mhiscox
Expedition Leader
There’s been a thread on the Unimog mailing list concerning the capabilities of some different vehicles—it started with comments about a Pinzgauer vs. a 404 Mog—and several people wrote in good information.
This afternoon, one of the Moggers, Jud Eades, wrote in with personal information covering all five of the European off-road trucks he’s had. The summary seemed quite worthwhile for those not familiar with their strengths and weaknesses, so Jud said I could post it here for general information.
Others might disagree a bit with Jud's conclusions, but overall the post was well received.
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Just thought I would add my 2 cents here about Pinz vs. Unimog vs. Volvo since I own or have owned all of them. Disclaimer! I'm not looking for a verbal fight. All of this is just my opinion some of you might feel different and that's ok with me.
1975 Volvo TGB 1111
Stock mechanically other than offset rims (2 inches) and 37 X 12.5 Goodyear MTR's.
Advantages: Best ride off road, the suspension is so cushy you can really rally it off road at high speeds without it sending you through the roof. I had oversized tires which can fit without a lift. (Stock is only 10.5 wide.) In sand it did better than all my rigs (Even better than my Diesel Mogs with 22 inch wide sand tires) In mud because it has more horse power than my other trucks it did awesome also. My employees have photos of it in big mud holes pushing water over the head lights. Water was coming up through the shift boot it was so deep. (After seeing the photos I should have killed my employees for taking it through such deep mud It also has the best top speed of all my trucks. I would imagine a 6X6 would do even a little better off road, they are geared lower and with the extra length would make it not so front heavy, but I haven't owned a 6X6 "yet."
Disadvantages: Needed lower gears for rock crawling (My oversized tires didn't help). It is front heavy so dropping off large ledges in Moab scared the crap out of me. (A couple of times the back tires came off the ground after dropping face first off a ledge) Flexed better than a pinz but not as good as a mog. The steering didn't feel really tight at high speeds, it seemed to want to wander a little. (Could have just been loose front end). With the large tires and aired down turning it at low speeds was a huge workout more than a 404 mog and more than a pinz.
1975 Pinz 712 6X6
Mechanically stock.
Advantages: Best rig for a daily driver, steering is tight, it's not too noisy, the cab doesn't seem to get as hot from the engine On hard pack dirt or rock it will go up anything (as long as you can get the bumper over it) gearing is low enough that it crawls ok. Its narrow so it fits good on skinny trails.
Disadvantages: doesn't know what articulation is! I have had it on hard trails in Moab, Utah and if there is a ledge you need to go over at an angle it will make you suck the seat cover up your butt. And that's in 6X6. A 4X4 would be worse. (I have heard they roll pretty easy). Because they are so narrow side hilling is also very scary. (I might just not know its limits but I swear I thought I was going to roll it several times) Skinny tires and being under powered made it terrible in the sand.
1968 404 Swiss Unimog
Stock
Advantages: They’re pretty inexpensive, they crawl ok, (I'm sure they would crawl awesome with the crawler gears you can buy for them) It flexes good, seems like the cheapest and easiest to buy parts for and work on. With the large bed you can haul a lot of gear.
Disadvantages: Mine had a hard time starting in really cold weather, they are super slow pulling a grade on the highway and terrible in the sand.
1983 416 Doka Unimog
Stock Mechanically
Advantages: By far the best extreme off road truck I have, power steering, tons of torque, As a stock truck it flexes better than all the others I have.You can buy tons of implements for it. Does amazing in the mud and good in the sand. This is my vehicle of choice if I'm going to be doing extreme trails.
Disadvantages: Parts are expensive, a little slower than the others, noisier than hell at high rpm's (mine is even bed lined inside and out), cab gets hot in the summer, runs and smells like a tractor.
1987 U1300L Unimog
Stock (non turbo)
Advantages: Even though it's the largest of all of mine it's the easiest to drive, quietest cab compared to all the others Goes down the road the best, plenty of power, towing capacity is sick!, great in the sand and mud. Crawls pretty good, and flexes ok. Seems to be about the same flex as the stock 404, but not as good as the 416. (could be the way all mine are set up with the springs, etc.). Power steering, great brakes, and more modern gauges and other systems.
Disadvantages: More expensive to buy than the others, parts are very expensive. Not real good in deep snow, doesn't want to float at all in soft snow. If you lose air pressure you are done, (the brakes lock shut), too big to fit on some off-road trails.
If I was forced to sell all but one of them, I would keep my 416 Doka.
