Winch; front, rear, both? Fixed or movable?

mk216v

mk216v

Der Chef der Fahrzeuge
Building a new F350/flatbed camper. Won't be a daily driver, so all adventure "gear", as in at least 1 winch, will be staying on the truck at all times. I've been pretty set on aftermarket front bumper(Warn Ascent) w/ bull bar for better approach angle, some animal strike protection, more lighting. So figured I'd mount a 12.5k winch in it.
And was dreaming about a fixed rear (probably 9.5k, with snatch block the double pull will be fine) winch as well.

But in discussion with overland friends, the topic branched out to;
--Why a front winch like everyone does, especially if there's a greater need for self recovery vs recovering others?
--Wouldn't a rear winch make more sense for self-recovery(ie driving into something and need to winch yourself back out), and if I needed to recover someone else I just turn the truck around?
--And then what about fixed(front and/or rear) vs movable(ie ability to move a single winch on a plate, lets say single 9.5k, from the front hitch receiver to a rear hitch receiver)?

-Dual winches add more weight(figure a 2nd winch is an add'l 100lbs), add more cost(especially if needing to have a custom fixture built in the rear to hold rear winch).
-Single winch saves some weight(about 100lbs), saves some cost.
-Movable saves some weight(although again for me, I'll always have at least 1, if not 2, winches on the truck, so it's either 100lbs or 200lbs), and saves some cost(can just install the front and/or rear winch in a front and/or rear hitch receiver). (note; only other thread I found regarding this topic; https://expeditionportal.com/forum/threads/removable-winch-mount-in-bumper.189021/#post-2419981)
-Fixed adds weight(possibly 100lbs more if adding 2nd winch), but means no hassle and no lugging a heavier winch/plate around in times of emergency or peril.

Looking forward to thoughts, especially from those who have/had dual winches, rear winch only, and/or movable winches. Thanks all!
 
Metcalf

Metcalf

Expedition Leader
mk216v said:
Building a new F350/flatbed camper. Won't be a daily driver, so all adventure "gear", as in at least 1 winch, will be staying on the truck at all times. I've been pretty set on aftermarket front bumper(Warn Ascent) w/ bull bar for better approach angle, some animal strike protection, more lighting. So figured I'd mount a 12.5k winch in it.
And was dreaming about a fixed rear (probably 9.5k, with snatch block the double pull will be fine) winch as well.

But in discussion with overland friends, the topic branched out to;
--Why a front winch like everyone does, especially if there's a greater need for self recovery vs recovering others?
--Wouldn't a rear winch make more sense for self-recovery(ie driving into something and need to winch yourself back out), and if I needed to recover someone else I just turn the truck around?
--And then what about fixed(front and/or rear) vs movable(ie ability to move a single winch on a plate, lets say single 9.5k, from the front hitch receiver to a rear hitch receiver)?

-Dual winches add more weight(figure a 2nd winch is an add'l 100lbs), add more cost(especially if needing to have a custom fixture built in the rear to hold rear winch).
-Single winch saves some weight(about 100lbs), saves some cost.
-Movable saves some weight(although again for me, I'll always have at least 1, if not 2, winches on the truck, so it's either 100lbs or 200lbs), and saves some cost(can just install the front and/or rear winch in a front and/or rear hitch receiver). (note; only other thread I found regarding this topic; https://expeditionportal.com/forum/threads/removable-winch-mount-in-bumper.189021/#post-2419981)
-Fixed adds weight(possibly 100lbs more if adding 2nd winch), but means no hassle and no lugging a heavier winch/plate around in times of emergency or peril.

Looking forward to thoughts, especially from those who have/had dual winches, rear winch only, and/or movable winches. Thanks all!
Click to expand...

For me, a front winch first seems to work the best all around if I only had to pick one. Generally, I am trying to go in the direction the vehicle is pointed. Sometimes when trying to go up VERY difficult obstacles, it really helps to have the winch on the front end helping to keep the vehicle from going over backwards.

