Solar/Wind AC- Multi use (Cab, Camper, Micro-ish home)

[Coachgeo]

background info:
1. No AC in 1950's home of only 640 sq feet (ok I lied...... on rare occasion use Window AC)
2. No Ac in Cab of truck
3. No AC in camper box (not yet purchased/built)
4. Income dictates..... mulitple devices that do the same thing is not in the budget, nor is it very logical. Examples:
.... AC in vehicle, another AC in camper........ Another AC in house etc.
.... Truck for camping, Another Truck for generic hauling etc.
.... Solar set up for house, another for camper etc.
.... power storage for house...... another for camper etc.

So here is concept considering

. AC unit- Portable Air Conditioner....
.... something like this one / DC with inverter type. 12-13,000 BTU seems biggist output out there. Too big for camper... not Big enough for cab.... trade off). Perfect size for a room or two in the small house.
........ Mount so it can be moved from one place to other between Cab, camper, house.

. Solar- Put as many watt cells as I can on top of fixed rack on over bed 8' wide and 16' long (camper box will be removable from bed). Maybe over cab too.

. Wind- Have wind power generator. when parked can be raised higher via pole and tie downs.
.... When down in travel mode can use moving air from transport to generate power**
........ yes.. know that this will cause drag and put a load on the vehicle engine......... AND SO WOULD PUTTING AC COMPRESSOR ON ENGINE. But typical truck AC won't allow for multi use (see #4 above).

. diesel Generator assist. (already own 5,000/6000 peak)

. Battery bank multi use as well (see #4). Maybe smaller bank AND Capacitors combination since really don't need more than 10hr? night time storage. Would be mostly buffer bank For AC during use and little lighting & computer and minimal? AC at night.



For Cab. Insulate the Shiat out of it. Cover windows when not in use so AC won't have to work so hard to bring temps up. Pre-cool cab hour or so before embarking. Vent to seats area direct. Pull air to be cooled from seat area? No intention to cool whole interior...... just space around seat(s). Curtin/divider off the area behind seats (LMTV cab). This area may be converted to sleeping loft anyway)

For Camper- Insulate shiat out of it. This will be a very small camper box compared to most. Only about 5' tall...... 6'-8' wide and 8'-12' long.

For house- Self explanatory. Park truck in back yard and plug into seperate wire circuit in house that powers on the portable AC (maybe computer too?)

Wiring oddity.... need external receptacle mounted on house, camper box and cab to swap power input from one to the other.


So......... plenty reasons why this would not work (or work well). How about ideas on how to make such an idea work as best as possible.

Look forward to your input.

 

[IdaSHO]

Solar is pretty stupid-proof once installed and dialed in. Very little to worry about, provided you calc'd your needs correctly.

Ive looked into wind, and for a vehicle pitched the idea for a few reasons...

*Setup time. No matter how its mounted, its one more thing you need to worry about when setting up camp, and breaking down camp.
*Maintenance/repair. I was not satisfied any of the units I looked at would survive very long considering 4-season travel. I felt like I would be trying to break things every time I set up or broke down.
*Noise. When mounted to a cabin, none of them will be 100% silent when operating.


Now, for an off-grid application in a stationary cabin or something similar, I think a combination of solar and wind is ideal.

 

[dwh]

Someone long ago asked me if I thought it was a good idea to use wind while driving to make power.

I said no...the alternator already does that.

Portable A/C units are notoriously power inefficient.

 

[jonyjoe101]

I agree about the insulation, that is something that is overlook but will work extremely well. In my astrovan I insulated the shiat out of it, roof, windows. floor, sides and I built a sliding door divider between the front and rear of the van. Parked in the sun with all windows/doors closed the front can reach 145 degrees and the back might be 107 degrees, thats almost a 40 degree drop.

In the back I have a 12 volt swampcooler that I built running all the time, it makes it livable. In a hot day it puts out about 80 degree air which isnt AC but for the 2 amps it uses, it keeps me cool.

For insulation I recommend the rtech foam they sell at home depot it comes in a 4 foot by 8 foot sheet, highly recommend you use at least 1 inch thick foam which is about 10 dollars per sheet. Cut into small pieces, maybe 1 foot by 1 foot or less and hotglue to your camper. Hotglue dries quickly and sticks pretty good, in 3 years I havent had any of the foam fall off my roof.

Use an ir thermometer that you can point and it will tell you were to add more foam insulation. Foam sticks good on top of other foam in case you need to double some areas. No such thing as too much foam, the more foam you add, you will feel a difference. Foam insulation works both ways, keeps you cool in the summer and warm in the winter.

