Dave in AZ
Active member
Tune outdoors now using a Truma propane heater setup too.
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montechie
Active member
Did you plumb your fuel tank yourself, or get an installer to do it? What type of installer (Webasto rep, RV shop)?
montechie
Active member
I'm in Montana and do the full four season thing, I focused first on insulation, since we already had a great range of sleeping bags and tent snow camp a lot already. Insulating the walls and using a double barrier/liner on the soft top definitely bumps up the retained heat a lot and makes it much better in the summer. Just that we're generally 15-20 degrees warmer in the winter than outside temps in the mornings. I spent time getting metal covered up, there's still some exposed but I'm at the point the thermal bridging I have left isn't worth the effort in a soft-top camper. It won't be cozy hanging outside the sleep gear in the morning at 0F outside, but fine for getting dressed and making coffee. I'm also adding a bed rug this afternoon which should further up the comfort.
Currently we preheat with a Mr Buddy (all the above comments apply, ventilate, have a monitor, condensation*) before bed, sometimes turn it on in the morning. *Condensation isn't that bad for us, like CO, MT is an arid state, it's been fine anywhere in the West on this side of the Pacific Crest. Our insulation is also wool, so it helps a ton with condensation management. I'm sure it wouldn't be great along the West Coast, MT can get to 70-80% in the winter, but it's still not the same.
Our biggest comfort is using a 12v blanket on top of our sleeping pad and under our bedding. It's an Ignik and works great while sipping battery. It has different timer and heat level settings. This is an underrated heat source (at least it was by me).
Eventually we'll do some form of vented heater, mainly because we want to travel with our cat and any vented heater will help dry out wet gear from skiing, this was our 2nd winter with the camper.
K9LTW
Active member
I had an installer do it. Way outside of my comfort range and something it really helps to have a lift for
I found a Webasto supplier that was really popular on the RAM Promaster forums. Granted, there’s a big difference between RAM HD trucks and the vans, but the owner was fantastic, and confident they could do it. Job done. The shop is a major installer/servicer of HVAC systems from vehicles to buildings to industrial radiators in heavy equipment. They also do custom fabrication and built the enclosure for the heater.
A van upfitter that’s local was my backup plan.
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Dave in AZ
Active member
If they were remotely the same price, I would get a Truma propane heater instead of my Vevor diesel heater. I love that diesel but... I already had diesel slosh out of the cr8ppy tank and spill all over in truckbed, my wife wouldn't get inside due to diesel fumes until I wiped it all up, having to tske the all in one apart to do so.
Also, the clicking is a big pain and noisy. Lastly I have to carry diesel too.
Dan Grec from The Road Chose Me, and a forum member here, is pretty adamant that he won't use propane for anything, but that is all due to his experience in S.America and Africa, where it is hard to get and fill because every country has its own valve connection standards and fill protocols. He is hard in support of the Coleman dual fuel sportster, which I've had for 40 years and love. But in the US, propane is available everywhere and easy to fill 5 or 10 lb bottles at way more places than Kerosene or white gas is sold. So as a guy who doesn't plan on leaving US unless its Baja, I think I prefer propane for cooking. Then in southwest, a lot of burn bans so need propane firepit. And since I already have it, that leads me to a propane heater.
My problem is the $3500 Tune wants for it, vs the $100 diesel heater...
Also, the clicking is a big pain and noisy. Lastly I have to carry diesel too.
Dan Grec from The Road Chose Me, and a forum member here, is pretty adamant that he won't use propane for anything, but that is all due to his experience in S.America and Africa, where it is hard to get and fill because every country has its own valve connection standards and fill protocols. He is hard in support of the Coleman dual fuel sportster, which I've had for 40 years and love. But in the US, propane is available everywhere and easy to fill 5 or 10 lb bottles at way more places than Kerosene or white gas is sold. So as a guy who doesn't plan on leaving US unless its Baja, I think I prefer propane for cooking. Then in southwest, a lot of burn bans so need propane firepit. And since I already have it, that leads me to a propane heater.
My problem is the $3500 Tune wants for it, vs the $100 diesel heater...
montechie
Active member
Actually more like $300 because of the multiple cheap ones I got first that failed after a single month of use, or didn't run the advertised length. Again, I'm not in the warm states and spend more nights out between Nov-April than the warm months so quality is more important and our usage higher than folks with moderate winters. Ignik's customer support has always been spot on too.
The biggest determinant will be your budget. I have a Webasto (Air Top STC2000) gas-burning heater permanently installed behind my left wheelwell. Exhaust and intake go through a hole cut in the bed, and the fuel supply is tapped right into my gas tank. But my truck is set up as a full-time camper.
In the past, for an old trailer and my RTT, we had one of Planar's portable units that I got from Expedition Upfitter. Just carried a section of high-heat ducting with me and would run the controls inside. Worked like a champ, but took up a decent amount of space and you run the risk of spilling diesel inside (if you don't have a way to carry it outside). It was also a pain to carry three fuels with me (gas, propane and diesel). If you go the portable route, I used a 3" sewage flange you can find in any RV supply or on Amazon. Cut a 3" hole in the side of your camper, file the flange so it's flush on the back, screw it on, caulk around it, and then add your ducting flange to the inside wall for the duct to attach to.
