Scott Brady
Founder
I only use the Viking Line (winchline.com). It has never failed me.
Recommendations for synthetic winch line
- Thread starter brasskey
- Start date
4WD School
Adventurer
Same here. I use it on all of my vehicles. Thor has always been great to work with.
They have other quality recovery gear as well. I like their splice kit. http://winchline.com/mcart/index.cgi?ID=177459310&PID=IT8&code=13
And, this receiver shackle can be used for side pulls by rotating it (and the shackle) 90 degrees. http://winchline.com/mcart/index.cgi?ID=177459310&PID=IT9&code=13
I've been tempted to buy the splice kit. I suggested to Thor, when I chatted with him when I ordered my 50 ft winchline extention, that he make a DVD of doing the splice and include it with the kit. He must have some end of spool unusable lengths of rope laying around such that he could include a couple of suitable lengths with the kit so that you could actually practice the technique in your living room while watching the DVD. That would be better than trying to do it, for the first time, in the field.
I promised him when he did the above I'd buy the splice kit.
Scott Brady
Founder
Overland Training teaches splicing in the recovery and comprehensive courses. It is impressive to see how well a slice works, and how easy it is to do with a little instruction...
I'm glad to hear that. Perhaps some day I'll be able to attend. Until then a DVD would be nice.
I have watched somebody do a splice on a damaged 5/8" cable on an oil rig. It took him hours and the splice was about 10-12 ft long. I was told he charged several thousand to do the job and that it was as good as new. As it was in the middle of a drum of 15,000 ft of cable I gues it was cheap in comparison to replacement.
I came across this thread and after reading it I felt the need to clarify a few things.
First off, I would like to apologize for sending out the wrong shackles. I know it can be a pain to receive something you didnt order but in the future all it would take is a call back and we would have taken care of the problem.
We do carry very high quality Van Beest and CM shackles so again, sorry for the mix up.
This is what irritates me. Master-Pull does not play games with line ratings. Period. We go by breaking strengths determined by our rope manufacturers who have carried out extensive testing to figure that information out. We would not compromise peoples safety by making bogus claims about our products breaking strengths.
And yes our Super-Line is stiffer than normal Amsteel Blue or comparable winch line. Although it is made from the same fiber as amsteel blue, the process in which it is constructed is what sets it apart, and thats why it has a much higher breaking strength. With use though, the line will loosen up considerably, so it doesnt stay as stiff as it is when new.
Very true. If you are going with a Samson product (the rope manufacturer that makes Amsteel and Amsteel Blue) then Amsteel Blue is what you want. Amsteel is weaker.
But Samson isnt the only rope manufacturer that makes synthetic line out of Dyneema(the fiber used for all synthetic winch lines of this type), nor are they the best at it. There is a variety of rope manufacturers who produce synthetic line out of Dyneema.
There are some synthetic lines out there made of a high heat resistant fiber(either called Technora or Vectran), x-line is one of them for example. Although the heat resistant properties of the fiber are excellent when compared to Dyneema, its resistance to abrasion is much less than Dyneema and it also is much more prone to flex fatique, which is how the rope is affected from flexing and bending. Such a case would be running the rope through a snatch block or pulling it hard against a fairlead. That is why if heat is an issue, it is best to mix both types of ropes and use the high heat rope only for the first 15 or 20 feet of the line, which would be the part of the line in contact with the winch drum.
With all the options out there choosing a synthetic can be a daunting task. There are a few things to consider though.
-How large is your vehicle?
We usually recommend putting the same diameter line as what came on the winch from the factory. If your winch is too small for the vehicle(which is another problem in itself) then you should probably bump up the diameter of your line a notch. You dont want the rope or cable you use to be the weak link.
-How often will you use your winch?
If you are using your winch very often, then it would be beneficial to buy a larger diameter line. For example, instead of putting 100' of 5/16" rope on a winch, you would be better off using 85' of 3/8". The 3/8" line could take more abrasion before breaking which gives some extra room for safety. This would also mean that you could use the same line longer. For example if you had a 3/8" line and a 5/16" line and they both suffered the same amount of heavy abrasion or the same depth cut, the 3/8" would be less likely to break based on the fact that there is more line left intact.
