Would like your thoughts and ideas...Roadtrek

[lblampman]

Greetings,

Typical story...I read the forums here for awhile, then joined up (back in Oct of 2008), and now I'd like to get some ideas from the folks here since there's a wealth of knowledge amongst the posters here. I've learned much already! Probably enough to know not to post my question but what are you gonna do...

I've got a 1992 Roadtrek 190 Popular on a Dodge B350 1-ton van with a 360 V-8. I love the van and I picked it up on a proverbial "deal you can't refuse" basis last year. It's perfect for us and I like driving it enough that it's become our second car (the one I drive). It's in overall great shape, the engine runs really nicely and all I've really had to do was redo all the brakes. I'm working on replacing some of the front end components now, with 129,000 miles on the odometer I think some things are getting a bit worn.

But...y'all are a bad influence (in a good way)! Reading all the trip reports here and about the fantastic builds makes my wife and I want to get out and explore even more. And off the beaten path too. I'm not thinking real "off road" stuff but definitely Baja, southern Utah, Colorado, forest service roads and the like here in the Pacific Northwest; the sorts of places where the roads are not paved and a bit of "off pavement" capability would be nice. That's not the Roadtrek in its present form with the tanks and whatnot under the van and standard sized tires mounted (basically, not a lot of ground clearance).

I understand (I think) that it would be a bearcat to turn this into a 4x4 (the Dodge van not being a good candidate). But is there an easy way (relatively speaking) to gain some ground clearance to allow a bit of off pavement travel with this chassis. I've tried to research this but I think I'm in that "don't know enough to ask the right questions" situation. When I do an Internet search on this subject I get way more than I can decipher.

So, all-in-all, a project I should just shelve (though I'd really hate to sell this van and have to find something else), or is there some hope for a solution? In my (admittedly naive) thoughts I envision larger tires (how to fit them?), maybe a differential lock (worth it?), and perhaps a winch to help if we do get stuck.

Thanks for reading this far (didn't mean for it to get so long!), and thanks in advance for any/all thoughts you might have on this.

All the best,

Les
Whidbey Island, WA

 

[chet]

sounds like a nice rig. Does the dodge van have coil springs in the front? you could fit some spring spacers up front and a lift block in the back and some bigger tires will get you most places you would want to take a van. Also consider looking underneath and skidplating anything low hanging and important as with most long wheelbase rigs they can hang up alot.

a winch would be a good idea, mounted on a nice bumper. A locker is alright as long as its a selectable like an ARB as road driving with a permanent locker like a detroit really changes.

 

[ntsqd]

My mom & her husband had about that year 2WD Dodge based Roadtrek. They drove it all over the West, including a fair number of dirt road miles. It's been to New Brunswick and to Alaska. They now have a GM based Roadtrek that hasn't been nearly as good to them. To gain the same clearance that the Dodge had they had a local 4X4 shop perform a mild lift on it.

I would look into if the vans use the same front suspension as do the 2wd pick-up trucks. You may need to find someone with Hollander Interchange access to determine this. If they do then any suspension lift parts made for those trucks will work for you.

 

[lblampman]

sounds like a nice rig. Does the dodge van have coil springs in the front? you could fit some spring spacers up front and a lift block in the back and some bigger tires will get you most places you would want to take a van. Also consider looking underneath and skidplating anything low hanging and important as with most long wheelbase rigs they can hang up alot.

a winch would be a good idea, mounted on a nice bumper. A locker is alright as long as its a selectable like an ARB as road driving with a permanent locker like a detroit really changes.

Hi Chet,

Yes sir, the front suspension is coil springs. I'll see what I can find on the spacers and I guess I also need to find out what that does to the alignment and steering components (as far as geometry) as well.

Because the van as an underbody storage area at the rear (just behind the fuel tank) and that covers the frame rails a trailer hitch was never installed on this van. So apparently when a PO wanted to pull something they used one of those U-Haul type clamp-on bumper hitches, which tweaked the bumper and let a couple of large dimples. So I had thought about changing the rear bumper our for more of a truck stlye. That might be a good reason to change out the front bumper as well in order to mount a winch.

