like. This could have been my final destination in South America.
.
.
.
The city of Montevideo
.
.
.
Further east is Puente del Este, “the Ibiza of South America” and where the rich and famous go to play. Beautiful beaches, but crowded and touristy. Not a very unURBAN place…
.
.
Bridge in Puente del Este
.
Found a more quiet beach further west on my way back to Colonia where I stayed for a couple of nights. Just outside the smaller town of Piriapolis.
.
.
By the time I got back to Colonia, we had a new plan for shipping across the Atlantic. A ro-ro (roll on – roll off) vessel was leaving Zarate in Argentina, a small port up the river north of Buenos Aires a few days later. We were suddenly back in the shipping game, and at least a 1000 USD saved. And from where I was in Uruguay, it was only a couple of hundred kilometers away.
.
I was told to show up at least two days before to sort out the paperwork. Talking with customs I got a nice surprise. There was NO paperwork to take care of?!?!? I was told to hand in my temporary vehicle permit (that you get at the border when entering the country) when driving in to the port for loading, and that would be it! Excellent! Could it be this easy?
.
Not really. But it wasn't the customs fault. The ship was supposed to be here on 3rd of March, 10 days ago, and I was supposed to be on my way to Africa by now. Shipping just sucks sometimes. The vessel scheduled to arrive at Zarate sails under British flag, and it turned out that the union operating the port will not deal with British vessels, believe it or not… UK and Argentina do have a history (read about the Falkland War on wikipedia), but I hadn't expected this. And I really expected that the people operating these vessels would know such things. The vessel was anchored up outside Montevideo for three days, and for a little while it looked like they could go to port in Montevideo, and that I would be able to load there. Fortunately (or I'm just starting to learn...), I didn't abruptly drive to Montevideo when that option came up. The next day it turned out that the port did not have space for the cargo, and it ended up with the vessel sailing back north to Brazil and out of reach for me. To Rio Grande in Brazil it would be 1300 kilometers, two borders, new custom policies to deal with, and a new port with regulations and fees for loading. All to be sorted out in less than 36 hours. Wise men have said that you should choose your battles carefully, so I stayed in Zarate. In the time of writing, the next available ro-ro vessel leaves for South Africa on the 1st April. That is three weeks from now, and one hell of a delay! So, not really sure what to do at the moment, but will keep looking for alternatives. Mental note to self: remember to check the flag the next vessel is sailing under.....
.
Not giving up on Africa yet!
Espen
lostworldexpedition
Explorer
Wow! Sorry to hear about this BS Espen. Thanks for posting though, it gives us an idea of what to expect...
I hope you get lucky and ship as soon as possible.
I hope you get lucky and ship as soon as possible.
Espen
Don't give up! Africa is really worth the effort
Don't give up! Africa is really worth the effort
I guess the shipping agents here in South America are doing as good as they can. And for the container freight, it is not the shipping companies that charge the bucks. I could get a container from Montevideo to Cape Town for about 900 USD. Problem is you have to pay port fees, pay for trucking the container to a warehouse for loading, and then you have the same costs when you get to your destination port. Total costs in Montevideo was about 1500 USD (+900 for container freight), and then 15-1600 USD in Africa. Not sure about all costs related to Ro-Ro, but it should be a little less. I'll let you know when sorted.
Tempting invitation!
But Africa will be our next continent. Australia is high on the list though, so I'll keep the offer in mind.. E
Hi Espen,
I just shipped to Africa (from Europe) and can share some information with you. Think about shipping to a smaller port (Port Elisabeth in South Africa or Walvis Bay in Namibia). Port and agents fees are lower and it is far less complicated and time consuming to get your car out of the port. In Port Elisabeth it took us about 1h to get our car on the road, friends of ours had to wait over a week after the container arrived in Cape Town before they could get their car.
Volkswagen seems to ship quite a lot of new cars (Amoroks and heavy trucks) build in Brazil and Argentina to South Africa by RoRo ferry. I do not know which line they use. RoRo is usually cheaper than container.
Maybe this is helpful and good luck. We just spend 3 months in southern Africa With another 9-12 months still to come) and it is great.
Stefan
I just shipped to Africa (from Europe) and can share some information with you. Think about shipping to a smaller port (Port Elisabeth in South Africa or Walvis Bay in Namibia). Port and agents fees are lower and it is far less complicated and time consuming to get your car out of the port. In Port Elisabeth it took us about 1h to get our car on the road, friends of ours had to wait over a week after the container arrived in Cape Town before they could get their car.
Volkswagen seems to ship quite a lot of new cars (Amoroks and heavy trucks) build in Brazil and Argentina to South Africa by RoRo ferry. I do not know which line they use. RoRo is usually cheaper than container.
