Horsepower required to pull ...

Metal Twister

Highly Motivated
This may be in the wrong area so if needed please move this Thread?

I'm wondering how big of engine you would need to pull a typical expo. Trailer loaded to say 1000lbs. I see jeeps hooked up and appearing not to be a problem pulling at all. Is a stock 4.o jeep with stock gears and 32" tires going to get the trailer up a trail with a rating of 3 or 4? Or is there regearing that is required to do that with some ease. My FSJ has a tired 258 in it and I am concerned about its ability to use the trailer for anything but street and mild dirt roads? Any thoughts on this, or threads you can point me to in this regard? Are automatics a better choice for pulling off road trailers?
Thanks, Bob
 

BigDaveZJ

Adventurer
My ZJ has a healthy V8 in it, so on the roads I had no problem at all. On the trails, I found myself using 4-Lo a little more than normal though. Mostly for the compression braking with the added weight, but I really didn't notice a considerable difference in power.
 

ExplorerExplorer

Adventurer
1000 lbs? That's nothing at all... Honestly, some trailers weigh that UNloaded... I've pulled way more than that with my 4 cylinder Ranger... Horsepower is not what you look for when towing, it's torque, and the easy way to increase torque is by using gearing... You could pull 1000 lbs with a 1 hp motor easily, by using gears, therefore multiplying the torque... Basically, what I'm saying is to increase your effecive torque to the rear wheels, go to a shorter gear ratio, which is usually what a towing package consists of... As long as you can drive a manual correctly, I prefer one to an automatic for towing... Don't be afraid to downshift either... The motor needs to spin to create enough power to keep the wheels going, I've gone through entire states where my 2.5l Ranger never came down below 3500 rpm... 200,000 miles later, and it hasn't complained at all...
 

'05TJLWBRUBY

Adventurer
All I can say is hook up and see. I regularly pull a 5x10 behind my '05 LJ Rubicon loaded to max capacity of the rig, which is 3500 lbs. I'm carrying everything in between from empty up to full load with the rig, from Jeep being empty, doors and hardtop stripped, to Jeep being fully street ready and loaded down and trailer loaded as well. In street trim, my LJ is pretty heavy at just under 5,000 lbs. empty, due to all my skids, armor, cage, bumpers, etc.

Drivetrain wise, I have the bone stock 4.0. Jeep did pretty well on it's own and I have no reason to change anything there. Running the 6 speed tranny. As to auto's-personal preference. If you feel more comfortable with the auto, go with that. I've been really happy with the 6 speed in my rig in all areas and wouldn't change a thing-on or off-road, towing or not.

Gearing-it did fine with the stock gears and factory MT/R's which were roughly 31's. When I bumped up to 255/85/16's -true 33's, with stock gears, it was AWFUL at best on it's own without the trailer. Lost 6th gear all together, 1st became a dedicated starter gear, lost all control and finesse off-road, what I could idle before began to take throttle-this is with a 4:1 low range mind you. I hated it, the rig was crippled with this setup for what I do. Towing a trailer with what I do was a joke. It did it, but hated every minute of it and fought me the whole way. I regeared to 4.88's and it's the best thing I could have done. If I ever go to 35's I'll wish I went 5.13's. With the 255's, the 4.88's are perfect in every aspect for me. Around town, on the highway, and towing. On/off-road, it just works. Got 6th back, can tow great again, off-road control/finesse is back again, the rig drives and handles like it should. Mileage improved as well with the new gears compared to stock gears and 255's as the engine is working in it's optimum efficiency range again.

As most tires tend to run small anyway and your 32's may likely be closer to 31's anyway, unless they're the 265's and even so, you may not have much to worry about. Like I said, I'd still hook up and see how it does. My 255's measure a TRUE 33"-actually 33.5" tall when new and mounted up so they're taller than most 33's and a fair amount bigger than 32's or 265's. Power draw or strain while towing with these compared to my brand new 31's on stock gears was definitely noticeable. I towed just fine on factory tires/gears when brand new (tires) so if your 32's are worn at all, the little difference there shouldn't be enough to put any real strain on your setup I wouldn't think. Again, hard to really tell for sure without hooking up and going for a drive. As the old addage goes, there's no replacement for displacement, but when geared properly, you don't need big horsepower to pull. My little 4.0 6cyl in my '05 LJ Rubi ain't putting out anywhere near V8 kinda hp numbers but I get up and down the roads just fine with my trailer within the rated capacity of the rig. The new trailer I'm building will target 1100lbs. empty as it's enclosed and built for off-road use. My current trailer is about that now, only larger and open.

