Which tires for snow?

[336wheeler]

The three tires that are consistently recurring to what I -think- I should get are the following:

285/75r16 Toyo Open Country AT - $163

285/75r16 BFG AT - $217

255/85r16 Toyo Open Country MT - $238

Seems the most rational economic option would be the ATs, although the 255 Toyos are a super appealing tire to me for some reason. Anyways... I've had a wrangler with BFG ATs and it did well in snow, and also had the Toyo ATs in a 265, so I can vouch for how both perform in snow. The BFGs do seem to crunch the snow down a bit more, as someone else has already said, although they are $80 more per tire.

I may go with the BFGs because I am concerned about having a well-performing snow tire, and have put my buddy's set on the front of mine before to make sure they clear. I know I can clear that particular 285, which is also an encouraging reason to run it.

 

[grntrdtaco]

MT tires are the absolute worst things you can have on the truck unless its 10" deep with dirt/mud underneath. they are as dangerous as bald tires on a snowy icy highway/ paved road in my opinion.

this is the tread off the hakka 4 with square studs.

i have these on my car they grip like crazy

i would'nt recommend anything unless its got that mountain snowflake symbol on the sidewall for winter driving

check this out
http://www.bb4wa.com/articles/winter.htm

and this
http://www.bb4wa.com/articles/Chains.htm

i think he is paid by bf goodrich so its probalby a bit biased but very good info.

check out costco as well they have good prices on them

 

[meafordmike]

Michelin X-Ice

 

[336wheeler]

I believe that the BFG AT in the 285/75 size will be my tire of choice.

 

[Rando]

While it is a fine tire, it is only OK at best for ice and snow. I am in the same situation you are in regards to buying a winter/snow/ice tires and have done way too much research into this in the past month. If you compare the tread pattern of most AT tires (and all MT tires) to that of a specialist snow and ice tire it is pretty obvious why they aren't so good in the snow. Snow and ice tires have a large number of small tread blocks (unlike an AT) and lots of siping (look at the nokians above).

If you really want decent snow performance you need to go with a tire with a tread designed for it and a softer rubber compound like Blizzacks, Ice-X or at the very least Cooper Discoverer M+S (which is a more 'aggresive' snow tire and is also studable).

However if you just want a tire that will be OK in occasional snow and great the rest of the year the BFG ATs will be fine.

I believe that the BFG AT in the 285/75 size will be my tire of choice.

 

[336wheeler]

Rando - my sentiments exactly. I have seen a large selection of SNOW tires (that look like street tires, in my opinion) but nothing that really meets my needs. I need a tire that does well enough in snow and ice to get me around, while providing on-road longevity, ride comfort, and decent enough traction for the warmer months of exploration. The Toyo AT that I have used the past ~40k works well enough in snow (notice the amount of siping and tread void spacing), but leaves a little more to be desired in other off-road situations. The BFG AT that I ran on a Wrangler worked well enough in the type of off-road scenarios I find myself in (minus sticking a rock through the tread once, but I have a 235/85 Load E Goodyear MT/R as my spare that should be durable enough for anything) and perform well on the road. I also think that the BFGs will clean out a little better than the Toyos, as some of the eastern clay found in this area gums up my Toyos pretty easily.

That being said, if I lived in a climate that had a larger majority of winter months that summer months (although we see snow here from October-April), I would probably run a Yokohama Geolandar I/T. Because I need more of a versatile tire for year-round performance, I think that the BFG will serve me well.

 

[dustboy]

Look around here a bit and you will find a lot of support for 235 or 255 narrow tires. Also, a very technical writeup by our fearless leader. I have the 235 BFG AT's and I love them, though I haven't had them in the snow yet.

BTW Costco has good prices on tires but they won't install anything but the factory spec'd size.

 

[336wheeler]

Best 255/85s for snow? Seem to be the Toyo M55s (from looking at their tread - maybe a cooper s/t in 2nd, but it's not really a snow pattern at all) ... but hard to justify their price. The load D and tread patterns available in the 285/75 size make them so much more desirable over the 255s for snow driving, although the design of the 255 makes them more desirable. At first guess, I would say that tread pattern is more important than more PSI in the contact patch.

 

[336wheeler]

Pulling the trigger on some tires within the next week... still trying to nail down what I'm wanting to run. Does anyone have any pictures of the Cooper Discoverer ST 255/85 on a stock Toyota 16x7" 5 spoke wheel? Either going to run the Coopers in a 255/85 size or the Toyo AT/Nitto Terra Grappler in a 285 size. I think I will get better MPG and less rubbing with the 255s... just think it might look a little bit skinny at first.