The rear winch only idea can get a little bit funky. I do think it is harder to control where the vehicle is going since the steering axle is on the opposite side of the vehicle. If someone behind me is stuck, I usually just pull them out with a strap. I just drove through it so they probably aren't super stuck. If they flopped over, turning the vehicle around isn't a huge deal, it doesn't happen all the time.

The moveable winch concept is nice in theory, but I was very soured on it years back in practical application. Mr Murphy always seems to make sure the winch is on the opposite end of the vehicle as you need. Moving the winch on flat level ground is one thing, moving it in a snow storm on the side of an icy mountain road is another. Just imagine standing on an ice skating ring and doing overhead presses with 100lbs. Sound fun? Most 2" receivers are also not really rated for pulling with a winch, especially at high angles.

The best all around system I have seen is the Foers Vector winch system. The short version, The winch is mounted in the middle of the vehicle. The winch line is run rearward to the rear bumper where it goes around a removeable pulley and then to the front of the vehicle through or along the frame rail. The primary function of the system was pulling from the front, but the winch could also double line to the rear without having to re-rig anything. You could also pull from both ends and pretty extreme angles too.

Dual winches for self suffecient travel could be nice. If the same winch could be used on both ends that also means some redundancy if needed. Doing things like changing to synthetic line can lower the weight of the winch a lot. ComeUp has a 66lb 12K winch.
 
mk216v

mk216v

Der Chef der Fahrzeuge
Metcalf said:
For me, a front winch first seems to work the best all around if I only had to pick one. Generally, I am trying to go in the direction the vehicle is pointed. Sometimes when trying to go up VERY difficult obstacles, it really helps to have the winch on the front end helping to keep the vehicle from going over backwards.

The rear winch only idea can get a little bit funky. I do think it is harder to control where the vehicle is going since the steering axle is on the opposite side of the vehicle. If someone behind me is stuck, I usually just pull them out with a strap. I just drove through it so they probably aren't super stuck. If they flopped over, turning the vehicle around isn't a huge deal, it doesn't happen all the time.

The moveable winch concept is nice in theory, but I was very soured on it years back in practical application. Mr Murphy always seems to make sure the winch is on the opposite end of the vehicle as you need. Moving the winch on flat level ground is one thing, moving it in a snow storm on the side of an icy mountain road is another. Just imagine standing on an ice skating ring and doing overhead presses with 100lbs. Sound fun? Most 2" receivers are also not really rated for pulling with a winch, especially at high angles.

The best all around system I have seen is the Foers Vector winch system. The short version, The winch is mounted in the middle of the vehicle. The winch line is run rearward to the rear bumper where it goes around a removeable pulley and then to the front of the vehicle through or along the frame rail. The primary function of the system was pulling from the front, but the winch could also double line to the rear without having to re-rig anything. You could also pull from both ends and pretty extreme angles too.

Dual winches for self suffecient travel could be nice. If the same winch could be used on both ends that also means some redundancy if needed. Doing things like changing to synthetic line can lower the weight of the winch a lot. ComeUp has a 66lb 12K winch.
Click to expand...

Thanks for your feedback.

"Trying to go in the direction you're pointed", meaning you'd like to obviously continue going that direction, so if you can winch yourself thru any obstacles to continue going in the same direction, all the better.
Winch on front to keep the vehicle from tipping backwards; makes sense, although perhaps a bit extreme for most.

I can agree with you on the rear winch and difficulty in not directing the pull-to direction as easily via the steering wheel, but you can to a smaller degree.

Haha, oh Mr. Murphy, such a funny guy isn't he? ;)
I can picture your ice skating with a 100lb brick pretty darn well, doesn't sound so enjoyable.

Interesting on Foer's Vector winch system.