Thanks for the tip on the locker; I was a bit familiar with the ARB and Detroit names but I wasn't aware of the difference in being able to control the ARB versus the Detroit model. Good stuff.

Les

 

[lblampman]

My mom & her husband had about that year 2WD Dodge based Roadtrek. They drove it all over the West, including a fair number of dirt road miles. It's been to New Brunswick and to Alaska. They now have a GM based Roadtrek that hasn't been nearly as good to them. To gain the same clearance that the Dodge had they had a local 4X4 shop perform a mild lift on it.

I would look into if the vans use the same front suspension as do the 2wd pick-up trucks. You may need to find someone with Hollander Interchange access to determine this. If they do then any suspension lift parts made for those trucks will work for you.

Thanks for the info! Good to hear your mom and her husband had such good times with their Roadtrek and got off the beaten track with it.

I did wonder if the vans and the trucks used the same front components but that's a bit where I'm struggling at the moment trying to sort out which had what when. If someone knows here on the Portal that will be great, if not maybe I'll get a hold of a Haynes or Chilton manual for the trucks and compare it with the manuals I have for the van.

I'm coming to all this info a bit later in life (in my 50's) and while I've done a lot of mechanical work it hasn't been on automobiles so I don't have much background to draw from with regard to knowing all the in's and out's of various makes and models and how they were equipped. Or how best to enhance their capabilities. I sure appreciate the insights and help.

Les

 

[HMR]

Les,
Some good advice so far. I owned 2, 15 passenger, Dodge Vans (non-conversion) for a little business I used to have. Those things are bulletproof! Keep in mind, you can travel from Deadhorse, AK to the Darian Gap in a stock 2WD Roadtrek. 4WD and/or lockers are nice but not necessary. Heck, the locals I've seen in much of Mexico, Central and South America are driving beater Nissan Sentras everywhere on dirt roads. IMO- The biggest problem with van conversions, trailers, truck campers, etc. is not ground clearance or traction but the beating they take from vibration on washboard roads. Pliers, screwdrivers and duct tape are necessary tools. Have fun and post some pics!

PS- Here's a link for a couple traveling the Western Hemishpere in a 2WD Ford E190 conversion.

 

[ntsqd]

The Hollander Interchange Manual or it's online version is going to be the best resource for figuring out if the spindles are the same. A Hollander manual is basically an index of what item was used on which vehicles. You might imagine that the listing for a 350c.i./5.7l engine is quite extensive, but the listing for the DeLorean door hinges probably isn't. All of that sort of thing is in those books or database.

 

[lblampman]

Les,
Some good advice so far. I owned 2, 15 passenger, Dodge Vans (non-conversion) for a little business I used to have. Those things are bulletproof! Keep in mind, you can travel from Deadhorse, AK to the Darian Gap in a stock 2WD Roadtrek. 4WD and/or lockers are nice but not necessary. Heck, the locals I've seen in much of Mexico, Central and South America are driving beater Nissan Sentras everywhere on dirt roads. IMO- The biggest problem with van conversions, trailers, truck campers, etc. is not ground clearance or traction but the beating they take from vibration on washboard roads. Pliers, screwdrivers and duct tape are necessary tools. Have fun and post some pics!

PS- Here's a link for a couple traveling the Western Hemishpere in a 2WD Ford E190 conversion.

Thank you! I'll tell you first that I've been following your thread on the Provan Tiger you're updating (restoring?). What a nice project.

I guess I need more faith in the Roadtrek. When I crawled under there to do the brakes (I had to remove the rear axles (and hence the differential cover) to change the outer axle seals) it just didn't seem like there was much room between the ground and the bottom of the rig. Maybe there's more than I think.

I was mostly concerned about deeply rutted roads so that made me think I might what some taller tires on there for a bit more clearance. Which made me think I might need to provide body clearance for the larger tires.