 

[Kodachrome]

I live in a ski town at 8,000 feet, I have run BFG AT/KO's for nearly ten years now in every condition you could imagine and they simply work outstanding. For example, in good snow years, I have my truck in 4WD for not days at a time, but weeks. I have been caught in some gnarly blizzards on I-70, one where people in normal POV's were stopped for over 8 hours and I just blasted through it with ease. This is in all kinds of moisture content too, from super wet Fall and Spring dumps to cold smoke-bring a snorkel sub zero champagne pow.

They do fairly well on ice as well with me wishing I had studs or my chains on only a handful of times. All that said, because of the mode my vehicle is in right now, full time expedition, I keep a set of chains in a box in the cab of my truck ready to go with a pair of heavy gloves nearby.

So maybe there is a better tire out there for snow, I tend to stick with something like a tire when it works as well as the KO's.

Good luck in your search!

 

[UK4X4]

snow....none here but I did work in CO for a year !

and this was the comute to work 3 times a week for the whole winter

Some days with fresh in the morning some solid ice and as the season wore on ice snow and slush depending on the sun.

I used bfg MT's for the whole time- because they were on the truck

The disco with perm 4wd and traction control was a safer bet than my issued dodge 4wd pickup, the light rear on the truck made cornering and accelerating quite interesting.

The disco by comparison was smooth and controlable.

Would I have been better with the Hakka's.....on ice road days probably yes

But when the snow was deep and wet I was happy I had the MT's to plow through, especially on the gravel road parts where the heavy trucks would break through the ice layer

specially when you end up in the verge, the hakka,s would not dig deep enough.

So where does that leave you.......it depends on the truck, the type of 4wd system it has, the experience of the driver, the type of snow

etc etc, there is no perfect fit

My back up was chains shovels and sleeping bags and food just in case

after I got stuck here

with nothing but a hammer and dog bowl in early winter
diff high on solid ice and not a tree in sight, after the wife followed snowmobile tracks

 

[Harald Hansen]

I live in Norway. I've used Nokian Hakkapelittas on my passenger cars. I currently have Cooper Discoverer M+S studded on the Discovery, as it was the only tyre available locally in 245/75R16, which was the dimension I wanted. I would not run them without studs.

Real winter tyres have soft compounds to grip better, and will of course not wear as well as BFG A/Ts. If you're looking for milage in a winter tyre, you'll quickly be trading away snow and ice grip for milage. Not a good trade-off, IMHO.

I would go with the tyres marketed specifically to the Scandinavian market and, in later years, to Russia. These include Nokian, Michelin X-Ice, Bridgestone Blizzak and others.

 

[thecriscokid]

I am a firm believer of a dedicated snow tire for the winter months if you are driving at higher speeds, commuting, or simply near other cars.
I have driven the BFG AT's in the snow. They were not new (prob 4yrs old w/ 40k miles on them) I realize that the tire wear had some influence, but I would not and did not go through the winter with them. A fresh set and some chains, Maybe??
I currently have BFG MT KM2's and they struggle for traction in everything except fresh snow with mud/ soft dirt below. NO chance of driving them safely at highway speeds.
I just pulled the KM2's off and I am debating putting them back on in the spring. Maybe go back to the AT (for those occasional winter travels and all around)
I have also driven all types of dedicated snow tires and even the cheapest set perform far better than any AT that I have driven on.
For the past winter I got the Yoko Geo IT GO72 in a 285. Breaking performance is incredible! That's the #1 factor that I look for.
I feel like you could easily pic up a cheap set of snows (studded or not) and a used set of wheels for far less than the cost of a replacement fender...

Just my $.02

 

[Cackalak Han]

criscokid - Just FYI, BFG KO's performance dramatically declines at 40k miles (or at half tread). Nowhere near "new" performance. I plan to sell mine at 30-40k or half tread for a fresh new set.

 

[336wheeler]

Some of this is a little hard to discern... had a hell of a time trying to get the excel file to paste right... so here it is: The toyos at the bottom are marked because that's what I have right now. Prices are approximations.



TREAD DEPTH SIZE HEIGHT WIDTH LOAD PRICE SNOWFLAKE

#1 16.5/32" 285/75R16 32.68 11.34 D $178 NO


#2 17/32" 285/75R16 32.8 11.4 D $217 YES


#3 18/32" 255/85R16 33.21 10.04 D $160 NO


#4 17/32" 285/75R16 32.7 11.3 D $163 NO


#5 18/32" 285/75R16 32.8 11.3 E $200 YES


#6 16/32" 265/75R16 31.7 10.5 D $150 NO








Nitto Terra Grappler #1

BFGoodrich All Terrain T/A KO #2

Cooper Discoverer S/T #3

Toyo Open Country A/T #4

Goodyear Wrangler Duratrac #5

***Toyo Open Country A/T #6