Jud
Jud Eades
ARS Flood & Fire Cleanup
3120 North Main
North Logan, Utah 84341
Office 435-753-9600, Fax 435-753-9650, Cell 435-881-5153
www.arscleanup.com
This afternoon, one of the Moggers, Jud Eades, wrote in with personal information covering all five of the European off-road trucks he’s had. The summary seemed quite worthwhile for those not familiar with their strengths and weaknesses, so Jud said I could post it here for general information.
Others might disagree a bit with Jud's conclusions, but overall the post was well received.
----------------------
Just thought I would add my 2 cents here about Pinz vs. Unimog vs. Volvo since I own or have owned all of them. Disclaimer! I'm not looking for a verbal fight. All of this is just my opinion some of you might feel different and that's ok with me.
1975 Volvo TGB 1111
Stock mechanically other than offset rims (2 inches) and 37 X 12.5 Goodyear MTR's.
Advantages: Best ride off road, the suspension is so cushy you can really rally it off road at high speeds without it sending you through the roof. I had oversized tires which can fit without a lift. (Stock is only 10.5 wide.) In sand it did better than all my rigs (Even better than my Diesel Mogs with 22 inch wide sand tires) In mud because it has more horse power than my other trucks it did awesome also. My employees have photos of it in big mud holes pushing water over the head lights. Water was coming up through the shift boot it was so deep. (After seeing the photos I should have killed my employees for taking it through such deep mud It also has the best top speed of all my trucks. I would imagine a 6X6 would do even a little better off road, they are geared lower and with the extra length would make it not so front heavy, but I haven't owned a 6X6 "yet."
Disadvantages: Needed lower gears for rock crawling (My oversized tires didn't help). It is front heavy so dropping off large ledges in Moab scared the crap out of me. (A couple of times the back tires came off the ground after dropping face first off a ledge) Flexed better than a pinz but not as good as a mog. The steering didn't feel really tight at high speeds, it seemed to want to wander a little. (Could have just been loose front end). With the large tires and aired down turning it at low speeds was a huge workout more than a 404 mog and more than a pinz.
1975 Pinz 712 6X6
Mechanically stock.
Advantages: Best rig for a daily driver, steering is tight, it's not too noisy, the cab doesn't seem to get as hot from the engine On hard pack dirt or rock it will go up anything (as long as you can get the bumper over it) gearing is low enough that it crawls ok. Its narrow so it fits good on skinny trails.
Disadvantages: doesn't know what articulation is! I have had it on hard trails in Moab, Utah and if there is a ledge you need to go over at an angle it will make you suck the seat cover up your butt. And that's in 6X6. A 4X4 would be worse. (I have heard they roll pretty easy). Because they are so narrow side hilling is also very scary. (I might just not know its limits but I swear I thought I was going to roll it several times) Skinny tires and being under powered made it terrible in the sand.
1968 404 Swiss Unimog
Stock
Advantages: They’re pretty inexpensive, they crawl ok, (I'm sure they would crawl awesome with the crawler gears you can buy for them) It flexes good, seems like the cheapest and easiest to buy parts for and work on. With the large bed you can haul a lot of gear.
Disadvantages: Mine had a hard time starting in really cold weather, they are super slow pulling a grade on the highway and terrible in the sand.
1983 416 Doka Unimog
Stock Mechanically
Advantages: By far the best extreme off road truck I have, power steering, tons of torque, As a stock truck it flexes better than all the others I have.You can buy tons of implements for it. Does amazing in the mud and good in the sand. This is my vehicle of choice if I'm going to be doing extreme trails.
Disadvantages: Parts are expensive, a little slower than the others, noisier than hell at high rpm's (mine is even bed lined inside and out), cab gets hot in the summer, runs and smells like a tractor.
1987 U1300L Unimog
Stock (non turbo)
Advantages: Even though it's the largest of all of mine it's the easiest to drive, quietest cab compared to all the others Goes down the road the best, plenty of power, towing capacity is sick!, great in the sand and mud. Crawls pretty good, and flexes ok. Seems to be about the same flex as the stock 404, but not as good as the 416. (could be the way all mine are set up with the springs, etc.). Power steering, great brakes, and more modern gauges and other systems.
Disadvantages: More expensive to buy than the others, parts are very expensive. Not real good in deep snow, doesn't want to float at all in soft snow. If you lose air pressure you are done, (the brakes lock shut), too big to fit on some off-road trails.
If I was forced to sell all but one of them, I would keep my 416 Doka.
Jud
Jud Eades
ARS Flood & Fire Cleanup
3120 North Main
North Logan, Utah 84341
Office 435-753-9600, Fax 435-753-9650, Cell 435-881-5153
www.arscleanup.com