HID Upgrade w/o projectors?

[xcmountain80]

Gentlemen,

I have been going over this time and time again, the 3rd Gen 4Runner has excellent light coverage from it's headlights. Like most halogen bulbs it leave a bit to be desired. I'm using the IPF X4 Fatboy ultra low beam (which I love) but wander if there isn't just a little more light available w/o altering my housings with projectors (yes that is possible). I was looking on genuine Phillips 35w 4500K kits on ebay that are plug and play with the H4 adapter. I'm not interested in anything over 5000k and certainly not a 55w system for regular vehicle lights. I envision a 35w system utilizing the same beam pattern but just brighter, is that the right line of thinking?

Thank you

 

[seanz0rz]

its what im using. the 99+ housings are better for HID because of the clearer lenses.

ddm tuning sells great low priced kits. google for them.

 

[Cackalak Han]

Please don't do this. You most likely won't be able to get a good cut off line, which means either blinding oncoming drivers or not getting enough light output. Also, this is very illegal to do. Are you really not getting enough light from the stock units? Ive had stock halogen and HID systems and while HID was brighter, i had no trouble seeing with halogens.

If you must get the pos plug n play kits, 4200 is as close to white, which means the brightest. Which means it's brighter than the 5,000k you're planning to get. Those 8,000-10,000 kits are in most cases have LESS output than halogens.

 

[xcmountain80]

I'm mote interested in the folks who have tried this with a similar rig. I'm looking into the 4300k Philips kit. Yes I could use more light on the ground. When you say illegal, exactly what do you mean? Like the kind of illegal where i'm running my LF 240's on the interstate? Or like the DOT book says no? I've gotten past the idea of upgrading my wiring harness and jumping into a higher wattage bulb. You'd have to know the 4runner housings to know what the light pattern is like, if it's more like in the same pattern that's great! I'm not sure why the light pattern geometry changes with the bulb as the point of illumination is the same.

A

 

[Hill Bill E.]

Please don't do this. You most likely won't be able to get a good cut off line, which means either blinding oncoming drivers .

There are some kits that are bad with the cut off, but not all.

I replaced mine ('99 XJ) kept the same housings, and used a true Hi/Low HID bulb.

It's one bulb (per housing), but the bulb has a solenoid that moves the bulb into 'Hi' beam position. (if it fails, it goes into/stays in Low beam)

I have great cut off, and don't blind others, or melt the dash board of small cars when I pull up behind them.

I had the 'single' HID beam, and it was bad (same housings) Even adjusted all the way down towards the ground, they blinded oncoming traffic.

I haven't had any problems with mine in the 4 years since I installed them, and it's my DD.

 

[CYi5]

Read through this thread. If you're going to do it, do it right with a projector. They have plug 'n play projectors now that you just have to bake the lens off to put it inside.

 

[nucktaco]

i just installed a set of ddm hids in my taco last night. the light output it amazing compared to the stock pos lights. i went 3000 for my fogs and 4500 for my heads. for both kits including shipping was $100.

:victory:

 

[Antichrist]

Illegal means there is no way to install HID parts in to a headlight housing designed for Halogen bulbs and not violate NHTSA laws. That means for all states, whether or not any state laws specifically address HID.

Even if the kits say DOT on them they are still illegal because the DOT doesn't do any certification for such things. a "DOT" label just means the mfg is saying it meet DOTs regs, which is not possible for such conversions.

 

[xcmountain80]

i just installed a set of ddm hids in my taco last night. the light output it amazing compared to the stock pos lights. i went 3000 for my fogs and 4500 for my heads. for both kits including shipping was $100.

:victory:

I'm assuming your not using projectors?


With everyone telling me that these housings aren't designed for HID use it begs the question, what the heck is the difference. A light source is a light source, the light source is in the same position the current bulb is and the only difference is a brighter light source. Does HID somehow avoid the laws of physics and warp or wrap around my shields? From an engineering standpoint I cannot see how a brighter Halogen (or exotic gas (like I use)) bulb would vary from HID (a quality unit of some cost). Light is light no matter how you come to posses it. While an unfair comparison when upgrading a LF 240, 170, or 140 to HID from 100w Halogen the beam is generally unaffected but the output increases.

A

 

[Antichrist]

I'm assuming your not using projectors?


With everyone telling me that these housings aren't designed for HID use it begs the question, what the heck is the difference. A light source is a light source, the light source is in the same position the current bulb is and the only difference is a brighter light source.

No. Not all light sources are created equal. It is the laws of physics that is actually the reason they are illegal.
Here's a good explanation of the difference.
http://www.danielsternlighting.com/tech/bulbs/Hid/conversions/conversions.html

 

[JeepTreeHouse]

Man, I have the ddm 4500 hi/low kit in my 01 4runner... and I say go for it.... Its nice to not have the stock, dim halogen headlights, that leave aot to be desired.

Legality is really not a concern because the cutoff is good enough to not blind drivers, and give you good light output in a normal low beam pattern. There won't be any police officers pulling you over for your headlights unless you use the standard h4 kit wich is kind of like all time high beams.

Believe me, police most everywhere have alot better things to do than pull you over for headlights and go through a serious check on the legality of your pretty well thought out HID conversion.

Just do it. You'll be happy with the results.

 

[LaOutbackTrail]

I didnt read everyone's response to this, but thought I might add my experience.

My knowledge is strictly related to the install of an HID kit on a motorcycle headlight.

The biggest difference that I found, and should be the case with all of the HID conversions is the added length of the bulb and its mounting. For instance, the HID bulb was nearly 1.5 inches longer than the H3 or H4 (hard to remember now) bulb that it replaced. This puts the light projection at a different geometry all together.

If you find that your HID bulb replacement is infact the same dimension in all aspects, it should not alter the beam, only give you brighter output!

 

[Antichrist]

Believe me, police most everywhere have alot better things to do than pull you over for headlights and go through a serious check on the legality of your pretty well thought out HID conversion.

I'm sure you're correct about the police.
But if you're involved in an accident that's attributed to someone being blinded because of your headlights, which has happened, your insurance company might have something to say about you knowingly installing something that's illegal and a hazard to other drivers.

Aside from other drivers, many kits actually provide poorer lighting to the driver, despite the appearance of it being better. This is because they provide more foreground lighting, which is not what you want for headlights, because it decreases your ability to see things in the distance.

I didnt read everyone's response to this, but thought I might add my experience.
snip
If you find that your HID bulb replacement is infact the same dimension in all aspects, it should not alter the beam, only give you brighter output!

Since you're saying that, you should go back and read post 10, because it does in fact change the light pattern.

 

[LaOutbackTrail]

Since you're saying that, you should go back and read post 10, because it does in fact change the light pattern.

A good point of information, that I would agree with.

"And, as with all other automotive lamps (and, in fact, all optical instruments), the optics are calculated based not just on where the light source is within the lamp (focal length) but also the specific photometric characteristics of the light source...which parts of it are brighter, which parts of it are darker, where the boundaries of the light source are, whether the boundaries are sharp or fuzzy, the shape of the light source, and so forth."

 

[AxeAngel]

Wait till you have oncoming traffic throw on their brights because they think you are doing the same. Wait till a cop stops you on a rural road for having illegal lights.

Ask me how i know. I have 4 sets(8 lights) of forward facing HIDs, it wasnt a fun night for me, this was coming back from a night rally on a very very rural road with a truck that doesnt see a lot of daily driving. When it is in town, all lenses are covered.

-Sam