If you're averse to taking a hole saw to your shell, some folks have made wedges with a hole in them for the duct hose that fit in a slightly open side hatch.
Some folks use Mr. Buddy heaters. Me? Nope. They produce a ton of condensation, require a decent amount of fresh air so you don't pass out, and aren't really an option to just leave running. I also have a wife and two dogs I'm keeping comfortable for days at a time while camping year round
I'm about to do the same, except Espar vs Webasto only because I happen to live close to a very knowledgable Espar dealer/installer. Don't want to carry propane tank, rules out the truma.
I keep going back and forth on 2kw vs 4kw. I'm concerned that the 4kw version may be too much with mild temps and trying to sit inside where we would be close to the heater output duct.....but not too uncommon that I see single digits fall/winter and I'd hate to spend the considerable investment and realize the 2kw is insufficient. I'm currently piping heat from a portable 2kw in from the outside, never bothered to run it at anything but max.
I don't plan to run the heater all night and try to keep an even temp, more come back from wet/cold adventures and warm up, dry off, hang out before bed. Quick blast in the AM, then away fm camper for the day.
Space is obviously at premium, so favor the 2kw in that regard.
I see the the max output of the truma is higher than the 2kw, less than the 4kw gas/diesel heaters. I know the diesel heater like to be run full blast, not sure if the same carries true for the gas.
What are the coldest temps you have seen with the 2kw Webasto, happy with the choice?
Pra4sno
Member
We have a Lavaner 4kw alpine pro with auto altitude adjustment and have been happy to have the extra BTUs on a few occasions when temps get down into the low 20s. No issues with sooting and we keep it in a diy portable pelican style box. It's not permanent, but we don't need to haul around heat all year. I also use it to heat our garage on cold days when I'm working in it, so the extra BTUs come in handy for that as well.
My opinion is in a full size ovrlnd with the top popped, it's good insurance to have 4-5kw. On one of our colder days this year (-15f) I tested the heater out and on full blast was keeping the camper at 60 without a thermal pack.
Nice dry heat and having the unit portable means we don't listen to the pump click as it's outside. That being said, didn't mean to turn this thread into a heater discussion!
My opinion is in a full size ovrlnd with the top popped, it's good insurance to have 4-5kw. On one of our colder days this year (-15f) I tested the heater out and on full blast was keeping the camper at 60 without a thermal pack.
Nice dry heat and having the unit portable means we don't listen to the pump click as it's outside. That being said, didn't mean to turn this thread into a heater discussion!
K9LTW
Active member
We’ve been in 12-degrees (disgustingly humid East Coast 12-degrees) and comfortable with it set at 63. We’re insulated with 1” isopro and plywood over that. We also have the thermal pack and 1” isopro on the ceiling. BedRug and 3/4” ply on the floor. At those temps it’s running constantly to keep up (though it doesn’t even make a dent in the fuel gauge even after a couple days).
If it’s colder than that it’ll struggle to keep up. We went with the 2000 based on size, cost, and not needing more performance than that. In those temps I’m sleeping under a sheet and thin bedspread with a t-shirt and thin sweat pants. My wife crawls into her fleece sleeping bag liner then under the covers
I’m quite happy with it. Zero issues and the thermostat is sweet. Works just like your home furnace as opposed to the diesel heater we had which never actually turned off.
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dstefan
Well-known member
Yeah, they’re ridiculous. largely due to the fact that Truma won’t sell directly to consumers in the US out of litigation fears. Consumers can buy them directly in Europe and I understand they’re more reasonable there.. But, they work absolutely great.
I have found that repeating clichés such as “buy once cry once“ and “you get what you pay for“, and “happy wife, happy life” reduces the sting, but only a little!
sea_weathered
New member
Has anyone in the US ordered the Truma Varioheat from these guys? https://us-camperinteriors.glopalst...gn=cs_w&utm_medium=wi_proxy&utm_content=en_US
Yeah- I think that will be good enough. I think I'll be pleased with 40-50 degree temp differential, even into the semi rare negative temps. thanks
dstefan
Well-known member
So that’s a screaming deal in many ways if you can get it shipped to the US at a reasonable price. I’d look at the installation manual before ordering — there’s a some specific requirements. A few things to keep in mind:
This appears to be a newer variant of the Vario — the Eco. What I have and I believe @Bergger has are the Vario Comforts. The Eco looks a bit smaller, which is good, weighs less, and has two vs 3 speeds rated at 1300/2800 BTUs [Edit: Correction — This should be Watts. See Bergger’s post below] vs 4700/8900/11,500 BTUs for the larger comfort. Weirdly the gas consumption my operating manual shows is actually lower per BTUs settings than the Eco, but I suspect that can’t be right.
For a comparison, I don’t run my heater at the higher levels except on start up where automatically goes to the high setting, which warms up my camper quickly. I always turn it to the night setting which is the 4700 BTUs, most effecient, and quiet right off. However, I haven’t used it yet in the 20’s either.
That said, this looks like a great unit at a great price. All told, if it had been available, I think I might have gone for this one vs the Comfort. I think the reason not to have the ECO could be if you’re gonna be in a fair amount of really cold conditions (eg, <25º) for longer periods. Not sure how well it would compensate for the tent fabric. That said, with a good bag, I’m sure it would make it much better at even low external temp unless you have to have shirtsleeve weather inside.
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