-What terrain will you be using your winchline in?
One enemy to synthetic ropes is dirt and sand since they can get lodged in between the fibers of the rope and cause chafing. After time, this chafing from dirt and sand can substantially weaken the winch line. This kind of ties into the above question because if you are using your winch line in a very sandy area, you might want to step up the diameter of your winch line to take this abrasion into account. Also, periodically cleaning your winch line will help to clean out any sand or dirt in the fibers.
Im not going to name any specific products but there are winch lines out there that have braided covers over the entire line. This prevents dirt, sand, or any abrasive elements for that matter from getting in between the fibers of the core. The cover will help maintain the integrity of the line and therefore, it will last much longer compared to a winch line without a cover.
-How careful are you when winching?
Again, similar to the above questions. If you are very careful with your winch rope while winching and take the time to keep it clean your line will last you a long time. If you know you are hard on your winch line, step up the diameter to prevent unwanted breakages. Im not saying that in purchasing a rope with a bigger diameter you can just beat on it and not care though, it just provides a little more safety.
I mentioned purchasing a larger diameter winch line, which in turn means you cant fit as much rope on the winch. That is what winch extensions are for. Trying to load a winch with as much rope as possible is not recommended, for a few key reasons.
-For one, putting too much rope, or cable for that matter, on a winch decreases the winch's efficiency. That is because the further the rope is away from the drum, the less pulling power the winch has. Remember that winches are rated based off the first layer on the drum, so for each layer after that you are decreasing the pulling power.
-Second, if your winch is loaded with too much rope, or cable, you have to worry about feeding the line on evenly when winching, which in some cases can be quite difficult or not possible. This is because you dont want the winch line to bunch up on one side of the drum since it can eventually start hitting parts of the bumper or the winch itself and damage the rope. Going with a shorter line than what can fit on the winch helps prevent this.
All this aside, any synthetic winch rope qualified for off-road applications will be much better than wire cable. Safety is the key reason here, and another being ease of use.
I hope this information helps clear some things up for people and answered questions you might have had about synthetics.
Happy Wheeling
-Victor
First off, I would like to apologize for sending out the wrong shackles. I know it can be a pain to receive something you didnt order but in the future all it would take is a call back and we would have taken care of the problem.
We do carry very high quality Van Beest and CM shackles so again, sorry for the mix up. This is what irritates me. Master-Pull does not play games with line ratings. Period. We go by breaking strengths determined by our rope manufacturers who have carried out extensive testing to figure that information out. We would not compromise peoples safety by making bogus claims about our products breaking strengths.
And yes our Super-Line is stiffer than normal Amsteel Blue or comparable winch line. Although it is made from the same fiber as amsteel blue, the process in which it is constructed is what sets it apart, and thats why it has a much higher breaking strength. With use though, the line will loosen up considerably, so it doesnt stay as stiff as it is when new.
Very true. If you are going with a Samson product (the rope manufacturer that makes Amsteel and Amsteel Blue) then Amsteel Blue is what you want. Amsteel is weaker.
But Samson isnt the only rope manufacturer that makes synthetic line out of Dyneema(the fiber used for all synthetic winch lines of this type), nor are they the best at it. There is a variety of rope manufacturers who produce synthetic line out of Dyneema.
There are some synthetic lines out there made of a high heat resistant fiber(either called Technora or Vectran), x-line is one of them for example. Although the heat resistant properties of the fiber are excellent when compared to Dyneema, its resistance to abrasion is much less than Dyneema and it also is much more prone to flex fatique, which is how the rope is affected from flexing and bending. Such a case would be running the rope through a snatch block or pulling it hard against a fairlead. That is why if heat is an issue, it is best to mix both types of ropes and use the high heat rope only for the first 15 or 20 feet of the line, which would be the part of the line in contact with the winch drum.
With all the options out there choosing a synthetic can be a daunting task. There are a few things to consider though.
-How large is your vehicle?
We usually recommend putting the same diameter line as what came on the winch from the factory. If your winch is too small for the vehicle(which is another problem in itself) then you should probably bump up the diameter of your line a notch. You dont want the rope or cable you use to be the weak link.
-How often will you use your winch?