Maybe this is helpful and good luck. We just spend 3 months in southern Africa With another 9-12 months still to come) and it is great.
Stefan
Hey Tom&Janet!!!
Good to hear from you! Thanks for the advice. I have been in touch with port authorities in Walvis Bay (as the vessel I was supposed to be onboard would go to port there), and it is, as far as I can see, about half the costs compared to South Africa. However, flight tickets are about 500 USD more to Windhoek than to destinations in South Africa, so I'm not sure if it will pay off. We do want to spend time in South Africa of course, and we do need to have a major serivce on the Patrol (after 70 000 kms...). So it might be that we just pay what it costs to get to a port in South Africa and go from there. Not sure if the next vessel departuring Zarate will stop in Walvis, but if it does, I will definitely consider it.
And to be honest, relaxing in Argentina with some nice local redwine and bbqs is not really the end of the world... It could definitely have been worse!
Hope to see you guys sooner rather than later, somewhere in the world.... ;-)
Big hugs
E&M
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Hi Stefan!
Thanks for info. Much appreciated! I have been thinking the same thing about the ports. Still not sure which port to take out the car, but have to decide pretty soon. Walvis Bay is more expensive to get to, but cheaper for the port fees. Still working on prices for the ports in South Africa. And as I ship roro, it is also inportant to me to get the car out with as few port calls as possible.
It would be very interesting to know which services you had to pay for to get the back on the road, and also how much you vere charged for the services. You can also reach me on espen....@....unurban.no
Hope to hear from you, and maybe we can catch up on our way north?
Espen
Hi Espen,
glad if I can help. The mayor ports for RoRo shipping are Durban and Port Elisabeth because they are the ports close to the South African plants of mayor car manufacturers. Typically the ferries would bring cars produced abroad, unload them and load South African produced cars for export. Volkswagen e.g. uses Port Elisabeth and Toyota Durban because their plants are nearby. Durban is by far larger (it handles almost a ferry per day), PE handles a ferry once a week. PE is actually a surprisingly small operation and therefore supposedly a lot faster to clear a vehicle. We shipped through PE and I can not imagin how a car could have been processed faster than ours. The ship arrived at 3p.m. and we had our first dinner in our car on a campground near PE at 7.30pm. The shipping agent was extremely friendly. He picked us up at the airport (with all our bags) in his personal car, took our papers (carnet de passage), dropped us off at a shopping mall where we got our supplies, maps etc., and did all the paperwork while we were shopping. 2 hours later he picked us (and alot of shopping bags) up at the mall, told us that the car is waiting for us and drove us to the port were our car was parked in fenced and guarded parking right in front of the port offices. We showed our passports, signed a few papers documenting that we got the car and that it was undamaged (which it was), got the car keys and were escorted by our agent to a nice campground. That was it. We could not believe it. The total fee for everything (port, unloading, customs inspection, agents fees etc.) was 7,569 ZAR (about 1,000 US$). By mail I will send you copy of the agent´s invoice and his name and email. He handles a lot of Volkswagens shipping to and from South Africa and might be able to find out whether there are ships between South America and South Africa.
If you have any other questions (car insurance etc.) let me know.
Good luck
Stefan
glad if I can help. The mayor ports for RoRo shipping are Durban and Port Elisabeth because they are the ports close to the South African plants of mayor car manufacturers. Typically the ferries would bring cars produced abroad, unload them and load South African produced cars for export. Volkswagen e.g. uses Port Elisabeth and Toyota Durban because their plants are nearby. Durban is by far larger (it handles almost a ferry per day), PE handles a ferry once a week. PE is actually a surprisingly small operation and therefore supposedly a lot faster to clear a vehicle. We shipped through PE and I can not imagin how a car could have been processed faster than ours. The ship arrived at 3p.m. and we had our first dinner in our car on a campground near PE at 7.30pm. The shipping agent was extremely friendly. He picked us up at the airport (with all our bags) in his personal car, took our papers (carnet de passage), dropped us off at a shopping mall where we got our supplies, maps etc., and did all the paperwork while we were shopping. 2 hours later he picked us (and alot of shopping bags) up at the mall, told us that the car is waiting for us and drove us to the port were our car was parked in fenced and guarded parking right in front of the port offices. We showed our passports, signed a few papers documenting that we got the car and that it was undamaged (which it was), got the car keys and were escorted by our agent to a nice campground. That was it. We could not believe it. The total fee for everything (port, unloading, customs inspection, agents fees etc.) was 7,569 ZAR (about 1,000 US$). By mail I will send you copy of the agent´s invoice and his name and email. He handles a lot of Volkswagens shipping to and from South Africa and might be able to find out whether there are ships between South America and South Africa.
