What to do?

[Ozrockrat]

Some probably irrelevent thoughts

I have just bought a couple of vans. No Quigley's but a Advanced Four Wheel converted 1996 EB Diesel E350, a 1994 Sportsmobile (2wd gas E250) and I just sold a E150 high top Turtle Top that was lifted.

Summary

EB Diesel 4x4. 246K miles. Leaf spring frontend. Shagged spring bushes, unknown quality shocks, replaced dragling and didn't get to do a wheel alignment and it is excellent on the road. A little hash over rough stuff but it is an E350 with no load at all. No wallowing or bad on-road manners even up to 90 on the freeways. Handled the curvaceous (always wanted to use that work in its real context :elkgrin roads of Southern Utah with ease.

Turtletop had new springs (+2.5) and KYB shocks. Wallowed around a bit but generally stable on the highway.

E250 Sportsmobile. Didn't wallow as much as the Turtletop but had my pucker factor very high the first time we took it on the freeway. Replaced the front shocks (all I could get in the middle of Alabama) and that improved things so at least I could go 65 - 70 on the freeway without crapping my pants. Replaced the rear shocks as well when we got to Phoenix and then drove to San Diego and back. Much improved. These were the cheapest shocks I could get. About $30 ea. And they made a considerable difference.

So for my very limited experience a worn, unmaintained leaf spring front end handles better than either of the coil spring ones.

Given the sample size of 3 and the vastly different configurations I would suggest the error margins on this survey would be about 95%. :sombrero:

But what I have learned is that the coil spring setups are very susceptible to tire pressure, shock condition and wheel alignment that does not seem to affect the leaf spring version as much.

I am also suspecting that the need for / use of good shocks is masking a design deficiency.

Another thought is that to tame down the hashness of the landcruiser suspension on my 6 wheel (3 axle) FJ75 I had the guys convert it to a leaf-coil combination on the front. The leaves held the axle in its correct position and the coils provided a more compliant ride. (that was done in Australia and I am not sure if anyone has considered it here)

OK that my friday afternoon ramble over with. "Normal program will resume in a minute."

 

[haywoodphoto@mac.com]

Gentleman, it sounds like I need to get a set of Bilsteins to start and go from there?

 

[dsw4x4]

I will make this quick because I am leaving town to go wheeling in just a bit. The system I am working on will most likely be 4 inches of lift giving you 7 inches of up travel and if I can squeak it in 6 of down travel this will more than double the stock Quigly or sportsmobile. Shocks should be a rebuildable/ tunable remote resevior (optional) coil over. Pneumatic Bump stops will be an option the rear shocks will be the same variety minus the coil over. The four links will be replaced with dom tubing and fully rebuildable/greaseable johnny joints as will the track bar. This adjustability will allow you move the axle forward for better tire clearance. Sway bar disconnects for the front sway bar and it will get rid of that dumb factory sway bar bushing that quigly uses. Stainless brake lines yada yada yada... I say most likely because all of the components will be tried and tested before I sell them to anyone. When we take our van wheeling like this weekend it usually means that I will put at least two to three hundred miles of off pavement (trails) driving. We have done over 600 miles of off road in a 4 day weekend before. I do not know when I will have this suspension ironed out and ready to sell but when I do it will be bullet proof system the will improve your vans handling.
Everyone have a good fourth of july.
Derek

 

[haywoodphoto@mac.com]

Derek, how is the suspension project coming along for the Quigleys?

I will make this quick because I am leaving town to go wheeling in just a bit. The system I am working on will most likely be 4 inches of lift giving you 7 inches of up travel and if I can squeak it in 6 of down travel this will more than double the stock Quigly or sportsmobile. Shocks should be a rebuildable/ tunable remote resevior (optional) coil over. Pneumatic Bump stops will be an option the rear shocks will be the same variety minus the coil over. The four links will be replaced with dom tubing and fully rebuildable/greaseable johnny joints as will the track bar. This adjustability will allow you move the axle forward for better tire clearance. Sway bar disconnects for the front sway bar and it will get rid of that dumb factory sway bar bushing that quigly uses. Stainless brake lines yada yada yada... I say most likely because all of the components will be tried and tested before I sell them to anyone. When we take our van wheeling like this weekend it usually means that I will put at least two to three hundred miles of off pavement (trails) driving. We have done over 600 miles of off road in a 4 day weekend before. I do not know when I will have this suspension ironed out and ready to sell but when I do it will be bullet proof system the will improve your vans handling.
Everyone have a good fourth of july.
Derek

 

[dsw4x4]

I wish I could tell you it is done but the truth be told, I have been to busy with van conversion I have not had the time to devote to it lately. I am hoping to have it figured out sometime in the fall.
Derek

 

[TroySmith80]

I wish I could tell you it is done but the truth be told, I have been to busy with van conversion I have not had the time to devote to it lately. I am hoping to have it figured out sometime in the fall.
Derek

How about now? I know life has a tendency to make projects lag a lot, for me anyway!

 

[ExpoMike]

Honestly, KYB shocks are about one step above stock shocks and basically suck! I have had them on a few projects and ended up hating every one of them. I made the switch to Bilstein many years back and haven't used a different shock since, when I have the option.

KYB shocks are a twin tube design which means there is an inner and outer (the part you see) tube and the fluid resides mainly between these two areas. Because of this, the piston is very small because it ride on the inner tube suface. This creates a very large heat source since the small piston is trying to control a lot of movement. Once they heat up, fade and hence crappy ride will happen. Also they use a very basic valving system that does not offer much control.

Bilstein uses a mono tube design so the piston is almost as large as the shock diameter (minus the tube thickness). This allows better heat displacement and being larger, better control over fluid movement. They also use a digressive (I believe that's the term) valve system that changes with how fast the piston moves.

An example I had happen to me, I had a '69 Camaro that was basically stock with a sagged out suspension and I was on the verge of replacing all the springs. It rode teriable and wallowed, bounced and bottomed out all the time. It was suggested to put on a set of Bilstein's and after doing so, I never touched anything else in the suspension and drove it for a few years before I sold it. It rode great, handled great and never had any issues, just from a shock change. I was sold right there on how important shocks play into the overall ride and quality of the suspension system. Over 20 vehicles later, Bilstein's go on any of them when I replace the shocks. Actually I have done it on vehicles that I have bought new and within 2000 miles, replace the stock new shocks with Bilstein's.

Go that route and be much happier!