Agreed on synthetic winch line for sure; weight and safety. Which ComeUp 12K did you find at 66lbs total? The 12.5RS is ~90lbs all in; http://shop.comeupusa.com/p/seal-slim-12-5rs-12v-winch?pp=12
 
rayra

rayra

Expedition Leader
I'm working up a movable setup on my Suburban. But mostly because I don't want it mounted most of the time as my vehicle is my daily driver here in Los Angeles. I've already got most of the heavy wiring in place already. Have just recently started acquiring the rest of the parts. Working on wiring extensions / SB175 power plug mounting next. Just got my synthetic rope and aluminum plate hawse / fairlead.
See my build topic for the wiring background and current parts buying and future implementation. Definitely a low-budget build, don't come looking for sechsy big money spent.
Going with a CURT front receiver hitch.
 
mk216v

mk216v

Der Chef der Fahrzeuge
rayra said:
I'm working up a movable setup on my Suburban. But mostly because I don't want it mounted most of the time as my vehicle is my daily driver here in Los Angeles. I've already got most of the heavy wiring in place already. Have just recently started acquiring the rest of the parts. Working on wiring extensions / SB175 power plug mounting next. Just got my synthetic rope and aluminum plate hawse / fairlead.
See my build topic for the wiring background and current parts buying and future implementation. Definitely a low-budget build, don't come looking for sechsy big money spent.
Going with a CURT front receiver hitch.
Click to expand...

Awesome, will check it out! Makes a lot of sense for movable when your rig is a daily and no need to be hauling the extra 100lbs + recovery gear bag every day.

On another vehicle (SUV w/ main vehicle battery located under driver seat), since there's no easy provisions at all for a front mounted winch, nor even front mounted hitch receiver, I have a ComeUp winch/plate mounted in the rear hitch receiver w/ Anderson connectors. Then in the driver's rear footwell, I have a pigtail w/ Anderson connectors exiting the main battery box. Then in also in the vehicle I have an extension lead (Anderson connectors on both sides). When I need to winch from the rear, I roll the left rear window down, connect the extension lead from left rear footwell to the rear winch. Easy wiring.

PS--When I was looking at front hitch receivers for my truck, I first thought of Curt. But oddly the Curt for my F350 sits BELOW the bottom of the front bumper, completely fouling any sort of possible front departure angle. I think a Google search turned up another brand, EcoHitch or something, maybe even on e-trailer.com(very informative/helpful site!), where the front hitch receiver exited just below the main bumper cap, out of the lower bumper grille opening--much better approach angle. All of this to say, make sure the Curt for your Suburban isn't ~2" off the ground.
 
rayra

rayra

Expedition Leader
There's a couple members here who have mounted one of them and discovered they could flip the center portion (the receiver crossbar) and gain 4"++ of height in the receiver.

I'd think a trailer hitch shop would either adapt something for your vehicle or make a bolt-in front receiver that tucks up high.

I have seen such extension cables as you describe, works well enough. When I started planning all my desired electrical mods I decided early on to hardwire the 1/0 cabling to the rear for the winch and then decided to use it as a common bus for a whole bunch of purposes. My power box in the back provides all sorts of connections and voltages and I have a 1000W inverter back there as well. And last year I integrated rooftop solar as well to the rear setup and I'm basically back-feeding my under-hood Aux battery thru that 1/0 cabling run.

eta it was AA1PR, his flipped setup is pic #6 in the customer pics on the Amazon page for it

Amazon.com: CURT 31302 2-Inch Front Receiver Hitch, Select Cadillac, Chevrolet, GMC Trucks, SUVs: Automotive

Buy CURT 31302 2-Inch Front Receiver Hitch, Select Cadillac, Chevrolet, GMC Trucks, SUVs: Front Mount Receiver Hitch - Amazon.com ✓ FREE DELIVERY possible on eligible purchases
www.amazon.com

it's buried somewhere deep in his build topic
www.expeditionportal.com

AA1PR’s Yukon Long Term Build & Adventure Videos 56K

AA1PR’s Yukon Long Term Build & Adventure w/VIDEOS I am not, nor will I pay $400 a year to photobucket so my build thread sadly has no photos OK so here is my rig, not as nice as a lot of your's on here but it is my work in progress. Don’t laugh it’s paid for. I call her “Psyche” & will...
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Buliwyf

Buliwyf

Viking with a Hammer
Front with the Warn bumper is exactly the route I'm taking, if/when I add a camper.