Thanks too for the link; I found that one a few weeks ago (they're a bad influence too! ) but had lost track of it. There is a LOT there to read.

Les

 

[lblampman]

The Hollander Interchange Manual or it's online version is going to be the best resource for figuring out if the spindles are the same. A Hollander manual is basically an index of what item was used on which vehicles. You might imagine that the listing for a 350c.i./5.7l engine is quite extensive, but the listing for the DeLorean door hinges probably isn't. All of that sort of thing is in those books or database.

Ah (the light comes on), thanks for the explanation and the information. Time to do some research.

Les

 

[wrcsixeight]

I've got an '89 Dodge B250 conversion van I turned into a camper. I did remove all the ground effect skirts within six months.

I have taken it to the Tip of Baja, and have may hundreds of miles of washboard on it in other trips.

I have found I needed all the ground clearance I had. Many places the Differential was digging a groove in the soft sand. This is with the stock sized 235/75/15 tires. In many places I found the front and rear bumper clearances could have used some help as well.

The Coil spring spacers are a good idea. If you are going that far, spend another 100 dollars and get new coil springs as well. They tire out even faster on a Roadtrek. On the rear you can put on shorter leaf spring shackles to gain some ride height. I think the Roadtreks already come with rear airbags?

I also have an open Differential. I would love to have a limited slip, or even a locker. I could definitely have used it a number of times. But I am also amazed at the conditions I have been able to drive out of, or through. With so much weight over the drive axle, the traction is surprisingly good as long as you don't have to turn hard. It's all about momentum, and knowing when to Air down the tires, and having the ability to refill them yourself. And knowing the vehicle's limitations. I got stuck numerous times but never required assistance.

For Baja, tire quality is very important. I had a heavily worn pair of Michelins on the front, and new noname brand on the back when I Started out. The Michelins(passenger not LT) made it without a puncture, but I went through about 6 tires on the rear, buying used ones at tiny towns in between and laughing as the Mexicans used a sledge hammer on the rims to get them into workable shape after a high speed blow outs on washboard. I also brought 2 spares, which saved me more than once.

 

[lblampman]

I've got an '89 Dodge B250 conversion van I turned into a camper. I did remove all the ground effect skirts within six months.

I have taken it to the Tip of Baja, and have may hundreds of miles of washboard on it in other trips.

I have found I needed all the ground clearance I had. Many places the Differential was digging a groove in the soft sand. This is with the stock sized 235/75/15 tires. In many places I found the front and rear bumper clearances could have used some help as well.

The Coil spring spacers are a good idea. If you are going that far, spend another 100 dollars and get new coil springs as well. They tire out even faster on a Roadtrek. On the rear you can put on shorter leaf spring shackles to gain some ride height. I think the Roadtreks already come with rear airbags?

I also have an open Differential. I would love to have a limited slip, or even a locker. I could definitely have used it a number of times. But I am also amazed at the conditions I have been able to drive out of, or through. With so much weight over the drive axle, the traction is surprisingly good as long as you don't have to turn hard. It's all about momentum, and knowing when to Air down the tires, and having the ability to refill them yourself. And knowing the vehicle's limitations. I got stuck numerous times but never required assistance.

For Baja, tire quality is very important. I had a heavily worn pair of Michelins on the front, and new noname brand on the back when I Started out. The Michelins(passenger not LT) made it without a puncture, but I went through about 6 tires on the rear, buying used ones at tiny towns in between and laughing as the Mexicans used a sledge hammer on the rims to get them into workable shape after a high speed blow outs on washboard. I also brought 2 spares, which saved me more than once.

Thanks for all the great info! I'm beginning to feel a little less crazy than I thought I was when I made my original post, it sounds like the RT wouldn't do all that badly.

My stock tires are 225/75R16. Does anyone know if there's an easy way to find out what the tallest tire that will fit on a stock B350 is? I'm sure the info is tucked away in some forum somewhere on the 'net but I'm not sure how to tease it out.

I'll look into the coil spacers and new coils...and the rear does not have the airbags though I've seen the kit online. And sounds like a good air compressor should be on the list as well.