If you have any other questions (car insurance etc.) let me know.
Good luck
Stefan
Waiting waiting waiting in Argentina
Almost there!!
I hope. According to plan and booking, the Patrol should be on its way to South Africa in a couple of days time. However, seing is believing. Still, to be fair with hardworking shipping agents (and companies), I'm sure they do their best, and for us overlanders it IS important to remember that this is not a ferry service. And in most cases they are more or less on time, and everything is goes according to plan. In our case it was unfortunate that the UK - Argentina relations was slightly more heated than normal, and that this partucular vessel sailed under British flag. I'll file it under bad luck for now. The vessel arriving in a couple of days is sailing under Panama flag (yes, I checked!), so hopefully this will be arriving without trouble.
.
Malin is still in Norway, and here the other day she mentioned that my last blog sounded a little negative. Well, yes, I was... But when the frustration was out, I discovered that hanging out for three weeks in Argentina wasn't really that bad.
.
.
As the car is a little overdue for a service, I didn't want to put in any long distance driving, and I also wanted to get through with some administrative and web issues that I have been thinking about for a while. More about web-things later. I found myself a nice and quiet camp ground in the village of Paranacito, and settled in for a while at Camping Top Malo. Two weeks to be exact. First few days I didn't really do anything but reading and enjoying some of the treats of Argentina. BBQ, red wine, cheese and salames. Not bad at all, actually...
.
.
Summer is coming to an end in the southern emisphere, and the campgrounds and not very crowded other than in weekends. My campground host invited me to a sightseeing trip on the river running past the village. It would be a couple of hours to get out onto the huge Rio Uruguay. The camping hosts are also fishing guides, and arrange fishing trips on the rivers in the area.
.
.
.
Lots of traffic on the rivers in the area. Would be fun to do a overriver trip one day as well. Amazon river from the coast of Brazil to Peru...? Hmm... I'll have to think more about that.
.
.
.
Well, the waiting is almost over, and in a couple of days I will be loading the Patrol in Port Zarate. I hope...
.
More soon!
E
Almost there!!
I hope. According to plan and booking, the Patrol should be on its way to South Africa in a couple of days time. However, seing is believing. Still, to be fair with hardworking shipping agents (and companies), I'm sure they do their best, and for us overlanders it IS important to remember that this is not a ferry service. And in most cases they are more or less on time, and everything is goes according to plan. In our case it was unfortunate that the UK - Argentina relations was slightly more heated than normal, and that this partucular vessel sailed under British flag. I'll file it under bad luck for now. The vessel arriving in a couple of days is sailing under Panama flag (yes, I checked!), so hopefully this will be arriving without trouble.
.
Malin is still in Norway, and here the other day she mentioned that my last blog sounded a little negative. Well, yes, I was... But when the frustration was out, I discovered that hanging out for three weeks in Argentina wasn't really that bad.
.
.
As the car is a little overdue for a service, I didn't want to put in any long distance driving, and I also wanted to get through with some administrative and web issues that I have been thinking about for a while. More about web-things later. I found myself a nice and quiet camp ground in the village of Paranacito, and settled in for a while at Camping Top Malo. Two weeks to be exact. First few days I didn't really do anything but reading and enjoying some of the treats of Argentina. BBQ, red wine, cheese and salames. Not bad at all, actually...
.
.
Summer is coming to an end in the southern emisphere, and the campgrounds and not very crowded other than in weekends. My campground host invited me to a sightseeing trip on the river running past the village. It would be a couple of hours to get out onto the huge Rio Uruguay. The camping hosts are also fishing guides, and arrange fishing trips on the rivers in the area.
.
.
.
Lots of traffic on the rivers in the area. Would be fun to do a overriver trip one day as well. Amazon river from the coast of Brazil to Peru...? Hmm... I'll have to think more about that.
.
.
.
Well, the waiting is almost over, and in a couple of days I will be loading the Patrol in Port Zarate. I hope...
.
More soon!
E
4x4abc
Adventurer
Espen,
love your post, as always. Down to earth and honest. Best of luck to you both!
I am just back from an enchanting trip with Swiss clients:
http://carlosnpainter.smugmug.com/T...21912/21802147_m3HV58#!i=1738597634&k=MWVZGr9
love your post, as always. Down to earth and honest. Best of luck to you both!
I am just back from an enchanting trip with Swiss clients:
http://carlosnpainter.smugmug.com/T...21912/21802147_m3HV58#!i=1738597634&k=MWVZGr9
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