We're always trying to move weight forward. Adding weight to the rear bumper is not going to help.

For winter or a canada trip, I'm considering an extra spare like this:
Front-Spare-Tire-Karen.jpg


Although a little ''supply trailer'' with bikes, 80g tank of gas, ez up, and both spares is on the table as well.
 
Last edited:
shenrie

shenrie

^^^ hates cars
We have our 12k on a home made caddy. It resides on a curt front receiver, but has only been used in the back. The curt receiver iirc is only rated at 9500, so pulling a 10,600 lb van out of a stuck concerns me, but we don’t really take a lot of chances when out solo. We wheel with a group normally for safety’s sake. I’ve been tugged out via recovery strap with the curt hitch a handful of times, no apparent issues thus far.

The winch has been used in the rear for other stuck rigs and pulling big logs up to the road for wood gathering. Proven quite handy from a work aspect but no real world pulling myself out of a mess. Works really well with the high idle feature the van came with.

As someone else mentioned moving it from front to back could be an issue in itself if footing wasn’t perfect. Sum ********** is a heavy unit for sure.

Only real drawback I’ve noticed is the positive connection on my pole connector in the rear is eroding away. I was told there’s no real way to stop that from happening. When I replace it I’ll be installing a shutoff switch near the battery.

Another plus is being able to use the winch on other vehicles. I made a set of jumper cables that has a pole connector for vehicles that aren’t wired. Been a pretty handy feature. Even being able to jump start another rig from my driveway from the back of the van without having to start and move the cold blooded ********** has made the setup pretty versatile, lol.
 
Rovertrader

Rovertrader

Supporting Sponsor
Well, from my experience:
-permanent front and rear are most secure and solid, especially for solo travel.
-the removable/portable option is poor at best. They do ‘so so‘ in a straight line pull, but really do not like any sort of sideways pull. And remember, again solo, if you are headed down a trail, there is nothing directly ahead or behind you, so some sort of angled pull will be necessary. Also, while storage is at a premium, now find a place to securely store a 100# brick!!
-the winch is recovery, aka can be critical, so I encourage the absolute best system to ensure function when it is needed.
-your rig, which sounds awesome, will likely push over 12k pounds, so a 100# piece of critical kit isn’t even a consideration IMHO.
-lastly, all of the above is vital if traveling solo remotely. Conversely, if only gravel single track, forest roads, etc- shag it all...
Just my 2c.
 
Paredneck

Paredneck

Observer
If you don’t already go follow go2xplr on Instagram. He had a really nice rear winch mount made. He runs a front and rear. If running two I would go at least 12k for both since your truck is likely to be close to 9k when finished.
 
Paredneck

Paredneck

Observer
I think dual winches would add close to 200lbs once you factor in a proper rear winch mount too. Just one more thing to think about lol
 
Metcalf

Metcalf

Expedition Leader
RAM5500 CAMPERTHING

RAM5500 CAMPERTHING

OG Portal Member #183
A lot of factors here...

Generally speaking, a rear winch would most definitely be the most useful if you only had one...

Majority of the time front winches are for helping others, rear winches are for helping yourself. Of course oddball scenarios pop up, but...

Worrying about 100lbs to add a freaking WINCH and possibly save **************** is a silly moot point in the grand scheme of things in my opinion.

Hitch mounted winches seems good in theory, but moving those around when youre stuck and in the poop just doesn't work as planned.

I'll be installing a 16.5 in the rear of mine, and a 12k in the front.

20 years doing this, 95% of the time folks are stuck they are getting pulled out or strapped out from behind, backwards

Do more research on the Warn winches bumpers. I have 2 friends that have broken them on F150s, and they stick out an ungodly amount.

This is one of those critical things saving $ and weight shouldn't apply to. To the best of my knowledge, ARB is the ONLY front bumper made that is actually airbag CERTIFIED (a big difference to "compatible")

Buckstop is about as tough as it gets for animal strikes and having had 3 close calls with animals bigger than my truck up north, the decision is a no brainer for me.

My .02
 
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