The "fast" part in the factory "fast axles" is the ring and pinion. If you want to use smaller tires, you will need an even faster axles, compared when using larger tires.
Where to buy a square mog? Advice?
- Thread starter evilfij
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The "fast" part in the factory "fast axles" is the ring and pinion. If you want to use smaller tires, you will need an even faster axles, compared when using larger tires.
My Unimog is equipped with both fast axles and an overdrive and I make full use of both of them, and this is the wise way to do it ... Of course everyone is welcome to buy an Unimog and run it at redline all day long
65ish should really be your top cruising speed. You can make SBU go faster, I've been in a few that can easily do 75mph, but really SBU aren't designed to go faster than 100kph (61). 110kph (68mph) is the fastest I cruise and I think that is probably the reasonable limit. Faster than than that and other things come into play like the speed rating of the tires (usually 90 KPH), the brakes, heat build up in the hubs etc. A turbo, fast axles, and a gear splitter means you can cruise 65mph easily with the engine at civilized rpms. It also means you can go faster when you need too. High speed axles for SBU have different ring and pinions, hub ratios are the same. The AV super high speed pinions are a bit of a trade off. While they are great for on-road cruising, they start to really bite into the 1st gear crawl speed to the point where you should really look into working gears, especially if you have larger tires. They seem ideal for a 406/416 with working gears since the Claas is not an option. In terms of where to get SBU's (since you asked), email unimogcenter.com. Website is dated and doesn't show current inventory which is currently about 6 SBU's, most with turbo and high speed axles. 25 year old rule applies to all vehicles you want to drive on the road, there is no loophole. There are however people who misrepresent their vehicles. Just because you got plates on it does not mean it is legal and customs can, and does, seize vehicles, sometimes years later.
mogwildRW1
Adventurer
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kGc_PnB_QOI
This comes up, on every forum that has Unimogs from time to time. You want to go fast (I mean, "normal" vehicle fast, which up here is 100-110km/h) keep looking. A Unimog can be pushed to higher speeds but wear and tear goes up exponentially as speed increases. Either slow down, and enjoy the view (take less traveled roads rather than major highways) or buy something that's designed to go faster. Sure a Claas overdrive can get you higher speeds, but most people buy them not for higher speeds, but to lower engine RPM's at regular (unimog) speeds This lowers noise in the cabin, less wear and tear on the engine, and give you a few gears "inbetween" each gear to split for hills. And for pete's sake, don't slap on 10+yr old surplus tires and go doing speed runs in Unimogs. Surplus tires at any age above 5yrs should be for tire swings, and around the farm useage.
Also of note, "fast axles" is a relative term. In late '88 when Mercedes switched to the OM366a, it had a lower engine speed (2400rpm) in most vehicles (agriculture Unimogs being the exception, they still revved to 2600-2800rpm) so they put in "fast" axle ratio standard, catch is, with the 2400rpm engine, that just really brings you back up to the same speed as regular axles in the earlier Unimogs. So be aware when Unimog shopping, just because it has option order code for fast axles, doesn't mean it will be faster, especially with the OM366a
Oh, there just happens to be a camper mog for sale on the Exchange:http://unimog.net/exchange/
This comes up, on every forum that has Unimogs from time to time. You want to go fast (I mean, "normal" vehicle fast, which up here is 100-110km/h) keep looking. A Unimog can be pushed to higher speeds but wear and tear goes up exponentially as speed increases. Either slow down, and enjoy the view (take less traveled roads rather than major highways) or buy something that's designed to go faster. Sure a Claas overdrive can get you higher speeds, but most people buy them not for higher speeds, but to lower engine RPM's at regular (unimog) speeds This lowers noise in the cabin, less wear and tear on the engine, and give you a few gears "inbetween" each gear to split for hills. And for pete's sake, don't slap on 10+yr old surplus tires and go doing speed runs in Unimogs. Surplus tires at any age above 5yrs should be for tire swings, and around the farm useage.