Seriously consider building yourself a swamp cooler for use at night time. They work pretty good at night with very little power use. This would keep you from having to have a very large power bank. A 100 ah battery will run a swamp cooler at least 10 hours you require of night time with power to spare. And you can build them as big as you want including using car radiator electric fans (use about 5 amps). Even the most efficient AC use about 40 amps of power. I'm a very big supporter of using swamp coolers to stay cool in van/campers, have been using them for 3 years and believe a large enough swamp cooler can keep most will insulated areas cool. In my van right now I have a total of 5 12 volt swamp coolers , 1 that I use every and 4 backups. Thats how important swamp coolers are to my quality of life.

As far as the cab, insulation will help very little if any, all the heat comes from the windows. Large 12 volt fans or AC is the only thing that will work there or keeping your windows open all the time. I put foam insulation on the roof of the driver area of my van, but still reaches 145 degrees when parked in the sun even with reflective sunshade in place.

I always believe in getting the largest solar panel that will fit on your roof. I have a 240 watt panel on the roof of my astrovan, it takes up almost every inch but it gives 13 amps of charge power, I can run several swamp coolers at the same time with this panel and still have power to run my laptop etc.

For the AC you need a generator to run it all the time, no way around it. It will drain the biggest battery banks, and solar panels will never produce enough power to run it.
rtech foam insulation 1/2" layer, I added another 1/2" since this picture taken

large swamp cooler 5 amps uses 9" car radiator electric fan

small swamp cooler 2 amps uses 120mm computer cooling hi speed fan

 

[Coachgeo]

Someone long ago asked me if I thought it was a good idea to use wind while driving to make power.

I said no...the alternator already does that.

Portable A/C units are notoriously power inefficient.

The DC inverter Portable AC's are a significant advancement over the past ones in power efficiency and the two hose units are a bit better at cooling than past ones as well.

As to alternator...... nice sound bite but notoriously wrong. Alternator is designed to power OEM items. That is it. Granted they can be upgraged though.

In this case....... right now the upgraded alternator on my truck cost nearly as much as a full wind generator ($1000+) than would potentially be capable of generating power when rig is driving, stationary, engine power on, engine power off etc. Thus much more flexible which fits #4

 

[Coachgeo]

I agree about the insulation, that is something that is overlook but will work extremely well. In my astrovan I insulated the shiat out of it, roof, windows. floor, sides and I built a sliding door divider between the front and rear of the van. Parked in the sun with all windows/doors closed the front can reach 145 degrees and the back might be 107 degrees, thats almost a 40 degree drop.

In the back I have a 12 volt swampcooler that I built running all the time, it makes it livable. In a hot day it puts out about 80 degree air which isnt AC but for the 2 amps it uses, it keeps me cool.

Like you I don't require COLD ac. Rather Mid 70's than 80's though. Have not had auto AC for at least a Decade and lived in North TX a good bit of that. Have not had AC in my home for closer to two decades.

For insulation I recommend the rtech foam they sell at home depot... . . recommend you use at least... 1 inch .... Cut into small pieces, maybe 1 foot by 1 foot or less and hotglue to your camper. Hotglue dries quickly and sticks pretty good, in 3 years I havent had any of the foam fall off my roof.

Use an ir thermometer that you can point and it will tell you were to add more foam insulation. Foam sticks good on top of other foam in case you need to double some areas. No such thing as too much foam, the more foam you add, you will feel a difference. Foam insulation works both ways, keeps you cool in the summer and warm in the winter.

Good info thanks. I figured hot glue would have issues with hot roof. Did you Glue to the metal cab ceiling or Hot Glue the foam to one another so it was a solid sheet that cant fall

Seriously consider building yourself a swamp cooler ....They work pretty good at night with very little power use. This would keep you from having to have a very large power bank. A 100 ah battery will run a swamp cooler at least 10 hours you require of night time with power to spare. And you can build them as big as you want including using car radiator electric fans (use about 5 amps). Even the most efficient AC use about 40 amps of power. I'm a very big supporter of using swamp coolers to stay cool in van/campers, have been using them for 3 years and believe a large enough swamp cooler can keep most will insulated areas cool. In my van right now I have a total of 5 12 volt swamp coolers , 1 that I use every and 4 backups. Thats how important swamp coolers are to my quality of life.

. Glad it works for you. I don't think it will for me though. Want to prepaire for a stay up to 4weeks or so without moving in the boondocks so swamp cooling wont help much in that case, though I will probably start with Ice chest cooler at first so I'll give it a chance to prove myself wrong.

As far as the cab, insulation will help very little if any, all the heat comes from the windows. Large 12 volt fans or AC is the only thing that will work there or keeping your windows open all the time. I put foam insulation on the roof of the driver area of my van, but still reaches 145 degrees when parked in the sun even with reflective sunshade in place.

