Is the Tacoma enough truck?

[jasmtis]

You can't see the passenger side tires from the driver's seat of a Tacoma or Jeep just like I can't with my Ram. If things are tight, we are all relying on a passenger or spotter to tell us what's on that side. There's no doubt that these trails are easier in narrower vehicles, but I'm just saying that the difference is significantly smaller than it seems from the driver's seat. Wheelbase is a whole other animal though. My wheelbase is almost 10" longer than a crew long bed Tacoma. But then I could go over a lot of these passes with the weight of a Tacoma in my bed...haha.

The mental aspect of the tapering hood of Jeeps is a very real thing, however.

True and nothing replaces a spotter in technical terrain. Still, better visibility makes for a more fun and confidence inspiring experience on the trails. You can't get around geometry. On steep, narrow forest roads in the Cascades in my Tacoma I'll often come over a crest and not be able to see anything of the trail. We aren't talking about technical terrain here, and I when I stick my head out of the window or step out to see what's ahead it's always a perfectly passable forest road, as I would've assumed, but from the driver seat for all I know it's washed out or literally gone. This never happens in my Range Rover Classic, with a large greenhouse and short, low hoodline. The blind spot in front of a full size truck with an even longer and wider hood will plain and simply create a larger blind area preventing you from picking having the best view of what's coming. Can it make it through 95% of what a Tacoma can? Yes! Is the visibility and size difference between an HD and my Tacoma proportionally similar to the visibility and size difference between my Tacoma and my Range Rover? Also yes, which just doesn't sound like a fun experience to me but if you enjoy it knock yourself out.

You have to trust your spotter. That's even true of a buggy. It usually takes a while 'wheeling with people to get on the same wavelength but when you do your ability to get through stuff goes up leaps and bounds.

Very true! I just always have way more fun when I can see. It doesn't remove the need for a spotter, but it makes for a better experience.

1st gen...so it is a bit smaller than the 2nd/3rd gen. However the interior bed dimensions are a smidge bigger than the later models. Which doesn't make much sense on Toyota's part...why increase the size of the truck if you're not going to make the cargo area bigger? Gained a little cab interior room but not much, fuel economy is about the same, payload went down...since the truck got heavier. I don't like the late model Tacomas for that very reason. Might was well get a half ton at that point. Cost is the same, fuel economy is a touch better, and can be ordered with up to a 3000 lbs payload (F150) if you spec it right.

Here in Idaho it is super easy to plate a bike. One of the reasons we moved here, the other is lots of places to explore right out the front all within 1-3 hour drive, so really no need to drive-camp-drive-camp-drive. Yesterday I was in Cascade...this weekend I was invited to go to McCall, the weekend after that heading to Stanley. Trying to head to the Oregon coast...but can't bring myself to do that 10 hour drive. Looks like am sticking around here for the next couple few weekends, which isn't necessarily a bad thing.


Used to wheel my F250 harder than any of my Toyotas, and that was back in PA, where it is super tight and greasy. Beat the living **** out of that poor truck. Ended up breaking the frame in half...that truck did not have an easy life. Started going down the same road with my Toyotas of wheeling them hard...but it got to the point where I got tired of breaking stuff...then trying to fix it before having to get back to work on Monday. So I started buying trail toys, ATC's Quads, Dirt Bikes, Mountain Bikes...so much more fun than wheeling trucks...and when you break them. You stick them in the corner of the garage until you can get to it.

Wonder how many guys who buy vehicles to fit down some trail....wonder what the actual percentage of trail use it gets? Guessing most people's truck gets used more running them back and forth to work than anything. I know mine does.

Yep, all good points. I wanted a manual transmission and proper stock capability with a decent aftermarket and on the newer side because I drive a ton. I'd rather have a new first-gen double cab with a stick shift but that is not a thing that exists. Being able to tow my Rover on occasion is nice, but it's not something I do often. It's within my Tacoma's rating and I don't really feel the need to go above and beyond on the tow rating for something I do very occasionally. A full size wouldn't fit in my garage and I live in a city so it would make street parking even more of a pain. Also, the Rover can sit in the corner of my garage till I get to it, it was cheaper than any side by side you can find, I can sleep in the back of it and it's street legal.

Of course it spends more time driving me to work but it wouldn't do a better job of that if it were larger. How many people drive a full size to work every day because they tow their boat from their garage to the slip in April, to the lake for a weekend or two over the summer and back to the garage in October? What's more silly?

Where in PA did you live? I spent some time in the Lehigh Valley. The PNW is really the best for free, accessible exploration with trails of any difficulty you desire.

 

[Clutch]

Yeah, I’ll echo what @bkg said. I don’t know you anymore.

*chuckle*

Well, I have been looking at Ram CTD's with a manual trans...think living in Idaho, you are required to get one.

Perhaps our viewpoints differ. I don't think it's appropriate to bash an oversized vehicle through places it has no business, widening trails and knocking down features and trees. Same issue I have with yahoos on quads and side-by-sides calling themselves "motorcycles" and ruining single track. There are ramifications to inexperienced or arrogant drivers doing it just to prove 'em wrong. When they screw up or cause damage our roads get closed.