Also of note, "fast axles" is a relative term. In late '88 when Mercedes switched to the OM366a, it had a lower engine speed (2400rpm) in most vehicles (agriculture Unimogs being the exception, they still revved to 2600-2800rpm) so they put in "fast" axle ratio standard, catch is, with the 2400rpm engine, that just really brings you back up to the same speed as regular axles in the earlier Unimogs. So be aware when Unimog shopping, just because it has option order code for fast axles, doesn't mean it will be faster, especially with the OM366a
Oh, there just happens to be a camper mog for sale on the Exchange:http://unimog.net/exchange/
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evilfij
Explorer
I am perfectly happy at 100kph-110kph tops. The interstates I travel on are either 65 or 70mph so if you are doing 55mph or less it is quite unsafe in my view.
The 44% increase over stock with the AV ring and pinion really sounds like the ticket. I would rarely need to crawl and maybe I can find one with working gears. I assume 1st is still low enough to get off the line reasonably on road.
I will call the two US places. Thank you for the recommendations.
The 44% increase over stock with the AV ring and pinion really sounds like the ticket. I would rarely need to crawl and maybe I can find one with working gears. I assume 1st is still low enough to get off the line reasonably on road.
I will call the two US places. Thank you for the recommendations.
Iain_U1250
Explorer
Having not driven in the US, I find it strange why you guys think it is unsafe to drive at 80-90kph (50-55mph) That is quite a comfortable speed for a Unimog, and if you keep in the slow lane, everyone can get around you. Surely not everyone drives at 60-65mph over there, so why do you think it is unsafe. I though the interstates had two lanes in each direction, often more.
Over here, we have long stretches of "highway" which are only one lane in each direction, often with 200-300km between towns and they have a lot of traffic, often 50m long road trains. There are passing lanes on some, but if a truck is behind me and wants to overtake where there is not passing lane, I will talk to them on the radio and when they start coming past, I back off and let them pass.
Whilst my truck can sit at 110kph, we tend to drive slower than that, and normally drive around 10kph lower than the speed limit on most roads. We are loaded to maximum GVM and drive accordingly, especially in town, as we do take longer to stop so keep a safe distance behind other cars. I don't find many people cutting in front of me, probably when they see the bull-bar which is right at their head level when they come past, they think twice about cutting me off. When the road gets narrow and twisty, we slow right down and drive it very carefully. It is the narrow twisty road where people sometimes get very impatient and do silly things. The brakes on ours are OK, but no where near car like, and on steep down hills we use the exhaust brake and gears to slow down, it picks up speed very quickly on a steep hill.
In regards the AV super fast diff ratio, first gear will be really fast, around 18kph @ 2500rpm, which is way to fast for safe descents off road and whilst it will still go up steep hills, you are not going to be able to drive up a river bed or across any rocky surfaces unless you ride the clutch. Working gears would be essential if you are getting this upgrade in my opinion. If you don't plan on driving off road, then why spend all the money on a Unimog and then only drive it on the highway or on dirt roads, there are much better options available, and if you really want a Mercedes truck, the 1017 series is much more civilised, cheaper and simpler.
Over here, we have long stretches of "highway" which are only one lane in each direction, often with 200-300km between towns and they have a lot of traffic, often 50m long road trains. There are passing lanes on some, but if a truck is behind me and wants to overtake where there is not passing lane, I will talk to them on the radio and when they start coming past, I back off and let them pass.
Whilst my truck can sit at 110kph, we tend to drive slower than that, and normally drive around 10kph lower than the speed limit on most roads. We are loaded to maximum GVM and drive accordingly, especially in town, as we do take longer to stop so keep a safe distance behind other cars. I don't find many people cutting in front of me, probably when they see the bull-bar which is right at their head level when they come past, they think twice about cutting me off. When the road gets narrow and twisty, we slow right down and drive it very carefully. It is the narrow twisty road where people sometimes get very impatient and do silly things. The brakes on ours are OK, but no where near car like, and on steep down hills we use the exhaust brake and gears to slow down, it picks up speed very quickly on a steep hill.
