XPCamper and GVWR

[ZSTi]

I am considering a full-size truck with an FWC. I love Tundras, but I guess I just considered I would need at least a 3/4 ton to feel comfortable hauling the extra weight. I am thrilled to hear how well your Tundra performs. What is your MPG with this setup and do you ever wish you had a larger truck or a different drivetrain? What size tires are you running?

 

[quickfarms]

This discussion is why i drive a full size truck. I weighted it last week on the way to the suspension shop . 8,500 on the front axle and 11,500 on the rear axle. Soon to be added is a 5,000 camper, 3,000 tongue weight and a ton of stuff


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[scott7022]

In British Columbia you get a fine if your truck is over GVWR http://www.cvse.ca/references_publications/pdf/MV3231(082003)GVWR.pdf . I have been asked by BC police to drive over a scale with my half ton truck with a Hawk. I have quite a few friends who had the same experience. Fortunately I was not over GVWR.
Stefan

Good post. I keep doing research and trying to figure out how to stay legal for this very reason. I worked in job that attracted a great deal of hunters, and people with inside information, for years. Many stopped buying diesels for this reason. If it burnt coal it went through the scales even if the rear didn't sag. The other angle was FLIR cameras on the bottom of long hills. They'd yank you for hot brakes, usually for commercial but I know a few TC types that got pulled too. British Columbia seemed to be on a witch hunt for years about this. Not sure what it is like now. But when you're looking at $50,000 campers and a $50,000 truck combos getting a notice to repair is a game changer. The fine is preferable.

My SRT 10 had limo tint on all the windows but the front. Illegal in BC. I always took the fine, or made sure I got the fine as 196 bucks was preferable to removing the tint. Until that day came and the wise old officer didn't bite the "Write me up this thing takes 27.6 liters to go 100km. Do i look like I worry?" He smiled and wrote a notice to repair...

As previously posted the camper makers state the weight. But everyone knows the game is rigged. So how do you make purchase decisions in this market environment? For the love of ...VW is buying people new cars because they cheated on emissions. Significantly less potentially catastrophic than running an overloaded vehicle.

Is it too much to ask to have weights listed +/- 10% and the COG is here (red arrow). I call bull**** on design changes going past the 10% as most big companies, Alaskan/FWC, don't allow THAT much customization. I get it if it is a true custom like say a Bahn camper but even then they should be able to answer your custom build weight within 20%. It might not be perfect but it would be a better option than dropping 50 large and finding out you're over. Because when and i repeat WHEN (In Canada), at the officer's sole discretion, you get a repair order it's time to buy a bigger truck. For off-roading in wet (sinky) BC forests bigger, wider, longer is not always better.

 

[southpier]

...VW is buying people new cars because they cheated on emissions. Significantly less potentially catastrophic than running an overloaded vehicle. ...

and we do remember the rusted frame Tacoma debacle of 2010 ... who wants to have their rig fold in half coming down from the big mountain logging road?

 

[calicamper]

@elcoyote thanks for sharing your weight. Looks like it could be my rig's older brother! @overlanerd, thanks I love the way it came out (with the exception of the weight).

@RoamingRobertsons, I would pull it off to weigh it but it's not very simple. Marc insisted to almost perma-mount it because on the old pickup, the gap between the top of the roof and the bottom of the cabover would be too great. That should have reduced some of the weight of the subframe. I think I may have gotten the curb weight when I didn't have a truck bed on the back (but the airbags/suspension upgrades were done). According to KBB my '91 Pickup with a V6 (which I've heard is about the same weight as the 2.4 diesel I have in it) weighs about 2940lbs so 3300lbs with the lift, ARB bumper/compressor, on 33s doesn't seem that out of line. Even if I peg the weight of the truck at 4k (1000lbs over the curb), that's still 3000lbs for the camper/aluminum bed.

The truck handles fine, though I don't go over 60mph due to the small diesel but what worries me is the 4500lbs over the rear axle which is way over its GAWR – it's within the tire range though.

I'm just a little upset that last year, before I started the build, I was told that the camper wet would be around 1600lbs. I also just don't see how this camper can ever be marketed as suitable for a Tacoma/Tundra when it's clearly overloaded. If I knew, I would have just got an old 7.3 F250 and used that. I wonder how much a Tundra with a V2 weighs. Looking at the specs of current one they have for sale, I can't imagine that being anywhere within its GVWR range. Any other V2 owners weigh their rigs?

Here's a few more pics of the rig:

Considering stock payload ratings for the little trucks were around 1000lbs and it's not till just recently that the "mid sized" trucks are touching 1/2 ton capacity ratings 1400-1500lbs in bed. Granted that's on stock leaf springs not rigs with added leafs and stiffer sway bars.

It's fascinating to read theses rig weight threads most people are really shocked how fast their rigs gain weight. Same trend with rvs and camp trailers.

Even my racing sailboat which gets weight certified / measured at major events. Several times a yr I literally would toss everything out of the boat into a pile and only return the required mandatory gear. The stuff creep and added weight is pretty amazing.

I find that I do the same thing with our camping rig. Keeping the gear list tight and light takes some effort. Though when you start off with an empty camper that's max weight or more it really pushes the need to be super vigilant about the list of added gear.

 

[montypower]

I am considering a full-size truck with an FWC. I love Tundras, but I guess I just considered I would need at least a 3/4 ton to feel comfortable hauling the extra weight. I am thrilled to hear how well your Tundra performs. What is your MPG with this setup and do you ever wish you had a larger truck or a different drivetrain? What size tires are you running?