And good tires. I'll remember that when I start shopping for new ones. The fronts aren't too bad now but the rears are probably due. I may just bite the bullet and get four new high quality ones; I need a new spare anyway since the one in the van now is no good.

I'll also have to research the ARB locker. When I did the rear axle seals I found out I have the "corporate" 9.25 rear end and not the HD 1-ton Dana; don't know whether there's a locker available for my differential or not.

Les

 

[wrcsixeight]

Here is a good Dodge B van Specific Forum:
http://www.dodgetalk.com/forums/forumdisplay.php?f=278

One of my Next modifications will be new front coil springs. Mine are old enough to drink, and more tired than the German woman in 'Blazing Saddles'. I don't think I will add the spacers though.

Here is a link by a guy who replaced just his front coil springs on a Dodge road trek and gained 2 inches.
http://mrpulldown.blogspot.com/2009/11/road-trek-lifting-94-dodge-van.html

I added some Firestone Riderite Air bags to my rear suspension and with 100 PSI in them, It raises the back by just over 4 inches compared 0 psi. % psi is the minimum, and 100 PSi is not really comfortable for offroading type driving. They were easy to install on mine, but I hear it is a nightmare just replacing shocks on a Roadtrek due to the lowered floor and extra tanks. And don't believe the 'No drill' Claim of the advertisement. Unless you think self drilling sheet metal bolts don't need a pilot hole.

There are lockers available for the Chrysler 9.25. The pinion bearings are known weak spots with these otherwise fairly robust 3/4 ton axles due to insufficient lubrication. Use synthetic.

 

[lblampman]

Here is a good Dodge B van Specific Forum:
http://www.dodgetalk.com/forums/forumdisplay.php?f=278

One of my Next modifications will be new front coil springs. Mine are old enough to drink, and more tired than the German woman in 'Blazing Saddles'. I don't think I will add the spacers though.

Here is a link by a guy who replaced just his front coil springs on a Dodge road trek and gained 2 inches.
http://mrpulldown.blogspot.com/2009/11/road-trek-lifting-94-dodge-van.html

I added some Firestone Riderite Air bags to my rear suspension and with 100 PSI in them, It raises the back by just over 4 inches compared 0 psi. % psi is the minimum, and 100 PSi is not really comfortable for offroading type driving. They were easy to install on mine, but I hear it is a nightmare just replacing shocks on a Roadtrek due to the lowered floor and extra tanks. And don't believe the 'No drill' Claim of the advertisement. Unless you think self drilling sheet metal bolts don't need a pilot hole.

There are lockers available for the Chrysler 9.25. The pinion bearings are known weak spots with these otherwise fairly robust 3/4 ton axles due to insufficient lubrication. Use synthetic.

Wow! More great info!:26_7_2: Thanks for those links, I'll check them out.

Good stuff on the coils and air bags too. It's sounding like I'll be able to get the RT to go most (if not all) of the places we'd like to go. I'm not an offroader, even in a Jeep, Tacoma, or such I'd have to learn how to do it so I'm not thinking of trying that type of "wheeling" in the Roadtrek by any stectch of the imagination!

I am running synthetic in the differential, thanks for the "heads up" on that.

Many thanks,

Les

 

[bajajoaquin]

Although the previous poster got by pretty well with passenger tires (the P reference) you should probably be sure to get LT tires when you replace yours. Make sure you have adequate load range on them, too. I'd guess D at a minimum, but you can probably read it in the manual or inside the door jamb.

 

[lblampman]

Although thr previous poster got by pretty well with passenger tires (the P reference) you should probably be sure to get LT tires when you replace yours. Make sure you have adequate load range ont them, too. I'd guess D at a minimum, but you can probably read it in the manual or inside the door jamb.

Thanks...and absolutely. I've got LT load range E tires on there now. Any suggestions as to brand and/or tread design? Would be nice for the highway manners to still be tolerable but also nice to be able to deal with mud, sand, gravel, or whatever.

Les