In regards the AV super fast diff ratio, first gear will be really fast, around 18kph @ 2500rpm, which is way to fast for safe descents off road and whilst it will still go up steep hills, you are not going to be able to drive up a river bed or across any rocky surfaces unless you ride the clutch. Working gears would be essential if you are getting this upgrade in my opinion. If you don't plan on driving off road, then why spend all the money on a Unimog and then only drive it on the highway or on dirt roads, there are much better options available, and if you really want a Mercedes truck, the 1017 series is much more civilised, cheaper and simpler.
Clutch
<---Pass
They don't...if the speed limit is 65, they are doing 75-80+. Very aggressive drivers over here, "everyone" is in a hurry.
I used to own VW Kombi's....55 on the highway or interstate is very dangerous, and down right scary.
OP is probably better off in a Ford F250.
Ian, I agree with what you say that a Mog is not for speeding down the highway. Though I have never owned one, I have driven a friend's U1250 a few times and it was not even "truck" fast, let alone fast enough to keep up with interstate travel required for a 2-3 day trip.
In the US, it is QUITE common for people to travel 80 - 90 mph (130 - 145 KPH) if traffic permits, even in larger cities where the speed limit may only be 65 - 70 MPH. NO ONE drives the speed limit here. This is especially true in the more open western states, where speed limits are 70 - 80 MPH, but has generally been my experience and I have been to 42 of the 50 states.
You MAY be able to travel at 50 MPH, but you are going to piss everyone off on the Interstate highways and there are laws in some states about traveling slowly in relation to other traffic, which can be dangerous as previously noted.
From the point of view of someone who uses a FE140 on the back roads as much as possible, to avoid interstates for several reasons, I suggest doing the same with a Mog, i.e. slow down and take the back roads everywhere or buy something else. This is especially true if you want to "camp" and use it as a "pickup" The same thought goes for Pinzgauers, C303 Volvos and the like. They are simply not comfortable, 65 MPH freeway travel rigs.
Chat with Jason at Couch Offroad, Rob Pickering, Vermont Unimogs and Expedition Imports (I think all of those are correct)
In the US, it is QUITE common for people to travel 80 - 90 mph (130 - 145 KPH) if traffic permits, even in larger cities where the speed limit may only be 65 - 70 MPH. NO ONE drives the speed limit here. This is especially true in the more open western states, where speed limits are 70 - 80 MPH, but has generally been my experience and I have been to 42 of the 50 states.
You MAY be able to travel at 50 MPH, but you are going to piss everyone off on the Interstate highways and there are laws in some states about traveling slowly in relation to other traffic, which can be dangerous as previously noted.
From the point of view of someone who uses a FE140 on the back roads as much as possible, to avoid interstates for several reasons, I suggest doing the same with a Mog, i.e. slow down and take the back roads everywhere or buy something else. This is especially true if you want to "camp" and use it as a "pickup" The same thought goes for Pinzgauers, C303 Volvos and the like. They are simply not comfortable, 65 MPH freeway travel rigs.
Chat with Jason at Couch Offroad, Rob Pickering, Vermont Unimogs and Expedition Imports (I think all of those are correct)
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Coachgeo
Explorer
Devils advocate point of view-
On the interstate at 50 55mph in a truck as big as a Mog is not as huge an issue as some make it. Now if you were on a Motorcycle..... YEAH.. your *** will get run over. BUT.. in a Mog People see you from far enough away. If they want to be bad drivers and not keep a vigil out for a route thru the traffic ahead.. but instead run up your ******** then do "oh....... when did that big thing get in my way" its not end of the world since typically it is followed with "Wait.... damn that thing looks coool" ..."what is it"? Think the national Interstate minimum speed is 50mph.
