jscherb
Expedition Leader
I don't know if the hinge has changed in 7 years, but ask them to send you a new set of hinges.
Morryde hinge/gate reinforcement issue
- Thread starter wandererr
- Start date
jscherb
Expedition Leader
I called MORryde to discuss this with the manager of their Jeep product line and if you get them your shipping address they'll send you a new pair of hinges.
We agreed that we wanted to eliminate your 7 year old hinges as a possible contributor to the problem, so with new hinges you'll have your new reinforcement plus new hinges - thousands of these have been installed and nobody has reported the problem you are having so if the problem still occurs with all new MORryde parts then the issue really has to be your stay rod out of spec or bent, or some other problem particular to your Jeep.
Seven years is way beyond any normal warranty period, but MORryde cares a lot about customer service and satisfaction so they agreed this is the best next step.
We agreed that we wanted to eliminate your 7 year old hinges as a possible contributor to the problem, so with new hinges you'll have your new reinforcement plus new hinges - thousands of these have been installed and nobody has reported the problem you are having so if the problem still occurs with all new MORryde parts then the issue really has to be your stay rod out of spec or bent, or some other problem particular to your Jeep.
Seven years is way beyond any normal warranty period, but MORryde cares a lot about customer service and satisfaction so they agreed this is the best next step.
Who should I reach out to? I'm currently working with Ryan.
My biggest problem is that the stop is f-ed up as after reinsertion is making grinding/popping noises.
Btw, while I partially agree with your statement about the 7 years, being quite a bit, there should be a note on the gate piece saying "your hinges need to be of certain vintage or newer before you install".
Btw, this is kind of like saying - if you install new control arms on your jeep, don't expect them to work right if your jeep is 7 years old......
My biggest problem is that the stop is f-ed up as after reinsertion is making grinding/popping noises.
Btw, while I partially agree with your statement about the 7 years, being quite a bit, there should be a note on the gate piece saying "your hinges need to be of certain vintage or newer before you install".
Btw, this is kind of like saying - if you install new control arms on your jeep, don't expect them to work right if your jeep is 7 years old......
jscherb
Expedition Leader
After my call with MORryde, I confirmed the conversation back to them in email and I included the support group in the email so all of the support staff should be aware that you will be calling to give them your mailing info. I also copied Ryan but he's in engineering, not in support, so you should contact the support folks instead of Ryan. In case they have trouble finding the email, it's from me (Jeff Scherb) and in it I confirm that Austin Conrad has authorized sending you a new set of hinges.
The reason I asked MORryde to send you a new set of hinges is to either eliminate your old hinges as the cause of the problem or to confirm that they are the problem. Based on the large number of these kits sold over the years and the fact that MORryde tells me you are the first one to have this issue, a general message in every kit probably isn't warranted. But one step at a time, let's get the new hinges installed and see where we are.
Scrib
Observer
I cannot remember if mine came out before or after I installed the MORryde hinges, but either way it is not an uncommon problem, particularly when you add weight on the tailgate. To fix it, I drilled a vertical hole through the fat end of the limiter bar and used some threaded 1/4" rod with lock nuts on each side as a "stopper" to keep the limiter from being able to pop-out through the rollers. I'd say the factory was bit "lacking" on the design of what should have been a simple part.
That's not a bad idea, but I wonder how much (knowing my luck) trouble I'm asking for by doing that. As a result the rod would be slamming against the other side of the mechanism.
jscherb
Expedition Leader
The tailgate stay rod (and BTW the tailgate hinges) have been a source of trouble for Jeep - there have been at least three versions of the stay rod released and two Technical Service Bulletins on the subject, and at least 3 versions of the hinges released and at least one TSB on those.
On early JK's with the stay rod, if the tailgate was slammed open against the stops, the hinges could bend slightly and this was often just enough to pull the stay rod out. Jeep issued at least one of the hinge variants to solve this, and it took I think two variants of the stay rod before the problem was mostly solved. The stay rod TSB's called for replacing both the stay rod and the hinges to solve the problem. At least one of the tailgate hinge TSBs was about solving the a rust problem between the hinges and the tailgate sheet metal.