Interesting input. Definately will look into instaling exhaust fans (solar powered) to help

I always believe in getting the largest solar panel that will fit on your roof. I have a 240 watt panel on the roof of my astrovan, it takes up almost every inch but it gives 13 amps of charge power, I can run several swamp coolers at the same time with this panel and still have power to run my laptop etc.

Again good input thanks. with your info sounds like I'd get closer to 500 wat total panals since am significantly larger surface area vehicle. Will loose some sun power cause will cover with Lexan to protect them from tree limbs etc. Anticipate having fold out ones too and the wind.

For the AC you need a generator to run it all the time, no way around it. It will drain the biggest battery banks, and solar panels will never produce enough power to run it.

. you might be right. Hope not the case. Technology is advancing.

 

[dwh]

Well...

The numbers are all available. Eventually you'll have to start using them. Then youll start to learn.

Good luck.

 

[Coachgeo]

Well...

The numbers are all available. Eventually you'll have to start using them. Then youll start to learn.

Good luck.

True...... first though you got to weed out till you find both affordable lower power using AC units... and the higher power energy generators, then you got something to start crunching numbers with.

UPDATE- should have followed that comment with.... mostly interested in folks input though on the multi use concept and ideas on how to potentially make that work; particularly the area of using wind created by driving instead of a second compresor mounted to engine.

 

[dwh]

True...... first though you got to weed out till you find both affordable lower power using AC units... and the higher power energy generators, then you got something to start crunching numbers with.

Which has all been done a thousand times already by people who thoroughly understand what's involved.

A lot of that work is archived right here on this forum. All you have to do is look it up and study it.

 

[Coachgeo]

Which has all been done a thousand times already by people who thoroughly understand what's involved.

A lot of that work is archived right here on this forum. All you have to do is look it up and study it.

thanks for the input. Am a big proponent of SEARCH FIRST.

Will do more searches. Really should not have assumed there was info out there on the Multi-use concept being proposed in this thread. That's the area am seeking most input on. Glad to hear there is. Got any suggested keywords to search with on the multi use idea and the wind while driving idea instead of AC compressor mounted to engine.

 

[dwh]

I have no idea why you keep talking about second compressor. That wont make electricity.

The stock alternator on my 1976 Ford van is a 100 amp unit. Of course most alternators are rated to 80% when hot so figure 80a.

Above idle the voltage regulator holds the voltage at 14.5v.

80a x 14.5v = 1160w

So good luck getting any small wind generator that can put out more than even the stock alternator that's already in your truck.

The main issue with multi-use as you describe is grid-tie.

 

[dwh]

Also good luck finding a small wind genny that can handle 60 mph.

 

[dwh]

If you want no BS small wind, look here:

http://www.tlgwindpower.com/

 

[Coachgeo]

I have no idea why you keep talking about second compressor. That wont make electricity.

The stock alternator on my 1976 Ford van is a 100 amp unit. Of course most alternators are rated to 80% when hot so figure 80a.....

Understand the confusion. Lets look at conventional thinking
1. Air Con. compressor connected to engine. (Drag on engine). Associated electrical components powered via Alternator and battery storage (drag on engine) to cool Cab
2. Air Con. electric motor spun compressor inside unit and associated electronics drawing power from XXX to cool Camper Box
3. Air Con. electric motor spun compressor inside unit and associated electronics drawing power from XXX to cool shop trailer
4. Air Con. electric motor spun compressor inside unit and associated electronics drawing power from XXX to cool room in home.

That's a ton of duplication. Goal is to lesson that. Certainly don't want to duplicate XXX either. Just one generation system of Solar and wind. Just one energy storage system as XXX. Your point is good though to supliment when driving with Alternator once starting and winching batteries are topped off. (It's a diesel.) My alternator is also 100amp. 200amp is available for around $1,000 but that wont help any when parked.

There is no grid tie. This will never tie into the grid.

The biggest question in all this is the drag on the engine by generating some of the power via wind when driving. Will this drag be more than an engine mounted AC compressor and alternator use for rest of components. Might be. But if still planning to do multi use/shared Solar/wind and XXX for camp site, shop trailer and home (never used at same time) along with a mulit use/shared AC unit for those... is it worth the $$$ (approx $2000) to buy and install a seperate vehicle AC unit as well? It might be???

 

[dwh]

You'll need a big inverter no matter what. And you'll still have cab ac from engine no matter what.

So feed power to battery bank and run everything except cab ac from inverter.

Three 5k btu window shakers probably cost less than one portable ac.