Seriously though.... IMHO/experience use back roads sometimes.... but mostly plan to use roads.... even Interstate WHERE YOU CAN EASLY BE PASSED till your in an adventure mode to meander down back roads again. .. on a two lane they can't pass too often and that makes you a hassle and a danger IMHO. Also plan big cities trafic areas to drive thru to be done late at night. Pull over..... take a nap. Hit it at night.
Have driven Mog speed (use to have a dieselized 404) and now a LMTV.... which is slower than my 404 was but oh well.... Life goes on. Expedition Ahead
But if you MUST.... yes a square cab Mog can be turned up and high-speed gears added that can increase the chance (a little bit) to average maybe 57mph? but not much more. Best info on that is at Benzworld dot org / forums / Unimog yes it will shorten life of engine so don't go hog wild. Add a Pyrometer to watch EGT's!!! Do a lot of reading at Benzworld there... as was said above your questions have been asked to Ad nauseam and the answers are all there at Benzworld. See DokaTD's threads / Posts especially.
PS= Prepare to pay $$ on top of purchase price to get it to cruise at your desired speeds.
PS-Trev who posted above know's his shiat... Tis why he's one of the Moderators there.
On the interstate at 50 55mph in a truck as big as a Mog is not as huge an issue as some make it. Now if you were on a Motorcycle..... YEAH.. your *** will get run over. BUT.. in a Mog People see you from far enough away. If they want to be bad drivers and not keep a vigil out for a route thru the traffic ahead.. but instead run up your ******** then do "oh....... when did that big thing get in my way" its not end of the world since typically it is followed with "Wait.... damn that thing looks coool" ..."what is it"?
Think the national Interstate minimum speed is 50mph. Seriously though.... IMHO/experience use back roads sometimes.... but mostly plan to use roads.... even Interstate WHERE YOU CAN EASLY BE PASSED till your in an adventure mode to meander down back roads again. .. on a two lane they can't pass too often and that makes you a hassle and a danger IMHO. Also plan big cities trafic areas to drive thru to be done late at night. Pull over..... take a nap. Hit it at night.
Have driven Mog speed (use to have a dieselized 404) and now a LMTV.... which is slower than my 404 was
but oh well.... Life goes on. Expedition AheadBut if you MUST.... yes a square cab Mog can be turned up and high-speed gears added that can increase the chance (a little bit) to average maybe 57mph? but not much more. Best info on that is at Benzworld dot org / forums / Unimog yes it will shorten life of engine so don't go hog wild. Add a Pyrometer to watch EGT's!!! Do a lot of reading at Benzworld there... as was said above your questions have been asked to Ad nauseam and the answers are all there at Benzworld. See DokaTD's threads / Posts especially.
PS= Prepare to pay $$ on top of purchase price to get it to cruise at your desired speeds.
PS-Trev who posted above know's his shiat... Tis why he's one of the Moderators there.
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evilfij
Explorer
Thanks for all the advice. I really need to stop working 9am-1am so I can make some phone calls and see what is available for purchase and discuss my options with the various people who sell Mogs. I suppose my unicorn is a u1300 with a turbo, short bed hopefully a tipper, and AV ring and pinion with a hydraulic winch(es).
I know I will never use a mog if I can't go 65ish mph which is why this is my big issue. And full disclaimer, in my younger years I have done 85mph in a series Land Rover for long distances (hills slow you down, but it will do 85 maxed out -- according to the discovery following me anyway), and 100mph+ in 110/defender so I know what it is like to go stupid fast in something not intended to do so. I will freely admit I only want one as a toy, but it has to be a toy I enjoy playing with and serves some justifiable function (haul rock, mulch etc.) I mean just getting between my houses limited to 55mph would be near suicide, let alone any longer trips on the east coast.