Both the factory stay rod and the factory tailgate hinges are marginal designs to say the least.
So here's where I am at today. Morryde sent me replacement hinges thinking it's an issue with my hinges. I installed them and found that with the new hinges I still open close to 7 degrees past 90 degrees and the stay arm still pops out. The difference between my hinges and the new hinges is that the new hinges have some plastic "bumper" piece on the corner that limits travel a bit. Unfortunately in my case it was still not enough and I had to glue in additional piece of hard plastic into the limiter that's added to the hinge (when I have some time I'll take some detailed pictures).
So this is my summary:
1. Hinges by themselves are great. I had no issues when I was running just the hinges.
2. When I added the Morryde reinforcement brace to the tailgate, the reinforcement did/caused the following (and I haven't had a chance to address everything)
- The thick spacer that goes on the body side is too thick in my case. I can see clearly that the gate isn't sitting flush with the body - spacer is just a hair under 3/32" too thick.
- The thick spacer shifts the stay arm position. The shift in position I believe is what is making it pop out earlier in my case - had to address it with an additional limiter to make sure that the hinge does not travel even a hair over 90 degrees. Btw, in the JK the expected opening is just over 90degree to allow for the gate to fully clear the opening in order to have access to the full width for loading. This is a deficiency on the Morryde design and while it can be worked around, there should be a warning for people to be aware of potential issues.
- As I mentioned above the spacer shifts the stay arm position which affects the arc of travel and in my case it makes it interfere with a body seam inside of the body (had to remove the tail light to see it). If the spacer was even 1/8" thinner I would have cleared the lip inside of the body. I had to grind the sheet metal inside and then paint it to secure against rust. I removed just under an eight of an inch and there is no more interference. Again - deficiency on the design as it did not take into account the change in the geometry of the position of the stay rod and the way it travels. Granted - seems folks haven't complained about it, and I probably would have ignored the additional "pop" noise from opening and closing the gate if I didn't have the issues with the stay rod popping out. I can see how the stay rod could "self correct" the sheet metal interference issue as with time it would wear out (in my case it already bent out slightly) With more opening/close action, I could see it bending it as well as shaving some of the surface of the stay rod (it's coated making it "thicker) to the point that it would clear without interference (again - not how this should be addressed).
I will state this - Kudos to the Morryde folks for working with me towards resolution and many thanks for providing replacement hinges. Thumbs down for not listening to what the actual problem is. I explained the interference of the stay rod, misalignment of the gate position in relation to the body and how the geometry changed and it was ignored. My issue I believe should have been addressed with thinner spacers (I didn't want to butcher mine for experiment purposes, didn't have time to make new ones from scratch with the appropriate shape/thickness and hole placement and spacers would have been cheaper to send out then hinges). At the end when I provided the detailed report to folks at Morryde, the response was that they're glad that the new parts provided improvement for me. Frankly, the parts did not really do much - I had to glue in limiters and grind the seam inside of the body. I believe that addition of the gate reinforcement could (again, not all jeeps were created equal) cause issues for other folks as there impact of the shift of the pivot point away from the body of the jeep through addition of the spacer has a domino effect on other parts.
Anyways, if someone asks me, I will say, buy the hinges, with the gate reinforcement though buyer beware - it might require modifications outside of what you were expecting from a bolt on install.
So this is my summary:
1. Hinges by themselves are great. I had no issues when I was running just the hinges.
2. When I added the Morryde reinforcement brace to the tailgate, the reinforcement did/caused the following (and I haven't had a chance to address everything)
- The thick spacer that goes on the body side is too thick in my case. I can see clearly that the gate isn't sitting flush with the body - spacer is just a hair under 3/32" too thick.