Stuff like the Rubicon and Black Bear are established roads, sometimes these "trails" are dual listed as FS and county roads. We can only travel on routes listed in the MVUM not just follow any ol' jeep trail anymore. Even the difficult stuff is maintained for the most part to stabilize and prevent off road (meaning off the established route) travel.

I don't think anyone is saying to go out and destroy/widen trails. Nothing more chaps my hide than seeing dipshits destroying trails or bushwacking. Like what Buliwulf was saying...if things get too tight for the truck, stop turns around and grabs the bike, when to much for the moto, grab the bicycle...too much for that, grab the hiking boots. Even though I am motohead...I also believe that designated Wilderness should be void of humans, if you truly want "Wilderness". That stance isn't even popular with Wilderness advocates. So with that, I am little anal retentive on what should and shouldn't be on designated trails.

 

[Clutch]

Yep, all good points. I wanted a manual transmission and proper stock capability with a decent aftermarket and on the newer side because I drive a ton. I'd rather have a new first-gen double cab with a stick shift but that is not a thing that exists. Being able to tow my Rover on occasion is nice, but it's not something I do often. It's within my Tacoma's rating and I don't really feel the need to go above and beyond on the tow rating for something I do very occasionally. A full size wouldn't fit in my garage and I live in a city so it would make street parking even more of a pain. Also, the Rover can sit in the corner of my garage till I get to it, it was cheaper than any side by side you can find, I can sleep in the back of it and it's street legal.

Of course it spends more time driving me to work but it wouldn't do a better job of that if it were larger. How many people drive a full size to work every day because they tow their boat from their garage to the slip in April, to the lake for a weekend or two over the summer and back to the garage in October? What's more silly?

Where in PA did you live? I spent some time in the Lehigh Valley. The PNW is really the best for free, accessible exploration with trails of any difficulty you desire.

Love love my Tacoma...it does really shine when things get tight, but I am finding myself not wanting to back in too deep with the truck anymore...save that for the bikes. Think why I am looking at bigger trucks so I can have a more comfortable base camp. Have been doing a lot of trail maintenance in the Spring here..so that means long cold rainy days, running chainsaws most of the day. I am whooped when I come back to camp...this past spring dealing with a leaky cold Wildernest was a little tough. Cold and wet all day....being cold and wet all night wasn't exactly fun. Kinda just want to come back to camp have a hot shower and meal, then climb into a warm dry bed. Don't need much...but those 3 things are high on the list.

Oh...I loose count of empty bed pickups running around here. I have thought of buying a basic commuter for myself. But you really don't save all that much money. That would mean I would have 3 vehicles to fuss with. Already did that...years ago we used to have a fleet of construction vehicles that I used to take care of...well over having more than 2 vehicles.

Where in PA? Other side of the state...roughly 40 miles East of Pittsburg, in a little town of Greensburg....did a lot of exploring in the Laurel Highlands when I was teen. Grandparents on my mother's side used to have a cabin in Rector, which is by Linn Run State Park. Used to run that old F250 on old logging roads and slag dumps. It was one of our construction trucks, that got turned into my play truck. That truck lived a hard life from the moment it left the dealership.

 

[DorB]

, trying to load the girlfriend, dog, and gear into the taco for trips gets a little tight.

Is it the weight limit or the space in the bed?

We (2+2) manage to get everything we need for a 4-day off road trip before we need refueling/re-supply.
Fridge, second 50L cooler, fire wood, tent, tools, kitchen, big first-aid kit, spare parts, shade, small compressor, 50Lwater tank, 4 selfinflating matt’s&pillows, duffle bags for cloths and blankets, full size table 60w solar panel .. and more.
And 2 kids..
All this in a double cab Hilux.

The point is, if it’s only you, girlfriend and a dog, and you short of space in a Taco, well, maybe you’re packing method for off-roading needs improvement.

 

[Buliwyf]

Do any of these tight roads lead anywhere??? If the point of the trail, is only to drive off road, then it's 4wheelin', not Expo travel.

On our Jeep roads, a Drz400 can complete the entire trail 10 times quicker than a Jeep, snap pics and enjoy lunch, be back down the trail and loaded back into the truck, and we're on our way to the next destination before the Jeeps are half way done.

Plan accordingly, some places full sizes just can't go. Motorhomes tow a Jeep for a reason. But extra tight trails that blow days of my vacation, and require me to use an undersized ride, have no interest to me.

I think Ocala National Forest is a good example. You can fit an Earthcruiser down those #'d dirt roads, but the real action requires a dirtbike or 4wheeler. Basecamp and braaap makes more sense.

My only expo camping planned this year is a forest in the Florida plan handle and a camp spot next to the ocean for a little while, then a few days in a hotel in Port St. Joe for some scuba diving, and the remainder of my time back at that camp site. Fullsize is preferred for this. The Drz will be handy to run around Port St. Joe, and I think there's a powerline near my camp site I can braaap dowm.

 

[phsycle]

Dirt bikes/ATV’s do make quick work of trails, which works for base camp set up. But traveling with family and going point to point, you need a vehicle that’ll get you there.