Don't know if that helps or not, but something to think about.

Best of Luck,

Mike
 

Martyn

Supporting Sponsor, Overland Certified OC0018
Engine size and power in my mind is primarily a highway issue. If you want to be able to tow at speed it's easier with a V8 or V6.

On trail it's primarily tires size and gearing, if you have the wrong combination you will have trouble pulling at trailer.

Electric brakes are a huge benefit both on and off-road. Off-road the electric brake can be use in conjunction with or independent from the vehicle brakes. They work moving forwards and in reverse, and can be used to maneuver the trailer around or over obstacles.
 

strange

Observer
that 4.0 jeep engine is a good torquey engine. i would think it would tow 1000 lbs just fine. If it dosnt do it as good as you like, if you regeared for your tires i would guarantee it would pull 1000lbs just fine
 

socaljeeper

Adventurer
I have the 4.0 in my Jeep, manual, with 35's and stock gearing. My trailer weighs between 1500-2000 lbs. Regearing is high on the priority list. Most of the time I am in 4th gear on the freeway. When going up grades it is slow going.
 

Metal Twister

Highly Motivated
Great info guys. I think an engine swap to a V8 is in order. After I see what I have as far as power with a V8 I can then look at the gearing. It's tired now and has a hard time getting out of its own way. Thanks again for the details and replies. Back to the drawing board....:Wow1:
 

Metal Twister

Highly Motivated
Engine size and power in my mind is primarily a highway issue. If you want to be able to tow at speed it's easier with a V8 or V6.

On trail it's primarily tires size and gearing, if you have the wrong combination you will have trouble pulling at trailer.

Electric brakes are a huge benefit both on and off-road. Off-road the electric brake can be use in conjunction with or independent from the vehicle brakes. They work moving forwards and in reverse, and can be used to maneuver the trailer around or over obstacles.

Is here such a thing as electric disc brakes for trailers?
 

Robert Bills

Explorer
I think an engine swap to a V8 is in order. After I see what I have as far as power with a V8 I can then look at the gearing.

I would do the axles and gears first. Swapping to a V8 is a much more complex and expensive endeavor during which you will learn to hate the smog referees. And even with a V8, stock gears with oversize tires may still be a problem, hence my recommendation that you start with gears. You may find that proper gears with a rebuilt (and upgraded) 4.0 is a better option.
 

Martyn

Supporting Sponsor, Overland Certified OC0018
I would do the axles and gears first. Swapping to a V8 is a much more complex and expensive endeavor during which you will learn to hate the smog referees. And even with a V8, stock gears with oversize tires may still be a problem, hence my recommendation that you start with gears. You may find that proper gears with a rebuilt (and upgraded) 4.0 is a better option.

Very sound advice Robert
 

Metal Twister

Highly Motivated
That makes perfect since... But in my situation things are a bit different. I have a pre smog 1974 FSJ. I also have a 1977 Chevy Blazer that is in really bad shape body wise. Im thinking very seriously about taking the motor, trans, and t case, Low geared axles, and springs, then transplanting it into the jeep. That would do alot of things for me. Instant horsepower, heavy duty transfer case and maybe even double them up? and an automatic trans.
I love my FSJ and because of the year and the SMOG exempt status I think this makes since in my situation.
My bad back hates that clutch peddle anyway! Besides that is kinda of what I do for a living, I build Hotrods.

swaybar020.jpg
 
Last edited:

Redline

Likes to Drive and Ride
x3 !!!

I would do the axles and gears first. Swapping to a V8 is a much more complex and expensive endeavor during which you will learn to hate the smog referees. And even with a V8, stock gears with oversize tires may still be a problem, hence my recommendation that you start with gears. You may find that proper gears with a rebuilt (and upgraded) 4.0 is a better option.
 

rain76king

Adventurer
I have the 4.0 in my Jeep, manual, with 35's and stock gearing. My trailer weighs between 1500-2000 lbs. Regearing is high on the priority list. Most of the time I am in 4th gear on the freeway. When going up grades it is slow going.

I hear ya, my m416 loaded with my rtt makes my jeep cherokee 4.0 work hard on hills!
 

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