If you are using your winch very often, then it would be beneficial to buy a larger diameter line. For example, instead of putting 100' of 5/16" rope on a winch, you would be better off using 85' of 3/8". The 3/8" line could take more abrasion before breaking which gives some extra room for safety. This would also mean that you could use the same line longer. For example if you had a 3/8" line and a 5/16" line and they both suffered the same amount of heavy abrasion or the same depth cut, the 3/8" would be less likely to break based on the fact that there is more line left intact.
-What terrain will you be using your winchline in?
One enemy to synthetic ropes is dirt and sand since they can get lodged in between the fibers of the rope and cause chafing. After time, this chafing from dirt and sand can substantially weaken the winch line. This kind of ties into the above question because if you are using your winch line in a very sandy area, you might want to step up the diameter of your winch line to take this abrasion into account. Also, periodically cleaning your winch line will help to clean out any sand or dirt in the fibers.
Im not going to name any specific products but there are winch lines out there that have braided covers over the entire line. This prevents dirt, sand, or any abrasive elements for that matter from getting in between the fibers of the core. The cover will help maintain the integrity of the line and therefore, it will last much longer compared to a winch line without a cover.
-How careful are you when winching?
Again, similar to the above questions. If you are very careful with your winch rope while winching and take the time to keep it clean your line will last you a long time. If you know you are hard on your winch line, step up the diameter to prevent unwanted breakages. Im not saying that in purchasing a rope with a bigger diameter you can just beat on it and not care though, it just provides a little more safety.
I mentioned purchasing a larger diameter winch line, which in turn means you cant fit as much rope on the winch. That is what winch extensions are for. Trying to load a winch with as much rope as possible is not recommended, for a few key reasons.
-For one, putting too much rope, or cable for that matter, on a winch decreases the winch's efficiency. That is because the further the rope is away from the drum, the less pulling power the winch has. Remember that winches are rated based off the first layer on the drum, so for each layer after that you are decreasing the pulling power.
-Second, if your winch is loaded with too much rope, or cable, you have to worry about feeding the line on evenly when winching, which in some cases can be quite difficult or not possible. This is because you dont want the winch line to bunch up on one side of the drum since it can eventually start hitting parts of the bumper or the winch itself and damage the rope. Going with a shorter line than what can fit on the winch helps prevent this.
All this aside, any synthetic winch rope qualified for off-road applications will be much better than wire cable. Safety is the key reason here, and another being ease of use.
I hope this information helps clear some things up for people and answered questions you might have had about synthetics.
Happy Wheeling
-Victor
Longtime lurker, 1st time poster:
When I purchased my Warn 9.5xp winch, I wanted the safety of synthetic line. I replaced the steel cable with synthetic cable from winchline.com. Their customer service was top notch.
Because of that, last week I purchased all of my recovery gear from winchline.com. The order was missing the tree saver. One email and it was shipped out the next day.
Cheers,
Sean a.k.a. code4beer
When I purchased my Warn 9.5xp winch, I wanted the safety of synthetic line. I replaced the steel cable with synthetic cable from winchline.com. Their customer service was top notch.
Because of that, last week I purchased all of my recovery gear from winchline.com. The order was missing the tree saver. One email and it was shipped out the next day.
Cheers,
Sean a.k.a. code4beer
lowenbrau
Explorer
I just couldn't be happier with Amsteel Blue. I finally broke mine right in the middle of the 225 feet this summer and now am just using the broken piece as an extension. I bought it in 2000 but it did sit for a number of years on an idle truck. For years I had just regularly swapped wire rope that I had twisted and crushed and torn and I agonized about the cost of synthetic. Now-a-days I'm nearly ready to pitch the virgin wire rope off the factory winch of my new HDJ81 but.. Who winches at the mall?
If you are looking for a deal, I went halfers on a full roll when we bought ours. I can't remember how much that was ... 500 feet maybe? It seemed like the most efficient way to buy the stuff at the time.
If you are looking for a deal, I went halfers on a full roll when we bought ours. I can't remember how much that was ... 500 feet maybe? It seemed like the most efficient way to buy the stuff at the time.
masterpull, winchline.comm... all offer in spools, or you can buy from rope makers likd wongs, samson.