And an domestic pickup (ala F250 suggestion) would be more practical but I recently bought a new taco (it was that, a 2017 super duty, or cummins but I already have a suburban so the domestic box is checked) but I like simplicity and durability most so the mog fits the bill.
PS one last question, do I need to get a CDL to drive one?
I know I will never use a mog if I can't go 65ish mph which is why this is my big issue. And full disclaimer, in my younger years I have done 85mph in a series Land Rover for long distances (hills slow you down, but it will do 85 maxed out -- according to the discovery following me anyway), and 100mph+ in 110/defender so I know what it is like to go stupid fast in something not intended to do so. I will freely admit I only want one as a toy, but it has to be a toy I enjoy playing with and serves some justifiable function (haul rock, mulch etc.) I mean just getting between my houses limited to 55mph would be near suicide, let alone any longer trips on the east coast.
And an domestic pickup (ala F250 suggestion) would be more practical but I recently bought a new taco (it was that, a 2017 super duty, or cummins but I already have a suburban so the domestic box is checked) but I like simplicity and durability most so the mog fits the bill.
PS one last question, do I need to get a CDL to drive one?
thebigblue
Adventurer
Whats wrong with the world - why do you want to go fast and be in a hurry - why not just slow down and enjoy life? I find driving at 80 km/h fast! I prefer the backroads and like to see the world and the small cities. (You can have your thread back now)
nick disjunkt
Adventurer
From someone who recently drove 11,000 mile around America in a truck with a 55mph limiter, I have to agree.
We did some long stretches on the interstate (Denver to Chicago for example), and never felt in danger, or received any hostility. American drivers are generally not the most patient or considerate, but driving at 55mph was never a safety concern.
The trucks clearly saw us from far enough away that they just overtook and got on with things.
I think that the American insistence on driving at 65mph plus has more to do with the limited vacation time most people get, and the tradition of driving big horsepower cars, than it does with safety.
Incidentally, the only thing we overtook on the interstate was a 2nd world war era Willys Jeep.
Iain_U1250
Explorer
That's good input Nick, I think if you are driving a car slowly, people will expect you to be able to keep the speed limit, but when they see something strange like any Expo truck, they are more interested than annoyed. Worst thing we found is that people would pull up next to us on an overtaking lane, slow down to have a look and some take photos, we would have to back off at the end of the overtaking lane to be able to merge back in. Luckily the size of the truck means that when the indicators come on and I slowly start to move over, people let us in.
What's nice about having a truck that can go fast is you can overtake things. The "Grey Nomad" caravanners out here tend to drive between n80-85kph, but most often you get ones that don't like getting overtaken by a truck so they speed up on the uphill overtaking lanes then slow down again when the are past the overtaking. They get a surprise when we accelerate up the hill and pass them
I think there is a big difference between having enough power/speed to overtake, and wanting to constantly run at high speed to keep up with the cars.
If you are looking for a tipper, then an Ag Spec Mog is the way to go, only problem is they always have the "standard" diff ratio, so limited to around 80kph. Mine was like that, in original spec it was limited to 75kph, and would just about be able to do it with the 125hp motor. The good thing is most Ag Spec Mogs come with working gears and full hydraulics.
What's nice about having a truck that can go fast is you can overtake things. The "Grey Nomad" caravanners out here tend to drive between n80-85kph, but most often you get ones that don't like getting overtaken by a truck so they speed up on the uphill overtaking lanes then slow down again when the are past the overtaking. They get a surprise when we accelerate up the hill and pass them
I think there is a big difference between having enough power/speed to overtake, and wanting to constantly run at high speed to keep up with the cars.
If you are looking for a tipper, then an Ag Spec Mog is the way to go, only problem is they always have the "standard" diff ratio, so limited to around 80kph. Mine was like that, in original spec it was limited to 75kph, and would just about be able to do it with the 125hp motor. The good thing is most Ag Spec Mogs come with working gears and full hydraulics.
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