If I had a 3k ft detached shop, I’d love to buy multiple vehicles for all types of travel. For a one, do it all set up, Taco makes sense for me. Just big enough to squeeze people in. Just small enough for most trails.

 

[Buliwyf]

Not bashing little trucks or anything. But on the east coast and midwest, 99% of the travel and Expo camping I did with my Jeep YJ or our small trucks in our group, I was completely jealous of the fullsize guys the entire time. It's really a choice you have to make based on where you're going, and how ypu're getting there. If you're rtt'ing or tenting, it might make sense to concentrate on places with tight trails first, then trade up for a larger vehicle later like I did, for the normal-er stuff.

Traded away 4'' of skinney the first chance I could, and haven't looked back, give or take the bikes.

 

[DaveInDenver]

Do any of these tight roads lead anywhere??? If the point of the trail, is only to drive off road, then it's 4wheelin', not Expo travel.

FWIW, the info on the ones I posted before.

This is FS648, Black Bear Pass, which connects Silverton to Telluride, CO.



This is FR853, which is a dead end road that connects Governor and Sydney Basins to Ouray, CO. It was originally built as the access to Mountain Top Mine.



This is FR317, Schofield Pass, which connects Marble (a village near Carbondale and Aspen) to Crested Butte.



Whether they constitute "expo", I dunno. The road into Governor Basin would be necessary for the people who still own the mine and it's a well preserved site worth seeing. There are easier ways as alternatives to the other two, but they exist for the same reason, originally they were put in to service mines.

 

[Clutch]

Do any of these tight roads lead anywhere??? .

You need to come out West young man!

All those roads Dave are showing...are cake on a bike...hell, pretty easy in a truck/jeep/whatever too since they get run so much.

Good to do them to say you have done them, the views from the top are amazing. But the real fun is the single track in Taylor Park, Rico, Sergeants, Salida, etc....

When you're done with Colorado...head here to Idaho.

This is the main reason I wanted to move here: https://trails.idaho.gov

 

[Clutch]

Dirt bikes/ATV’s do make quick work of trails, which works for base camp set up. But traveling with family and going point to point, you need a vehicle that’ll get you there.
.

pfffft....

Look, even in Expo Khaki!

 

[phsycle]

*chuckle*

Well, I have been looking at Ram CTD's with a manual trans...think living in Idaho, you are required to get one...

I think you've looked at every truck. Van. SUV. Econobox. Cute-ute. Sedan. Motorcycle. Bicycle. e-scooter. Roller blades. Did I miss anything?

You need to come out West young man!

All those roads Dave are showing...are cake on a bike...hell, pretty easy in a truck/jeep/whatever too since they get run so much...

Cake to you, maybe. I know people walk their bikes down some of the parts (steps of BBP in the first picture). I'd try it, but would be ready to bail before sending it off the cliff.

 

[Clutch]

I think you've looked at every truck. Van. SUV. Econobox. Cute-ute. Sedan. Motorcycle. Bicycle. e-scooter. Roller blades. Did I miss anything?

Gas/battery powered skate boards.

Gaaad it is a disease. Making solutions for problems I don't have. I don't know what it is, always combed the classifieds for as long as I can remember. Always looked in the paper...or the old paper Auto Traders...loved those things.

Maybe I missed my calling, and should of owned a used car lot...so I can try everything.

Cake to you, maybe. I know people walk their bikes down some of the parts (steps of BBP in the first picture). I'd try it, but would be ready to bail before sending it off the cliff.

Riding down is safer, the physics of a spinning wheel is a wonderful thing.

 

[phsycle]

It's pretty slick, too, though--with all the gravel everywhere. I slipped several times, but puckered my way down it. I would like to try it in a dirt bike or ATV one of these days. Problem with doing it in an ATV or UTV is, it's a one-way road.

 

[Clutch]

It's pretty slick, too, though--with all the gravel everywhere. I slipped several times, but puckered my way down it. I would like to try it in a dirt bike or ATV one of these days. Problem with doing it in an ATV or UTV is, it's a one-way road.

That shale is gnarly...the trick is to keep moving...as soon as you stop...you start sliding.

We had lots of it back East...plus it was covered with slime. Like riding on moving ice.


You can plate a ATV and an UTV at least in AZ and Idaho you can. Unsure of the laws in Colorado. Infact there are a couple people in our town that use them to run around in.

 

[Dalko43]

I don't think it's appropriate to bash an oversized vehicle through places it has no business, widening trails and knocking down features and trees.

And so long as we're talking about established roads, built for vehicular traffic, a full size should fit without any issue (other than pin striping).

Where I live, the trails/roads are very tight and heavily vegetated, arguably more so than what I've seen out west. The full size trucks I've seen go down them certainly aren't knocking down features and trees. At most, they're breaking off a few over-hanging branches, which would've needed trimming anyways. It seems like you're trying to build up a controversy where none exists.

Stuff like the Rubicon and Black Bear are established roads, sometimes these "trails" are dual listed as FS and county roads.

Yep, and we've already established that full sizes have made their way across some of those types of trails without much drama.