- The thick spacer shifts the stay arm position. The shift in position I believe is what is making it pop out earlier in my case - had to address it with an additional limiter to make sure that the hinge does not travel even a hair over 90 degrees. Btw, in the JK the expected opening is just over 90degree to allow for the gate to fully clear the opening in order to have access to the full width for loading. This is a deficiency on the Morryde design and while it can be worked around, there should be a warning for people to be aware of potential issues.
- As I mentioned above the spacer shifts the stay arm position which affects the arc of travel and in my case it makes it interfere with a body seam inside of the body (had to remove the tail light to see it). If the spacer was even 1/8" thinner I would have cleared the lip inside of the body. I had to grind the sheet metal inside and then paint it to secure against rust. I removed just under an eight of an inch and there is no more interference. Again - deficiency on the design as it did not take into account the change in the geometry of the position of the stay rod and the way it travels. Granted - seems folks haven't complained about it, and I probably would have ignored the additional "pop" noise from opening and closing the gate if I didn't have the issues with the stay rod popping out. I can see how the stay rod could "self correct" the sheet metal interference issue as with time it would wear out (in my case it already bent out slightly) With more opening/close action, I could see it bending it as well as shaving some of the surface of the stay rod (it's coated making it "thicker) to the point that it would clear without interference (again - not how this should be addressed).
I will state this - Kudos to the Morryde folks for working with me towards resolution and many thanks for providing replacement hinges. Thumbs down for not listening to what the actual problem is. I explained the interference of the stay rod, misalignment of the gate position in relation to the body and how the geometry changed and it was ignored. My issue I believe should have been addressed with thinner spacers (I didn't want to butcher mine for experiment purposes, didn't have time to make new ones from scratch with the appropriate shape/thickness and hole placement and spacers would have been cheaper to send out then hinges). At the end when I provided the detailed report to folks at Morryde, the response was that they're glad that the new parts provided improvement for me. Frankly, the parts did not really do much - I had to glue in limiters and grind the seam inside of the body. I believe that addition of the gate reinforcement could (again, not all jeeps were created equal) cause issues for other folks as there impact of the shift of the pivot point away from the body of the jeep through addition of the spacer has a domino effect on other parts.
Anyways, if someone asks me, I will say, buy the hinges, with the gate reinforcement though buyer beware - it might require modifications outside of what you were expecting from a bolt on install.
jscherb
Expedition Leader
I'm very sorry neither the MORryde engineers nor I could determine what's going on with your Jeep. This seems to be a first - several thousand of these have been sold over the years and according to MORryde, this is the first issue like this they've had reported and I haven't heard of anything like this either. I will continue to discuss it with the folks at MORryde and if we have any further theories we'll pass them on.
I'll say this: I sent pictures of how the spacer is too thick and misaligns the gate to the body. I provided a detailed description up above. Not sure what discussions still need to happen: a properly aligned hinge makes the gate sit flush is a good next step... Potential solution? Thinner spacer. This shifts the rotation point towards the body and pushes the stay rod away from the seam inside the body.
jscherb
Expedition Leader
To rule out the possibility of a manufacturing error with the spacers, can you measure the spacer thickness please?
jscherb
Expedition Leader
I'll check that with MORryde engineering - yes it is hard to precisely measure without removing the hinge but 0.43 seems a little thick to me.
jscherb
Expedition Leader
I measured the spacers on my JKU and they are 0.375. I checked with MORryde engineering and that's the correct measurement.
Because it's hard to measure them precisely, could you please remove one of your spacers, measure the thickness and take a photo while you're measuring it that shows the measurement?
Because it's hard to measure them precisely, could you please remove one of your spacers, measure the thickness and take a photo while you're measuring it that shows the measurement?
So it's .396. .021 out of spec. Not a lot, but still. Eyeballing it though I think even at .375 the spacer is too thick. Look at the gap that I have.
What's frustrating is that I have sent the picture of the gap to them and indicated that even eyeballing it, the spacers look to thick based on how the hinge sits after the install.