I wouldn't run a 3/4 or 1 ton truck with the FWC. I've owned an F250. It sucked in comparison. Steering wasn't precise, acceleration marginal, brakes moderate, handling was like driving a lumbering gorilla. That being said the Tundra needs modification to haul. Springs, Shocks, Sway Bar, Tires. But in the end it drives like a stock vehicle and handles great. The stock 38 gallon tank allows for easily traveling over 500 miles too.

Its lifetime average is 16mpg (over 45k miles). Camper has been on for 25k miles and typically 14-16mpg. Rarely will get under 14 even in 4WD on back roads. No, I do not want a larger truck. I explore and drive many rough roads and tight spaces, often requiring turning around with limited space. The Tundra is easy to maneuver and has the tightest turning circle of any full size truck (same as long bed Taco). Drivetrain is beefy. Motor is more than enough. Brakes. Suspension. Transmission. All very good. It's running 32" BFG KO2s with about 2" Lift. Plus the overall length allows it to fit in the garage with camper. No issues. Truck just works. Heading to Canada for a couple weeks.

1/2 Ton is fine if modified for the weight. Not recommended otherwise.

 

[montypower]

Manufacturer weight ratings have little to do with actual components. Study the vehicles GAWR (gross axle weight rating). It's interesting to see how many "heavy duty" trucks have a GVWR that is nearly the max GAWR. IE there is little margin if you meet or exceed the GVWR. However, vehicles like the Tundra have a GAWR that's 1,000lbs more than the GVWR. Interesting.

I also find it curious that back in the 80s Toyota had a mini truck that was rated 1 Ton. Really? With tiny brakes, 100 hp, small axle... Not to mention the Toyota Motor homes which often exceeded 7,000lbs.

My opinion is much of the ratings have less to do with actual capability and more how manufacturers want to rate their vehicles. For class ratings, warranty or whatever else. Possibly why Toyota puts passenger rated tires on the Tundra from the factory.

Personally, I prefer having the lightest full size possible (overall weight) as it drives better. Does better off road in the sand, snow, mud or rocks. My truck loaded weighs ~ 8,000 lbs (on extended trips). Stock curb weight was 5,500. Add fuel, passengers, gear and it was about 6,000lbs. Still easily 1-2,000 lbs less than many 1 tons carrying similar stuff. I've added solar, roof rack (paddle boards), 2 Mt Bikes, 17 Gallon Aux Water Tank and Camper (which lives on it full time). At some level having less weight to move is much more beneficial than just increasing truck and overall weight.

My previous Tacoma (expedition built) was in the 6,200-6,500 range. Still over the GVWR. I had a friend with a FWC on his Tacoma with proper supporting modifications and he felt it handled the weight well.

 

[quickfarms]

There is a lot more to truck design in simply GAWR and GVWR, these are just two little pieces of the puzzle. You have to look at the entire vehicle, axles, brakes, suspension, frame, tires etc.

Any truck with a GVWR of 14,000 or less is a light duty truck, class 1, 2 or 3 vehicle

A heavy duty truck has a GVWR over 26,000 and is a class 7 or 8 vehicle

 

[smlobx]

If safety is the primary concern then modify it to carry the weight.

I challenge anyone with a F250/350/550 or other heavy duty vehicle to a competition with a properly modified Tundra carrying the same load. I'll bet the braking distance, acceleration, cornering, maneuvering etc... would be better with the Tundra.......

It's too bad you're on the other side of the country because I will gladly put up my stock '16 F-350 srw up against any Toyota.
The problem with your statement is you're putting a bunch of stuff on your truck in the hopes of making it perform as well as my stock vehicle and in the end it won't!
My stock truck runs 35" tires
My brakes are much larger than what ever you could put on a tundra and therefore will stop quicker.
My diesel will out accelerate your tundra if we both have a 10,000 GVW and it will get better mileage doing it.
My fuel tank is also much larger so I can go longer...
My truck is wider that a tundra and while that may limit it on some trails the width of the vehicle will make it corner better...

I race Porsche's as a hobby and know a thing or two about handling and performance..

 

[quickfarms]

If you want the handle like a sports car than drive one.

One think I have noticed about small pickups with campers on them is they handle like ****.

Duellys do a lot better and my heavy duty, class 8 trucks, don't even feel the camper back there.

 

[GoinBoardin]

It's too bad you're on the other side of the country because I will gladly put up my stock '16 F-350 srw up against any Toyota.
The problem with your statement is you're putting a bunch of stuff on your truck in the hopes of making it perform as well as my stock vehicle and in the end it won't!
My stock truck runs 35" tires
My brakes are much larger than what ever you could put on a tundra and therefore will stop quicker.
My diesel will out accelerate your tundra if we both have a 10,000 GVW and it will get better mileage doing it.
My fuel tank is also much larger so I can go longer...
My truck is wider that a tundra and while that may limit it on some trails the width of the vehicle will make it corner better...

I race Porsche's as a hobby and know a thing or two about handling and performance..

LOL. I was wondering if anyone would bring that post up. I thought maybe we weren't allowed, because it's a Yota and we're on ExPo. It made me laugh. I've worked on an 06 Tundra enough to know they're not anything too special. Good for a half ton but a far cry from an HD truck.

 

[Overdrive]

^^X2!

My truck is wider that a tundra and while that may limit it on some trails the width of the vehicle will make it corner better...

Or maybe not wider. The Tundra is about 1/2" WIDER than a new 2500 RAM. Don't know about the Superduty. And the turning circle for a 2500 RAM is a tiny bit LESS than a Tundra.

 

[adam88]

lol @ the guy who thinks a properly modified Toyota Tundra can compete with an F550.

Yes, you're right... all you need to do to "properly modify it" is to swap an F550 chassis under the Tundra body. Easy.